Someone's Dissing The Gp2x!!!!

[Alex.]

Umm, I don't see how that slur programers' efforts. Also, didnt nintendo patent emulators that emulate their systems thereby making all non official nintendo emulators illegal?

At first he said that the only decent homebrew was Noiz2sa, thus dismissing the efforts of so many other coders, and then he began to rag on emulators without taking into account the massive amount of work that programmers put into them, and that some people may want both homebrew and emulation.

Emulation is legal, legal, legal. Nintendo's emulation patents are intimidation-ware at best.

- Alex

 

[invinciblegod]

This sort of shows that some people in this community aren't very mature. Just because someone doesn't like the GP2X doesn't mean that people should call him an idiot. Also, I remember reading somewhere that even if you own a copy, it is illegal to download it because you are only entitled to your copy so you can only make a copy of your copy instead of downloading someone elses copy. I'm not sure if thats true or not though. Regardless, if everyone started flaming people for posting unpositive reviews, everyone will think the gp2x people are stupid (sort of like how some people refer to PS2-gamecube-xbox-psp-ds-ipod-mac-windows fanboys as stupid zealots who can't see flaws in the product that they like so much). Also, I searched the article and there was no mention of it being "a failure." I believe most of his complaints are valid except for the fact that's its only been a few months and there arent that many commercial or homebrew games yet. You sort of have to wait longer for that to happen.

Oh and I found the nintendo emulator patent:
http://www.planetgamecube.com/newsArt.cfm?...589891342B61AB5

 

[drodd]

My boss, Tim, has written an article critical of the GP2X scene in his website articles section, at www.timsrecordlabel.com.

Because of this I'm starting my own website so I don't have to operate under his banner. My new website is under construction but you can view it at www.thebooboo.com

I think that Tim's point was that the widespread use of stolen IP on the GP2X undermines the efforts of legitimate homebrew developers.

Not that I agree with him. He's a total flat tire!

The point is: HOW MANY people who download roms for emulators own the original games? Especially in the case of more obscure systems such as PC Engine, Neo Geo and Arcade machines? MAME GP2X has over 15,000 downloads, to be fair some of them are repeat downloads so let's say 5,000. So therefore are there 5,000 GP2X owners, each with a house full of original arcade machines legally downloading them to play?

Tim's question, not mine.

Didn't you start this thread to *complain* about "your boss's" article? And now you're complaining that people are criticizing it? Sorry, not biting.

Tim, aka TheBooBoo, you don't have to invent another persona to get attention. Good luck with your game programming, though.

 

[gamefan999]

Oh and I found the nintendo emulator patent:
http://www.planetgamecube.com/newsArt.cfm?...589891342B61AB5

Patented emulation? That sounds absurd. At best, they could only put a patent on the specific code they used to achieve their emulation. Another set of software instructions to achieve the same end could not be considered as copyright infringement, I would think. It sounds far more like a method for the big N to get *into* the courts, and waste as much time and money of the coders as possible, before being found without merit and being thrown out. That bullying business tactic is as old as money and the courts. Besisdes it would only work against programmers who sought to profit from their emulators, I would imagine. ;^)


Some extra info here, RE the original thread, anyway %^)
Not too much more needs to be said about "Tim" and his employee after witnessing this -

"The Best Game EVER
Click here and prepare yourself for the best gaming experience in history EVER"
http://secure.dnsuk.co.uk/~trlmscom/game6....c12a38b6ca8f6d8

By all means *do* click that link, BTW, you'll be missing out on so much if you don't.

 

[Wite_Noiz]

At first he said that the only decent homebrew was Noiz2sa, thus dismissing the efforts of so many other coders, and then he began to rag on emulators without taking into account the massive amount of work that programmers put into them, and that some people may want both homebrew and emulation.

Emulation is legal, legal, legal. Nintendo's emulation patents are intimidation-ware at best.

- Alex

(IANAL) Actually, it's a pretty grey-area legally. Just because no one (as far as I'm aware) has been taken to court for it, doesn't mean it's legal.

Copying your own CDs and DVDs became illegal in many countries over the last few years because the courts decided that the classic "personal backup" argument no longer applies to digital media (their theory was that CDs are not as volatile a medium as audio cassettes).
I realise it's a terrible way to back up a case, but I can't find the articles on it anymore - I'll try looking later, when I have some time.

From reading Nintendo's stance on the matter (http://www.nintendo.com/corp/faqs/legal.html), I think they hold patents on the ROM chip inside each cart and the binary format, making it illegal to copy or emulate either.
But don't quote me on that.

 

[Magnulus]

If you ask me, games should have a lower threshhold for when they go "Public Domain" than books and films, since they have a much more limited time of relevance. I think games should have a PD threshhold of about twenty years. Maybe that's just me, but I don't think that's unfair. Do you see the general populace paying money for Metal Gear Solid 3 in 2025, when all games are played by plugging a series of needles into your eyeball and nerve centre?

 

[thebooboo]

OK, here's a hypothetical example of a negative side-effect of emulation.

