Thoughts On "why Isn't Software Done"/'i Payed... I Ex

[Xenu]

I don't know how some people got the idea that the os and all other software would work perfectly and would be fully matured. No one has said that, on the contrary all the developers has stated again and again that this is a WIP-gadget. Most of us think this is a positive thing since no one knows what amazing software will be developed in the comming years. I'm really excited and I think most of us are. Although I sure would prefer that wifi worked when I get the device, I'm sure it will be fixed in a relative short time.

I wonder how many threads will pop up with people bitching about "I have paid more than $300, fix my bloody Pandora so I can watch my pr0n in HD or I'll kick your teeth in"?

 

[mali]

I find it interesting how thin everyone's skin has gotten by now :huh:

The criticism was minimal compared to previous situations. Some of you, the OP Team included, should watch a funny cartoon from time to time and primal scream therapy does wonders too, I've heard. I understand that the nagging over such a long period and getting little sleep is eating your soul, but try to stay positive Or give me your soul's order number and I'll look into it.

Love!

 

[EdCa22]

A little not exactly on topic, but I've just seen a post for this on Engadget, and with Linux drivers, the promise of a very large range, and price of $35 it doesn't look bad at all. I am wondering if the specs of

Power Consumption:
Transmit: around 380mA
Receiver: around 250mA

Means it will use more than 500mA for any length of time while browing the web. (Making it incompatible with Pandora)



Back on topic, I didn't expect everything to be working perfectly on launch anyway. A month after the 4000 are out we should have a much more polished system which is more than nearly any device can claim, with all the huge patches and bugfixes that come out months and years into their lives. But I don't think OP should be sending units to Engadget until that happens.

Just seen WHAT on engadget? Some USB wireless stick?

 

[kev187]

Soooo......

I understand its a hack product, I understand the bugs being sorted out... no big deal

But Please tell me that at some point, there is an understanding that the WIFI will be 100% at some point once its sorted... right?

I am using it to have aroud the house to cruise the web & check email on & to use for travel at wifi hotspots.

I am patient, just want to ensure its "going" to work eventually & not some flaw?

I am not a coder by the way... just a veteran video gamer & technology geek who uses a nice polished system on my Apple Computer :-D I am about to build a ubuntu system though... learning

 

[BaDToaD]

If I were you, Craig,ED etc I'd wait until a considerable chunk of the Pandora first batch is out there, 500-1000 units and then approach TI for some help on the WiFi FOC. After all this will be a hell of a free ad campaign for the OMAP chipset. The Pandora has had a lot of coverage already but once the first batch is out there interest is going to be huge. TI can only benefit from that too and things will look a lot better for them if the WiFi is working.

ToaD

 

[EvilDragon]

But Please tell me that at some point, there is an understanding that the WIFI will be 100% at some point once its sorted... right?

Yes, it will be
First we were fearing it might be hardware as well, that was when the drivers weren't working. The drivers ARE now working. It's the SDIO bus that's making trouble at the moment, and as notaz pointed out, that's on the other OMAP systems as well, so it's not a driver issue.

For a better understanding:
To achieve WiFi, you need multiple things:
1) A driver that knows how to talk to the WiFi module. That's what did cost DJWillis a lot of his time and he got it to work.
2) Some way that the SoC can communicate to the WiFi module. This can be USB, it can be SDIO. USB is working nice, but SDIO is pretty new and therefore still buggy in the Linux world. We're using SDIO, and that needs to be fixed.

 

[WoD]

Count me a very grateful fan. If you're not, with things just as they are, then I think you can still get your money back. Otherwise, just stop whining, for chrissake.

Amen to that, I had reservations about posting a "positive" thread to counter the negative one, but I'm not going to complain that you've done it. It's not that I have something fundamentally against negativity, but the whiners simply don't "get it" and are spreading unfounded negativity like it's going out of fashion.

The team behind the Pandora deserve more praise and thanks than we can ever personally give them, but as a community we can work together to ensure that software IS up to scratch, and that the Pandora is adequately promoted and that it has a chance to sell for many years to come. If people spent half the time they do whining on these forums actually learning to program, helping out, or even taking part in the community in a vaguely positive way then it would be better for us all.

Sadly, the community is poisoned with overly vocal whining newbies who probably jumped over from playing pirated games on the PSP/DS, and leeching other people's open firmware/emulators in a big, seething mess of whining unappreciative teenage angst. I think they're a small minority, fortunately, at least I hope they are... but they don't seem to want to shut up.

 

[mali]

Sadly, the community is poisoned with overly vocal whining newbies who probably jumped over from playing pirated games on the PSP/DS, and leeching other people's open firmware/emulators in a big, seething mess of whining unappreciative teenage angst. I think they're a small minority, fortunately, at least I hope they are... but they don't seem to want to shut up.

Which dughole are you from? Better get up to date first before insulting people. Stop whining and spreading nonsense.

 

[WoD]

Which dughole are you from? Better get up to date first before insulting people. Stop whining and spreading nonsense.

I'm whining about whiners, I have a well developed sense of hypocrisy. Go back to your PSP, it's cold and alone.

Also bumpety bump bump bump bump the positivity baby! Those goddamned whiner threads have shot to the top of the forums *again*

*sigh*

 

[mali]

I'm whining about whiners, I have a well developed sense of hypocrisy.

