Justin Carter - Freedom of Speech

[vcoleiro1]

Whats happening in America these days when a kid like Justin Carter can't make a stupid joke without being arrested and thrown in jail  - now for several months.

IF you are not familiar with the story. Here's a transcript of what he did

Justin Carter was arguing about the video game League of Legends when someone had said something on Facebook to the effect of 'Oh you're insane, you're crazy, you're messed up in the head,’" 

To which Justin replied 'Oh yeah, I'm real messed up in the head, I'm going to go shoot up a school full of kids and eat their still, beating hearts,’ and the next two lines were 'lol and jk' [all sic]."

A Canadain Women complained and he was arrested and thrown in jail and has been there since March.  He is facing up to 10 years of jail for this , recently he was offered a deal of 8 years.  He is now on Suicide watch in Jail.

If you are going to lock up kids for making stupid comment like this , then the jail's are going to be full over there.  You can start by locking up 90% of kids on Xbox Live who say shit like this every day.

You know, you see some countries and the freedoms they are denied and you think, imagine living there. Looks like the US is soon becoming one of those places.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/03/teen-jailed-facebook-comment-justin-carter-suicide-watch_n_3542770.html

https://www.youtube.com/embed/5XCtkG1hXNE?feature=oembed

 

[EssoAir]

Well, not that its anything close to ok for him to be in jail for this, but if he hadnt made a the joke so public (I.e. public facebook post) then it wouldnt be an issue. Its not like the government used their NSA knowItAll skills to track this guy down. A woman had to complain in order tl draw attention to it. If he had said that joke in confidence (like IEC or Ventrillo) then it wouldnt have been noticed by that woman or anyone else who doesnt know what a joke is.


again, not that it justifies my government's actions, but its not like the kid is completely innocent.

 

[vcoleiro1]

You mean like the 10,000 similiar jokes per minute made by kids on Xbox Live.

 

[EssoAir]

Correct! Again, while they are not harmful, they should be limited to controled, nonpublic environments. Thats something you might saybto your friend, but not to write on a picket sign and stand out in public. Im fully aware that a basic right as an american is freedom of speech, but the modern interpretation of that right is "freedom of speech so long as no histeria os created" Its actually illegal to yell "I have a bomb" whoke in an airport. You may not have a bomb, but you cab cause hysteria and thats not ok.

 

[vcoleiro1]

There's a massive difference between this and someone standing in a theatre and yelling bomb.  

Then there is the definition of public  . What would you define as public and private., You know what , scrap that, it would make no difference with the NSA snooping anyway . Private or Public

 

[ghostpatch]

That boy is stupid. A punishment maybe but jail? no

people start forgetting what they post is public. I bet he wasn't aware of it in the spur of the moment.

 

[vcoleiro1]

^ The thing is, he's arrest has nothing to do with what he said being public or not.  As long as the law saw it , he's open to be arrested.  It could have been picked up over a private phone call, no doubt the NSA look for these kind of these things in their taps.

The point is, kids say this sort of stupid thing all the time with no intent.   These Anti terrorist laws are blind and without common sense , that's the problem.  

 

[Askarus]

I don't see any reason why this guy should be arrested or punished.

He didn't even offend anyone.

Why did they arrest them?

What's the paragraphs and laws behind it?

Is he a threatening for people?

 

[elwing]

I guess my constant cynism and irony should worth me quite a few years of imprisonment... guess I'dd better avoid traveling to the US, NSA is surely waiting for me...

 

[ekianjo]

again, not that it justifies my government's actions, but its not like the kid is completely innocent.

Which crime is being punished here then ?

 

[Asiyura]

10 years (reduced to 8) for a really bad and not funny joke about things that can and did happen in his country…

Isn't this a "bit" overreacting?

I mean, If a little boy say this kind of thing, he should be sent to his room without phone/television/computer/tablet/console to read some selected books and get a bit smarter in the process. If he is old enough to be thrown in jail, a hundred hours of community service would probably have put some understanding in his brain, but even that is a bit overboard IMHO.

 

[ghostpatch]

^ right

Which crime is being punished here then ?

ten years... sounds like homicide or hacking 

@ vcoleiro

I agree but I don't think they are doing this because of the fear of terror. Its all economic interests and control. For example ts sick how they used 9/11 to establish the patriot act.

 

[ekianjo]

American citizens, it's sad but you are being stripped off your most basic rights. 