Imagine you're a software company. Not a big one, say you are the size of Psygnosis before they were bought out. You are in financial trouble and want to release one of your Playstation games as a commercial GP2X game to boost profits. However, you can't because everyone's already playing it on their psx emulators. You are then bought by Sony and forced to make all your games PSP exclusive.

Here is a hypothetical example of a positive side-effect of emulation.

A guy with no money but lots of talent draws inspiration from a forgotten arcade classic that he downloaded for free on his GP2X. Inspired he makes a similar game which goes on to be a world-conquering barn-stormer and leads to him becoming king of the games industry.

Also, I suppose you could argue that a lot of the leading lights of the game industry started out by cracking commercial titles for machines like the Amiga and doing "cracktros" etc.

Plus a lot of 3D artists trained themselves on cracked copies of 3DS max, Softimage etc...

So, like Tim said, a LITTLE BIT of piracy can be good for the industry. A LOT of piracy can be very damaging.

 

[Radek]

At first he said that the only decent homebrew was Noiz2sa, thus dismissing the efforts of so many other coders, and then he began to rag on emulators without taking into account the massive amount of work that programmers put into them, and that some people may want both homebrew and emulation.

Emulation is legal, legal, legal. Nintendo's emulation patents are intimidation-ware at best.

- Alex

(IANAL) Actually, it's a pretty grey-area legally. Just because no one (as far as I'm aware) has been taken to court for it, doesn't mean it's legal.

And we can say the same in a reverse - it doesn't mean it's not legal.

Copying your own CDs and DVDs became illegal in many countries over the last few years because the courts decided that the classic "personal backup" argument no longer applies to digital media (their theory was that CDs are not as volatile a medium as audio cassettes).
I realise it's a terrible way to back up a case, but I can't find the articles on it anymore - I'll try looking later, when I have some time.

Well... laws do change all the time. What wasn't accepted 30 years ago is now. What is accepted now might not be after 30 years. How laws are changing it's a very complicated matter as well. How effectively laws can be executed is an another.

From reading Nintendo's stance on the matter (http://www.nintendo.com/corp/faqs/legal.html), I think they hold patents on the ROM chip inside each cart and the binary format, making it illegal to copy or emulate either.
But don't quote me on that.

Was there a precedence in a court? If not then Nintendo can claim anything. Even if you imagine the Mario in your mind your are doing a copyright infringement.

 

[Ranma13]

Reverse engineering any hardware is legal. What isn't legal is taking already-written and copyrighted code to emulate something. Since most emulators are reverse engineered, they are considered to be legal. However, their most practical application is an illegal activity. It's like owning a gun, which is legal, but then using it to shoot someone, which is illegal.

 

[Alex.]

Copying your own CDs and DVDs became illegal in many countries over the last few years because the courts decided that the classic "personal backup" argument no longer applies to digital media (their theory was that CDs are not as volatile a medium as audio cassettes).
I realise it's a terrible way to back up a case, but I can't find the articles on it anymore - I'll try looking later, when I have some time.

Do you actually believe and stand for what you're saying? If I buy a CD, then it's my copy, and I'm entitled to use it as I see fit. Just because a couple of DRM twats exert pretend-intimidation does not mean that they have any authority or valid points.

- Alex

 

[jmetal88]

Copying your own CDs and DVDs became illegal in many countries over the last few years because the courts decided that the classic "personal backup" argument no longer applies to digital media (their theory was that CDs are not as volatile a medium as audio cassettes).

I like S.A.D. Music's stance on backup copies:

 

[thebooboo]

Oh and I found the nintendo emulator patent:
http://www.planetgamecube.com/newsArt.cfm?...589891342B61AB5

Patented emulation? That sounds absurd. At best, they could only put a patent on the specific code they used to achieve their emulation. Another set of software instructions to achieve the same end could not be considered as copyright infringement, I would think. It sounds far more like a method for the big N to get *into* the courts, and waste as much time and money of the coders as possible, before being found without merit and being thrown out. That bullying business tactic is as old as money and the courts. Besisdes it would only work against programmers who sought to profit from their emulators, I would imagine. ;^)


Some extra info here, RE the original thread, anyway %^)
Not too much more needs to be said about "Tim" and his employee after witnessing this -

"The Best Game EVER
Click here and prepare yourself for the best gaming experience in history EVER"
http://secure.dnsuk.co.uk/~trlmscom/game6....c12a38b6ca8f6d8

By all means *do* click that link, BTW, you'll be missing out on so much if you don't.

Please, somebody tell me they understand the irony of this bit of the site. I mean, I'm not seriously saying it's the best game ever. You do understand that, right?

 

[Alex.]

Copyright © 2006 by Tim Diggle aka The Booboo

Case solved by Sherlock.

- Alex

 

[gamefan999]

Copyright © 2006 by Tim Diggle aka The Booboo

Case solved by Sherlock.

- Alex

Well done! But don't you mean by "Dan the Crimebustin' Frog"?!!? lol, eew.

 

[Yono]

Copyright © 2006 by Tim Diggle aka The Booboo

Case solved by Sherlock.

- Alex

But it wasn't him, his account was hacked!!! :lol: