Covid-19 (Coronavirus) - Please stay safe, y'all


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Sorry Mathias, I could't weep and laugh at the same time in my like for your post.

matzesu said:
That our Gouverment wants to let the "Country Open" over the Chrismass Days, and then make a Though Lockdown until mid November is quite useless: I would also close on Chrismass, because whit Chrissmass Songs Singing, Under the Tree, and whit the Churches, and everything, its quite dangourus, not even thinking about the Shopping ..
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ACK. What do you mean "until mid November" ?

I wrote that in french, they arend allowed to shoot rockets on Sylvester outdoor, so i think they will make this indoor ^^
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That's what made me laugh, indoor fireworks.
 
@pyrat I meant until mid January, but seems like i dit some mistake whit 2 Months (tm)
@Askarus im sorry if i offend you whit my last post, im ok whit your opinion, even if im not dáccord whit it,
i ditnt met you yet on a Pandora/Pyra Convention, because it was everythime too far from me to just drive to collogne or so..
also Games Com Time is on our Main Work Time in the Yeahr
I would suppose, whitout this Corona Thing, you may be nice, and you long hear and Pyra Kimono is pretty awesome, and like i sad, i apriziade your work for the community and the pyra
 
Coke tests for the virus live in pariiament:


LOL

I don't speak German, this guy sounds like he has a really weird german accent.
 
Robert Taylor said:
I don't speak German, this guy sounds like he has a really weird german accent.
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Yeah, that's called Austrian. That's weird beyond Bavarian. :)
Robert Taylor said:
Coke tests for the virus live in pariiament:
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Wow, you can throw off the test with cola. So what? Use a different test to test cola for Covid19!
How does cola cause this effect?
 
New genetic research shows how some of us infected by covid simply experience it as a relatively mild infection while others need to be taken into intensive care and fight for their lives:
www.bbc.co.uk

Covid: Genes hold clues to why some people get severely ill

A study has identified genes that provide clues about why some people get seriously ill from Covid-19.
www.bbc.co.uk

If you experience it as a mild infection and don't take care to wear a mask and keep your distance from people you could pass it on to someone with a genetic variant that means their immune system is less capable.
 
Anthropologist Margaret Mead was asked by a student what she considered to be the first sign of civilization in a culture.

Mead said that the first sign of civilization in an ancient culture was a femur (thighbone) that had been broken and then healed. Mead explained that in the animal kingdom, if you break your leg, you die. You cannot run from danger, get to the river for a drink or hunt for food. You are meat for prowling beasts. No animal survives a broken leg long enough for the bone to heal. broken femur that has healed is evidence that someone has taken time to stay with the one who fell, has bound up the wound, has carried the person to safety and has tended the person through recovery. Helping someone else through difficulty is where civilization starts. We are at our best when we serve others. Be civilized.
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will we help out the "least" among us during this time? asking for a friend :)
 
matzesu said:
@Askarus im sorry if i offend you whit my last post, im ok whit your opinion, even if im not dáccord whit it,
i ditnt met you yet on a Pandora/Pyra Convention, because it was everythime too far from me to just drive to collogne or so..
also Games Com Time is on our Main Work Time in the Yeahr
I would suppose, whitout this Corona Thing, you may be nice, and you long hear and Pyra Kimono is pretty awesome, and like i sad, i apriziade your work for the community and the pyra
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I do not feel personally offended.
The thing is, that a lot of people I have talked to will instantly flag me as some evil person because I argue against some Corona rules.
For a very long time I did not express my opinion here.
I'm a long time member on this boards and I fear that expressing my critical opinion about masks and corona rules will instantly flag me as an evil person.
Normally I do not care much about others opinion about my, but on the other hand I want to avoid unnecessary conflicts and stay neutral whenever possible.

The real issue I see with this whole Corona thing is, that many people take it personally.
They see any criticism as personal offense.
To me it feels like being against Corona rules is like being against equal treatment of women or black people (just an example).
It is really sad to me that I feel like it is better to say nothing than to have an open discussion.
This for me is a failure of our democracy.
The only reason I'm still writing this text is because if I would not, I would give up my freedom of speech (a little).

We have those questionable rules in place now.
It was right for the government to act quickly I would say.
However a lot of time has passed and what I'm missing is an open discussion about "was it right what we did?".
Of course there will never be such a thing.
If those in power would say only once "We did what we thought was right. After an evaluation we think X was a good decision and Y was bad. Let's stop doing Y".
I would deeply respect that.

If you take the mask example (you can take anything else here).
Government will never say "Oh, masks are not that important. You don't need them any more".
They ordered millions of them. They forced people to wear them.
They can not go back. So they need to keep masks a requirement in public areas.

Please let us all not be like that.
Let us discuss that Corona matter like we would discuss a keyboard layout.
Let's gather the facts and let's bring together different points of view.
This is no fight.
It is so easy to find arguments that support our own point of view.
So let's do what we always do: Bring together our knowledge and learn from each other.
Let's discuss this topic like any other technical matter.

I could start a thread saying: "Pyra should run Windows, use a 4k screen, have no SD-card slots and have a battery you can not swap to make it smaller".
You would think WTF, hell no, but you would not feel too offended and not judge me as a person.
I could bring up some valid arguments for some of the points above and you would bring up yours against.
Please, please everyone, let's do the same with the whole Corona topic:
Discuss and stay friendly and do not rate someone down just by expressing ones opinion.
The whole topic is discussed with too much emotions. Let's do it better.
 
Ok, here's a nice one, result studies from Moderna:

Somewhere in that tweet, there's the third image with results that show that all >70 years suddenly drop off for the 2 week checkup (I understand if they don't show up for the second dose, but just for a checkup?)
And it feels that some even did not pick up their phones for a phone checkup. Were they so angry that they did not want to talk?
 
FBnil said:
Ok, here's a nice one, result studies from Moderna:
Somewhere in that tweet, there's the third image with results that show that all >70 years suddenly drop off for the 2 week checkup (I understand if they don't show up for the second dose, but just for a checkup?)
And it feels that some even did not pick up their phones for a phone checkup. Were they so angry that they did not want to talk?
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Hard to tell without reading the whole report. It looks like very few participants, is that phase 2 ?
My first guess would be that the study started with the younger volunteers, then when they saw those survived started with the 50-70 group and later with the >70 group.
The table would have been written when most of the >70 higher dose volunteers hadn't spent 2 weeks in the trial.
It would not be that they didn't show up, but that the time to show up hasn't come yet because they started the trial later than other participants.
The table goes on to 394 days, and at that date is not that 100% of participants dropped off, it's simply that that day hasn't come yet.
I supposed something similar could explain the showup in other columns.

I find curious that they found so many adverse effects. Most are mild and they're more in the control group than in the vaccine group, but people seem to be having a lot of different problems (with or without vaccine).
 
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pyrat said:
It would not be that they didn't show up, but that the time to show up hasn't come yet because they started the trial later than other participants.
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Reasonable... most plausible, actually.
 
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Askarus, great points, that is my position as well. I think everyone has done a great job keeping things friendly and I think that is because everyone here has some skin in the game because of our orders. We all have learned new things about the issue and have been exposed to different ways of looking at the situation.
 
levi said:
New genetic research shows how some of us infected by covid simply experience it as a relatively mild infection while others need to be taken into intensive care and fight for their lives:
www.bbc.co.uk

Covid: Genes hold clues to why some people get severely ill

A study has identified genes that provide clues about why some people get seriously ill from Covid-19.
www.bbc.co.uk

If you experience it as a mild infection and don't take care to wear a mask and keep your distance from people you could pass it on to someone with a genetic variant that means their immune system is less capable.
Click to expand...

This is a great link. It will take a bit of time to watch this through.

This video is a really GREAT example of being able to test your critical thinking skills. We are all on a perpetual learning curve for critical thinking, it is an achievable skill, it is something that can be learned in a short period of time (probably 6 to 12 months of daily conversations, practice and training on the topic would be a my guess) but you can spend the rest of your life fine tuning those skills.

