Excited About Linux (aka "Pandora Native" ?) Games

[sam fisher]

I disagree. A lot of really good games that were made for systems like nintendo, SNES, N64, and PSX were made by teams of people who were able to put many more man hours into a game than the usual single homebrew coder. The complexity and length of these games is usually greater than the average homebrew game. Yes, a game designed for the hardware has the potential to run much better and utilize the hardware much better, but this doesn't mean the gameplay is going to be as good as an emulated game. Porting an already fun game is much easier than starting from nothing and creating an equally fun game.

-my 2 cents

It's not how big the team is that counts but how dedicated and skilled the members of the team are.

 

[chad78]

I don't know why people do not see the potential in original software as much as ports or emulators... the Pandora is a very powerful piece of hardware. Rather than running something that is by nature inefficient (such as emulation) or ports from open source games, I think that original content designed FOR the hardware has the best potential to shine.
A couple of points have been clearly expressed already, so I won't belabor them, but I will repeat them, because I'm OCD like that.

• Games that can be played on emulators were made by large teams of full time paid professionals, and even though they obviously can't take full advantage of the hardware, they often end up being deeper and more polished than homebrew games
• Games that can be played on emulators are familiar - everyone has games from their childhood (even if that childhood isn't quite over yet) that they love, and being able to haul these classic around on this awesome device is something to fawn over
• There are a freak-ton (that's an offical measurement of volume, btw - look it up!) of games for the freak-ton of systems that will most likely run on this system. The volume of priase for these games is logically somehow related the the volume of the library.
• Emulated Games ... um... Exist. That's not to say that there are no homebrew games, but, as of yet - there are zero homebrew games for the Pandora (which, obviously, is because the Pandora doesn't yet exist). It's far easier to go on about a game that exists than the potential for a game that Schoreider's Cat is confused about. I can't say how much I love playing "Strawman Homebrew Bros. 3" because I don't know anything about it. It could change my life forever, or it could suck. I don't know because I haven't played it, I haven't read any reviews, and neither has anyone else - because it's not yet a reality.

You could argue that we're all (well, many of us) excited about a device that is just as waveformy at this point - the difference is, we have seen videos of prototypes. We've been given descriptions. It's features have been discussed at length. In other words, we know stuff about it. There aren't many (any?) Pandora-native original homebrew games that have been discussed to any great detail.

If you know of one / some - please share the knowledge!

 

[Trip]

I disagree. A lot of really good games that were made for systems like nintendo, SNES, N64, and PSX were made by teams of people who were able to put many more man hours into a game than the usual single homebrew coder. The complexity and length of these games is usually greater than the average homebrew game. Yes, a game designed for the hardware has the potential to run much better and utilize the hardware much better, but this doesn't mean the gameplay is going to be as good as an emulated game. Porting an already fun game is much easier than starting from nothing and creating an equally fun game.

-my 2 cents

It's not how big the team is that counts but how dedicated and skilled the members of the team are.

Got to agree!
Some of my favourite games were written for the Amiga by (at the time) small teams of very dedicated people who worked their arses off to make the the best games possible. Not just for the money, but for the sheer hell of it. How do you think game companies like the Bitmap-Brothers originally started out?

I love homebrew games as much as the next guy but I don't game that much and would rather spend what little time I have to do it playing a quality completed game made for another system, than a homebrew title that's designed for the Pandora but may never be finished and that won't offer me half as much enjoyment.
I play games that are fun for me.. period

 

[ingrin]

I don't know why people do not see the potential in original software as much as ports or emulators... the Pandora is a very powerful piece of hardware. Rather than running something that is by nature inefficient (such as emulation) or ports from open source games, I think that original content designed FOR the hardware has the best potential to shine.

I'm not a huge fan of emulators myself. However, I personally lump most of the Linux centric ports and homebrew together. Both will allow for the full powers of the hardware.

Right now, I'm mostly excited about ports of many of these games as a showcase of what the Pandora can do.

As others have indicated, its hard to get excited about something that doesn't exist yet. Once the hardware is in the hands of the masses, and competitions are underway, then I think the excitement will start kicking up for homebrew.

 

[God Ginrai]

I just finished playing through the most recent Win32 build of Purity that I could find. The gameplay is so f***ing fun. (And I was just running around a level hitting checkpoints)

I cannot wait to see this game completed. (On my Pandora would be even better!) ^_^

-God Ginrai

 

[Kyo]

A game I would very much so like to have on the pandora is Abuse. Amazing game, I hear it's being a bitch to port, though.

 

[bigtruck]

I just finished playing through the most recent Win32 build of Purity that I could find. The gameplay is so f***ing fun. (And I was just running around a level hitting checkpoints)

I cannot wait to see this game completed. (On my Pandora would be even better!) ^_^

-God Ginrai

Heh, yeah I just compiled it from SVN and played it (I wish I read the thread first, it would've saved me a lot of trouble installing it.) I must've spent almost twenty minutes just shooting a rocket into the air, using the grapple/tractor-beam/whatever it is to hang on to it and get high in the air, then falling and bouncing all over the map. The game has amazing potential.

 

[God Ginrai]

I just finished playing through the most recent Win32 build of Purity that I could find. The gameplay is so f***ing fun. (And I was just running around a level hitting checkpoints)

I cannot wait to see this game completed. (On my Pandora would be even better!) ^_^

-God Ginrai

Heh, yeah I just compiled it from SVN and played it (I wish I read the thread first, it would've saved me a lot of trouble installing it.) I must've spent almost twenty minutes just shooting a rocket into the air, using the grapple/tractor-beam/whatever it is to hang on to it and get high in the air, then falling and bouncing all over the map. The game has amazing potential.


It wasn't until my second time running the game (And after I started trying out the other maps) that I figured out that you could grapple the PULS. And for a while I thought the Teleportation was buggy, since it didn't work all the time for me. Then I realized that you have to use TRACE on the Projectile, not on the Green pluses it leaves behind.

Here's a challenge for you. On SF, see if you can get on top of the tall spire that is seperated from the rest of the buildings. I haven't been able to do it yet, but I got close.

-God Ginrai

 

[AireTamStorm]

Every time we harp about emulation or ports, you're here harping about how we should be harping about homebrew instead.
-God Ginrai

Emulation and ports of great open source software are fun, and definitely have a fun factor to them. I can understand the whole "developed by a paid team = good" idea, too. First thing I'm going to put on my Pandora is likely the PSX emulator, followed by SNES and MegaDrive. Homebrew would be last on my list. This is the first time I've actually advocated homebrew openly. Got the wrong poster, perhaps?

Maybe you didn't actually read how I phrased my post. Rather than an emulator, which games believe they're running on a piece of hardware that they're not (most often a console rather than a handheld, less memory, graphical capabilities, no keyboard, often lacking joysticks / etc) or a port of a PC game (which more often than not isn't designed with a handheld's control scheme, screen size / resolution, touch screen functionality, bluetooth / wifi / etc) that a game with similar time, effort, and talent thrown in, which HAS been designed specifically for the Pandora, would end up being a better game for the system. NOT, by any means that homebrew in general is better than emulation or ports from other platforms, or that there should be a higher priority on either. Rather, one has higher potential than the other simply because of how it is designed.

That being said, I announced my homebrew game project in the dev forums last evening.

 

[conso]

I guess there will be a lot of open source games, that will feel like they were made for the pandora. SuperTuxKart for example could feel like a game dedicated to pandora, once it uses irrlicht + irrlicht has an openGL ES 2-backend. Same to irrlamb and some shooters. It's all about the quality the port is made and how it is wired to the system. Think of those open-source shooters... a plain port will be great, but a dedicated server for pandora-users would raise the experience enormously.
What I'm afraid of is, that some native-linux games would work perfectly on pandora, but will never be ported, since there is so much more interest in emulators then real native games. Look at "World of Goo" by 2D-boy. It will be released to PC, Linux, Mac and Wii. The system dependencies of the PC/Linux-versions seem to be close to the limit of the pandora, so a port should actually be "easy". I once left a notice on their blog and this seems to be the only action done by the pandora-community to get the game ported. What the hell... there could be a modern and extremely innovative independent-game coming out and pandora could be the only handheld abled to run it. It's like letting a huge chance go by...
Multivinia is another independent project about to be released soon and again pandora should be abled to run it. Why's nobody talking about it?
And about open-source games: I guess the people porting open-source games will again be fhe most let-alone's in the community.

 

[Parkydr]

Discussions of emulators/homebrew/ports is irrelevant, what game you prefer is like asking "what's your favourite colour?".

The Pandora is a general purpose computer so what is developed will be down to what developers want to develop.

 

[God Ginrai]

Every time we harp about emulation or ports, you're here harping about how we should be harping about homebrew instead.
-God Ginrai

Emulation and ports of great open source software are fun, and definitely have a fun factor to them. I can understand the whole "developed by a paid team = good" idea, too. First thing I'm going to put on my Pandora is likely the PSX emulator, followed by SNES and MegaDrive. Homebrew would be last on my list. This is the first time I've actually advocated homebrew openly. Got the wrong poster, perhaps?

Maybe you didn't actually read how I phrased my post. Rather than an emulator, which games believe they're running on a piece of hardware that they're not (most often a console rather than a handheld, less memory, graphical capabilities, no keyboard, often lacking joysticks / etc) or a port of a PC game (which more often than not isn't designed with a handheld's control scheme, screen size / resolution, touch screen functionality, bluetooth / wifi / etc) that a game with similar time, effort, and talent thrown in, which HAS been designed specifically for the Pandora, would end up being a better game for the system. NOT, by any means that homebrew in general is better than emulation or ports from other platforms, or that there should be a higher priority on either. Rather, one has higher potential than the other simply because of how it is designed.


I did read how you phrased your post, I understand that you believe a homebrew game can pull out more capability from the system, because it is written for the system. I believe it, too. But unless there is discussion about a planned homebrew game to do so, then we don't really have much to talk about in the way of homebrew.

That being said, I announced my homebrew game project in the dev forums last evening.

I'll look at the thread now.

EDIT: Could you post a link? I don't see a thread specifically by you about such a thing, I'm starting to search the "Planned Projects" thread.

EDIT2: Found it.

-God Ginrai

 

[Julius]

I guess there will be a lot of open source games, that will feel like they were made for the pandora. SuperTuxKart for example could feel like a game dedicated to pandora, once it uses irrlicht + irrlicht has an openGL ES 2-backend. Same to irrlamb and some shooters. It's all about the quality the port is made and how it is wired to the system. Think of those open-source shooters... a plain port will be great, but a dedicated server for pandora-users would raise the experience enormously.
What I'm afraid of is, that some native-linux games would work perfectly on pandora, but will never be ported, since there is so much more interest in emulators then real native games. Look at "World of Goo" by 2D-boy. It will be released to PC, Linux, Mac and Wii. The system dependencies of the PC/Linux-versions seem to be close to the limit of the pandora, so a port should actually be "easy". I once left a notice on their blog and this seems to be the only action done by the pandora-community to get the game ported. What the hell... there could be a modern and extremely innovative independent-game coming out and pandora could be the only handheld abled to run it. It's like letting a huge chance go by...
Multivinia is another independent project about to be released soon and again pandora should be abled to run it. Why's nobody talking about it?
And about open-source games: I guess the people porting open-source games will again be fhe most let-alone's in the community.

+1

Have played most of the older console games on my GP32 and GP2X too much anyways, PSX and N64 might offer a few more, but I never really liked many games from that generation.
So emulation is a bit "meh" for me

 

[ingrin]

I guess there will be a lot of open source games, that will feel like they were made for the pandora. SuperTuxKart for example could feel like a game dedicated to pandora, once it uses irrlicht + irrlicht has an openGL ES 2-backend. Same to irrlamb and some shooters. It's all about the quality the port is made and how it is wired to the system. Think of those open-source shooters... a plain port will be great, but a dedicated server for pandora-users would raise the experience enormously.
What I'm afraid of is, that some native-linux games would work perfectly on pandora, but will never be ported, since there is so much more interest in emulators then real native games. Look at "World of Goo" by 2D-boy. It will be released to PC, Linux, Mac and Wii. The system dependencies of the PC/Linux-versions seem to be close to the limit of the pandora, so a port should actually be "easy". I once left a notice on their blog and this seems to be the only action done by the pandora-community to get the game ported. What the hell... there could be a modern and extremely innovative independent-game coming out and pandora could be the only handheld abled to run it. It's like letting a huge chance go by...

This is exactly how I feel. I actually did the same thing with Lugaru last week (actually, I looked up here after I found out about the game and I think you are the only one who has even mentioned the title).
Sure, its been out for a while, and there is the whole anthopomorphized thing, but the gameplay is really quite awesome and would map well to the Pandora. I think either a direct port to the Pandora (or better yet, a concurrent Lugaru 2 release on Pandora with the other platforms) would be awesome.
I left a post on their forums, but its only elicited one middling response...

 

[God Ginrai]

I guess there will be a lot of open source games, that will feel like they were made for the pandora. SuperTuxKart for example could feel like a game dedicated to pandora, once it uses irrlicht + irrlicht has an openGL ES 2-backend. Same to irrlamb and some shooters. It's all about the quality the port is made and how it is wired to the system. Think of those open-source shooters... a plain port will be great, but a dedicated server for pandora-users would raise the experience enormously.
What I'm afraid of is, that some native-linux games would work perfectly on pandora, but will never be ported, since there is so much more interest in emulators then real native games. Look at "World of Goo" by 2D-boy. It will be released to PC, Linux, Mac and Wii. The system dependencies of the PC/Linux-versions seem to be close to the limit of the pandora, so a port should actually be "easy". I once left a notice on their blog and this seems to be the only action done by the pandora-community to get the game ported. What the hell... there could be a modern and extremely innovative independent-game coming out and pandora could be the only handheld abled to run it. It's like letting a huge chance go by...

This is exactly how I feel. I actually did the same thing with Lugaru last week (actually, I looked up here after I found out about the game and I think you are the only one who has even mentioned the title).
Sure, its been out for a while, and there is the whole anthopomorphized thing, but the gameplay is really quite awesome and would map well to the Pandora. I think either a direct port to the Pandora (or better yet, a concurrent Lugaru 2 release on Pandora with the other platforms) would be awesome.
I left a post on their forums, but its only elicited one middling response...

There was a whole topic a while back about trying to get Indie games on the Pandora, so it's not like it hasn't been talked about. People talked about getting Crayon Physics Deluxe, AudioSurf, AND World of Goo. There has been interest, it's just people are more interested in something where you don't have to convince a specific person into coding. (iow, they like open source)

-God Ginrai

 

[ingrin]

There was a whole topic a while back about trying to get Indie games on the Pandora, so it's not like it hasn't been talked about. People talked about getting Crayon Physics Deluxe, AudioSurf, AND World of Goo. There has been interest, it's just people are more interested in something where you don't have to convince a specific person into coding. (iow, they like open source)

-God Ginrai

Ohhh, I know, I even posted in a few of those threads.
I certainly understand the preference for Opensource, especially given the nature of the console. Still I would like a few of the small time indie commercial people to release some high quality $15-$25 titles (and for them to sell well, obviously). I have told myself already that I will pickup the first decent quality Pandora commercial game provided the price is reasonable. I still regret not buying Payback when I had my GP2x, I had hours of fun with the demo.

 

[God Ginrai]

There was a whole topic a while back about trying to get Indie games on the Pandora, so it's not like it hasn't been talked about. People talked about getting Crayon Physics Deluxe, AudioSurf, AND World of Goo. There has been interest, it's just people are more interested in something where you don't have to convince a specific person into coding. (iow, they like open source)

-God Ginrai

Ohhh, I know, I even posted in a few of those threads.
I certainly understand the preference for Opensource, especially given the nature of the console. Still I would like a few of the small time indie commercial people to release some high quality $15-$25 titles (and for them to sell well, obviously). I have told myself already that I will pickup the first decent quality Pandora commercial game provided the price is reasonable. I still regret not buying Payback when I had my GP2x, I had hours of fun with the demo.


I've already bought AudioSurf, but I would buy it again to have a version on the Pandora. And I would gladly pay for Crayon Physics Deluxe or Fez on the Pandora.

-God Ginrai

 

[jbr]

Glad to see Glest made it on the list. It's a really great game that's still going places. I did some modding for it until about a year ago. It uses opengl 1.4 and up only, so I don't know if that looks good for the OGL-ES pandora, but we definitely need a few native RTSs, and Glest is a great place to start.

I'm also hoping openTTD gets ported (in a form that's easy enough to use--screen space is hugely important in that game!), but I think ZodTTD will take care of that.

 

[Sphinxter]

Personally I don't get how ANYONE like Warsow, nexuiz, tremolous, or alien arena. they are all shit and I would rather play UT GOTY any day of the week

Oh and Sphinxter, on behalf of logic everywhere, "fuck you"

It's logical for people to put their inadequacies onto others, natural defense think it's called, "projection", just easier to say nobody can than I can't. Fortunately nature balances by injecting kids with enough suspicion of their elders and open minds sharp enough to recognize old fart sour graping and try for it anyway or maybe it 's that the exceptional ones take it as a challenge and dare to dream, "I can.", and every once in a while one will.

One of the biggest productions and hottest teams produced ET. Big companies produce games for a lot of reasons, indie games all come to be because at least one guy thought it would be fun, their biggest failing is the follow through, many are never completed or live up to their potential but the ones that do are as good as any major label and good is subjective. Big corps. bury their half-baked in the back yard rather than post them online.

Or maybe some just feel better shucking out a lot of dough for it like buying a $999 iphone app.

 

[CronoTriggerfan]

Ehh, I dunno if I'm "looking forward" to Linux games, but ports of good games (Quake 1, 2, 3, Dooms, that Tux racing game, etc.) are a huge reason I'll be picking up a Pandora. While the prospect of PSX and N64 were awesome in addition to emulating my retro titles, the thing that really pushed me over the edge was the fact that I could have FPS in my pocket with online play wherever I went, in addition to having a UMPC. In fact, I'm still shocked that there has yet to be a dual analog handheld yet. The setup was introduced in, what, the late 90s? Nearly ten years ago, jeez, get with the times, Sony!