I was very disappointed to see how few people gathered yesterday for the "restore the fourth" demonstrations around the country. Seems like nobody cares. 

The most direct way to a police state is apathy. It's working very well, and makes you wonder what's next.  

 

[Klumpen]

You know, you see some countries and the freedoms they are denied and you think, imagine living there. Looks like the US is soon becoming one of those places.

It already is and I am wondering, how nearly nobody there has noticed when it became that,

well some people have and they again have been succesfully declared as paranoid, insane and stupid guys with their conspiracy theorys.

 

[Askarus]

^

Everything's better in Germany.

If the police wants to catch you just go on the Autobahn and escape with 250 Km/h speed .

Oh no, now I'll lose my driving license if I buy a fast car.

 

[Fzero]

Sounds about as fair as our own justice system ... which is an effing joke

 

[iprice]

There were some great political statements made in the film RoboCop, one of which says something like "America, land of the free. Except NOTHING is free."

In this age of "digital freedom" we forget that nothing we do or say is completely free - whether in real life or online. Someone somewhere can all too easily take offense and the results may lead to the unimaginable.

 

[WizardStan]

Which crime is being punished here then ?

Threats of violence, violation of other peoples right to safety. I forget the exact wording of the law but basically if you threaten me and I have any reason to believe that you might actually go through with the threat that is a violation of my rights to safety.There are several levels of "rights". In the USA (at least in theory) you have the right to say whatever you want. But you also have the right to be safe (also in theory). When these two rights directly oppose each other (the classic example is shouting "fire" in a crowded building, causing a stampede and injuries) the right to safety is more important than the right to speech.

This kid made a public threat and someone had reason to believe that he might go through with that threat. The police acted exactly as they should have in the situation up until the point of arrest. He should have been brought in for questioning, but those questions should have revealed that he was just a stupid kid making a stupid joke: no harm was done, no actual possibility of harm. He sits in a waiting room for a few hours, the police drill into his head that jokes like that aren't funny and they don't have time to waste chasing "bad jokes" when there are legitimately messed up kids thinking about going through with these things, kid learns a lesson, everyone goes home wiser.

Why the hell he's still in prison is beyond me.

This reminds me of another case. A couple took some pictures of their kids being cute in the bath and took them to be developed. The person running the pictures saw "naked babies!" and called the police for pedophilia. I never had a problem with the action of the photo person, when you see something suspicious the right course of action is to always report it. The proper authorities have the training to look for things that you and I don't. The police are called, they look at the pictures, talk to the family, realize that the pictures are entirely innocent baby pictures, and everyone goes back to their business. Instead what happened was the kids were taken away and the parents were indeed charged with pedophilia until after a long legal battle someone finally said "this is STUPID" and overturned the entire thing.

I just don't get it. I know for a fact that The System has more important things to deal with than these obviously benign complaints. The only thing I can think of is that sometimes the DA gets personal on it for whatever reason (politics, family, who knows) and pushes the case beyond what it should have been. There's not enough transparency to figure out who messed up, but someone definitely messed up.

 

[skeezix]

The US is in a bad spot right now.

It wasn't that long ago people were trying to escape Moscow and get to the US ... and now its the other way around for seemingly decent acts.

Its bound to happen, but now we will see what has become of a once great and proud nation; will they realize their folly, or will it continue down the darkest road. Papers please! They fought against this very concept no tlong ago...

Honestly, makes me worry about taking vacations to the US :/

jeff

 

[skeezix]

I don't use cloud back up or any of that crap, but how long until someone snaps pics of their own babies and some automated software on a cloud server somewhere turns them into the cops? That day is coming. Its bullshit.

What is really sad is this occurred to me; we've been so oppressed in mindshare the last few years, that reaching for a camera in our own homes is something we have to question if we'll get in trouble for :/

This reminds me of another case. A couple took some pictures of their kids being cute in the bath and took them to be developed. The person running the pictures saw "naked babies!" and called the police for pedophilia. I never had a problem with the action of the photo person, when you see something suspicious the right course of action is to always report it. The proper authorities have the training to look for things that you and I don't. The police are called, they look at the pictures, talk to the family, realize that the pictures are entirely innocent baby pictures, and everyone goes back to their business. Instead what happened was the kids were taken away and the parents were indeed charged with pedophilia until after a long legal battle someone finally said "this is STUPID" and overturned the entire thing.