Another way of saying the same thing is, when you are watching this, get your bullshit meter out and see how much of it you can detect.

Let me provide a few starting points after clicking around the video (I have seen most of the arguments before):

1) Is it possible for experts to be 100% technically correct and still wrong?

2) Have you ever noticed that when you bring a group of experts together they will they ONLY gather around people they agree with?

3) Have you ever noticed that group of people are talking about their expertice ALL of their opinions align to "the world is ending, I am here to help?"

4) The dog not barking - what questions and perspectives aren't you hearing in the video?

Those are just a few.

Thanks again for posting these. Keep on posting more like it. This is the solid piece of conversation that challenges my point of view. That is really important.
 
Oh for F's sake! Levi, I thought this was your link! Argh!

I have a video playing in another window and did not notice it was linked to from a different site!!!!

Haha!

Okay, here is a video full of experts support vaccines, supporting severe lockdowns ... basically these experts shred every single argument that I have to pieces:


indie_SAGE 11.12.20

invidious.snopyta.org invidious.snopyta.org


This video right here supports every point that everyone supporting vaccines and lockdowns with really really good science based arguments.

But, holy canoly, are they tripping my bullshit meter off the charts. Watching these people talk is like listening to a Scientologist explain to me that Xenu will save my soul.

Anyway, I said earlier that there are no really good links supporting the lockdown position, this turns out to be a good one.
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Aha, that was Phlyras link. K. I did get it here, I knew it!
 
Okay, just finished watching Phlyras video, thanks.

Just to get this out of the way, science works, vaccines work, humans have been fighting to get rid of desease horrors like smallpox and the like for probably a million years. Our ancient ancestors had either natural remedies or had to rely on magical thinking, we discovered the scientific method and live in magical times.

I was immunized as a kid, i'm probably alive because of herd immunity. I know for a fact I am alive because dentists are magicians, in previous ages a chipped tooth could kill you.

And, yes, progress involves risk, humans make mistakes. scientists kill people as part of this progress, etc.

But, I gotta tell ya, all of these people trip my bullshit meter on so many levels. Not a single person in this video is likeable or communicates trust in any way. They certainly believe what they are saying, but then so do Christians, Muslims, anti vaxxers and Scientologists. People say, yeah but scientists have data and predictability to support them and I just laugh and point to the fact that 50% (probably more) OF ALL SCIENTIFIC PEER REVIEWED PAPERS cannot be reproduced.

Science works but not like it does on Star Trek. It is a messy process of repetitive fine tuning that is mostly fraught with failure. The fact we have anything that works is a testament to the hard work that people like the ones in the video do, but, it isn't the clear and clean process that they are trying to communicate here.

So, here is the problem with the people in the video as I see it: these people are great at telling us that the world is ending and they are ABSOLUTELY AMAZING at telling us that they are here to save it and they have the answer.

Just like every other snakeoil salesman in the world.

And yet, the CDC says there is no jump in deaths in the USA, the WHO says that lockdowns are bad for lots of reasons, the charts they show don't show that the lockdown work but instead show the normal infection numbers you see every year for the flu (as well as showing anomalous data that they even can't explain), and on and on.

In February, these people would be correct. Today? They are correct on all technical points but wrong on the proportionality and type of response.

At the end of the video, I am still left with the following:

* The numbers this year are basically the same as every other year as the desease is acting more like a flu and less like the end of the world chinese monster we thought in February.

* If all the news media was like last year, this would just be another flu season. No one would notice AT ALL.

This isn't aids or ebola. I've gone through both of those hysterias, no one shut anything down for either.

This is an amazing video of WHY we should NEVER let doctors and scientists take control of government policy. Their role is purely advisory AT BEST and should mostly be ignored they way you ignore a plumber: you call them when you need them.

Thanks again for the video Phlyra. More please, if I am wrong let's build up the library of ideas and conversations on that side so that I can drop my views with adequate justification.
 
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