True that. Btw, I don't own any gaming handhelds. You should go for a walk from time to time to see how the world evolved outside

 

[Masterfurbix]

...overly vocal whining newbies who probably jumped over from playing pirated games on the PSP/DS, and leeching other people's open firmware/emulators in a big, seething mess of whining unappreciative teenage angst.

You're hitting alarmingly close to home here; it makes me consider wearing my tinfoil hat more often.


Also, what's the big fuss? I just pre-ordered a month ago, so I guess I can't connect with the long-term bitching and complaints, but things like this take TIME anyone can see that.

 

[WoD]

I'm whining about whiners, I have a well developed sense of hypocrisy.

True that. Btw, I don't own any gaming handhelds. You should go for a walk from time to time to see how the world evolved outside

Outside? Is that a new fad or something? Doesn't sound very exciting... what about Xside or Xtremeout, or Outxtream? Or 0UTS1D3? It's clear outside needs an edgy rebranding, and maybe more flair.

 

[fusion_power]

We did actually hire someone who was ex-TI to get those wifi drivers working, thousands of dollars later and we had... nothing. And he fucked off.

So even if you try that route, it does not always work.

Ouch, thats hard. Next time you better pay the people only after they've done their job. I hope TI has more skilled people than him, otherwise we know now, why there are so many Problems with the OMAP Chipset.

I work on these sorts of driver issues for a living. If I'd managed to get a Pandora dev machine 6 months ago I'm pretty sure we'd have working WLan drivers. I know, I know, its not so easy .. but believe me, neither is getting IEGBE network drivers on Tolapai working, and thats been my day job.

That said, when I get my Pandora's, I'm going to help as much as I can. Its just a matter of having enough people out there with actual hardware to work on the problem - as soon as there is at least 50 of us with real Pandora's, many of these problems will fade away .. as we have seen, time and again so far, in cases like with squeezix and notaz and so on ..

Great, you tell this NOW... :lol:
I'm sure, you will straight recieve a Pandora (bare board or what's available at this time) if you really can solve the WiFi issues.

 

[Vlynndar]

Spoiler

I'm whining about whiners, I have a well developed sense of hypocrisy.

True that. Btw, I don't own any gaming handhelds. You should go for a walk from time to time to see how the world evolved outside

Outside? Is that a new fad or something? Doesn't sound very exciting... what about Xside or Xtremeout, or Outxtream? Or 0UTS1D3? It's clear outside needs an edgy rebranding, and maybe more flair.

Yea, but iNdoors is just... More polished. All the cool kids are iNdoors.

It's very closed, though. Not open at all.

 

[kev187]

But Please tell me that at some point, there is an understanding that the WIFI will be 100% at some point once its sorted... right?

Yes, it will be
First we were fearing it might be hardware as well, that was when the drivers weren't working. The drivers ARE now working. It's the SDIO bus that's making trouble at the moment, and as notaz pointed out, that's on the other OMAP systems as well, so it's not a driver issue.

For a better understanding:
To achieve WiFi, you need multiple things:
1) A driver that knows how to talk to the WiFi module. That's what did cost DJWillis a lot of his time and he got it to work.
2) Some way that the SoC can communicate to the WiFi module. This can be USB, it can be SDIO. USB is working nice, but SDIO is pretty new and therefore still buggy in the Linux world. We're using SDIO, and that needs to be fixed.

 

[WoD]

Everything will be 100%, or close as we're going to get sooner or later. And it'll go all the faster if you find a way to help, even if it's just bug reporting (in a constructive and structured manner)!

 

[Jourdy288]

Spoiler

I'm whining about whiners, I have a well developed sense of hypocrisy.

True that. Btw, I don't own any gaming handhelds. You should go for a walk from time to time to see how the world evolved outside

Outside? Is that a new fad or something? Doesn't sound very exciting... what about Xside or Xtremeout, or Outxtream? Or 0UTS1D3? It's clear outside needs an edgy rebranding, and maybe more flair.

Yea, but iNdoors is just... More polished. All the cool kids are iNdoors.

It's very closed, though. Not open at all.

 

[WoD]

Wifi might not work, but I've got a data dongle that...err... maybe will?

 

[Dead1nside]

Good to know we've got further expertise in this area Torpor. I'm sure a lot of things will get sorted out in good time, after release.

 

[mduffor]

From my point of view watching the Pandora development over the past couple of years (and the angry threads as of late), it really just looks like standard Open Source development to me. You start with lofty plans, reality kicks you around along the way, some people make promises and then flake out on you, lots of people work hard quietly behind the scenes, some (hopefully entertaining) flamewars break out, all of the gory details are laid out before the community which cause some people to cry that the sky is falling whenever something goes wrong, but in the end something cool comes out the other end of the whole messy process.

If you are used to closed-box proprietary development, then seeing what goes on behind the scenes can be worrisome. If you are used to open development, you just shrug your shoulders and say "eh, it happens" and keep on working on it until it works.

I want to say Thanks to the entire OP team and community that has taken everything this far, and will continue to take it to great places in the future.

In the meantime, I'll just continue coding on my 800x480 resolution game on my Linux laptop, and watch "the Pandora development show" patiently while I wait for physical units to become available.

Cheers,
Michael