Community Paradigm Shift

[Yrx]

not that A_SN was even talking about that before you can Chip came into this thread and started trashing it.

I've done nothing of the sort. I don't have any problem with A_SN's idea. I even suggested that he go ahead with it. I don't know how much it's going to help, but I don't see how it could hurt anything either.

My only issue is with A_SN's abusive and unreasonable attitude. I merely suggested he be a bit more civil about the discussion and I was attacked for it. That sort of behavior can hurt the community.

Yes.

 

[jdh2550]

OK, I gave up after reading four pages of this post.

I totally agree with A_SN that this is a good idea. I think he was just being "hopeful" that homebrew dev's might be open minded enough (flame bait!) to see the possibilities in his idea.

I see lots of good possibilities in having PC versions of popular Pandora games - and like A_SN says in a lot of cases it will be pretty darn easy to create the PC version.

My interpretation of what A_SN has said is that...

The goal isn't to make the best possible PC version or to compete with PC only games. The goal is to give folks who don't own a Pandora (or other similar platform) a taste of some of the cool games available on this (or similar) platform. It helps draw them into the community and when they're in the community there's a much increased chance that they'll become contributors to that community (either by buying games or participating in discussions).

For you devs that say "I'm not interested" he even says in his first post that he hopes you'll allow others to give it a go. Remember that this is about being "open".

Closed = Bad. Open = Good. And open means open to new ideas...

Good idea A_SN!

 

[A_SN]

My only issue is with A_SN's abusive and unreasonable attitude. I merely suggested he be a bit more civil about the discussion and I was attacked for it. That sort of behavior can hurt the community.

What can I say. I'm an awful person, and a disgrace to anyone named Adolf. Oh wait..

More seriously, your posts were for some disruptive and didn't all deserve a reply. You got the replies you got because I'm a playful person. And bored too.

 

[klikklak]

I agree with A_SN as well, porting homebrew might enlarge the dev community and that's a good thing. Moore exposure and more openness is the way to go.

This reminds me a bit of KDE4 apps being ported to windows. I haven't followed the discussion about this, but generally I think it's a good thing. It brings both new users to gnu software and new developers.

 

[JakeK]

*snip*

You can repeat the same disproven points over and over again it won't make them any true. Besides, you're not a dev, so obviously you don't really actually care about what we want, which is to reach out to more people. Nobody's gonna make a multiplayer game (over the Internet) original homebrew game if it's gonna be just for the few Pandora owners who can connect to wifi and play it. Now if you can easily reach out to PC people it's gonna make multiplayer game creation more interesting. A lot more. But you don't care about that. I don't know what are your true reasons for wanting to keep the whole thing closed, probably having games no other kid can play. Well fuck you, I want every kid to get a chance to play my games.


I already mentioned my reason for exclusitivity. You already have every chance to get people to play your games, IMO you shouldn't plant this PC seed in the forums dedicated to the handheld.

snip

Fuck this thread, anyone who had anything interesting to say said it a while ago now. It's time for action, not discussion with non-protagonists.

Are you waiting for permission or something? No one here is stopping you from doing what you want so stop bitching about it and do it.

*snip*

Why do you give a damn about the Pandora having exclusive games? You aren't the one selling it - let Craig worry about that. Nobody here has any obligation to make the Pandora successful (not that A_SN was even talking about that before you can Chip came into this thread and started trashing it).


Chip trashing it? What? Read his posts properly next time.

Oh man I already said why I care about exclusive games. Craig can only control the hardware and it is up to the community when it comes to software. Yes no one has an obligation to make it successful but if you really want the Pandora to thrive you would care. I want to see it become as big as it can, that may mean a different route for certain things but that is my opinion and you can take it or leave it. No one is making you read it, this is the internet so deal with it.

 

[Orkie]

I want to see it become as big as it can

Why though? This is something I find very odd about the whole attitude towards the Pandora - people think they should support it to the point where there have been one or two instances of members contacting companies themselves to get them to port their products to the Pandora. It is madness!

 

[A_SN]

I already mentioned my reason for exclusitivity. You already have every chance to get people to play your games, IMO you shouldn't plant this PC seed in the forums dedicated to the handheld.

Every chance? You mean for the few people who have the handled in question? You're just nincompoop who wants to play games few others could. If you could join a super secret club in which you would get to play games that no-one else can play you'd probably wet your pants.

snip

Fuck this thread, anyone who had anything interesting to say said it a while ago now. It's time for action, not discussion with non-protagonists.

Are you waiting for permission or something? No one here is stopping you from doing what you want so stop bitching about it and do it.
Duh are you dumb? My idea consisted in adding forums and such to gp32x.de, so yeah I need to get Hando to agree to do it all for me if I want anything to be done.

*snip*

Why do you give a damn about the Pandora having exclusive games? You aren't the one selling it - let Craig worry about that. Nobody here has any obligation to make the Pandora successful (not that A_SN was even talking about that before you can Chip came into this thread and started trashing it).


Chip trashing it? What? Read his posts properly next time.

Oh man I already said why I care about exclusive games. Craig can only control the hardware and it is up to the community when it comes to software. Yes no one has an obligation to make it successful but if you really want the Pandora to thrive you would care. I want to see it become as big as it can, that may mean a different route for certain things but that is my opinion and you can take it or leave it. No one is making you read it, this is the internet so deal with it.

Whatever, you wouldn't give up a point even if it was that the Earth is flat if you were spending your vacations in the ISS. Besides, you obviously don't give a shit about what the devs want, which is not being locked in. That's what open means.

I want to see it become as big as it can

Why though? This is something I find very odd about the whole attitude towards the Pandora - people think they should support it to the point where there have been one or two instances of members contacting companies themselves to get them to port their products to the Pandora. It is madness!

No, it's fanboyism.

(05/04/08: Edited for sentiment, language - Tobriand)

 

[Parkydr]

Why though? This is something I find very odd about the whole attitude towards the Pandora - people think they should support it to the point where there have been one or two instances of members contacting companies themselves to get them to port their products to the Pandora. It is madness!

I find it weird too, it's not even out yet. The Fanboyism is reaching Apple proportions!

 

[Svartalf]

Why though? This is something I find very odd about the whole attitude towards the Pandora - people think they should support it to the point where there have been one or two instances of members contacting companies themselves to get them to port their products to the Pandora. It is madness!

I'd find that a bit on the crazy side.

In my case, I am a representative of a porting interest and I'm eagerly waiting to see if I can lay my hands on a Pandora to see what will come of my having one and the codebases that I've got access to- if the stuff comes over nicely, I'll have mobile examples of code and why you should port to Linux for one of the next GDC's, along with if a solid handle on the potential of ports to the Pandora. But asking companies to port their stuff over when the thing's not even past the rough hand-assembled prototypes stage? Utterly nuts.

 

[JakeK]

I already mentioned my reason for exclusitivity. You already have every chance to get people to play your games, IMO you shouldn't plant this PC seed in the forums dedicated to the handheld.

Every chance? You mean for the few people who have the handled in question? You're just an egoistic twat who wants to play games few others could. If you could join a super secret club in which you would get to play games that no-one else can play you'd probably wet your pants.

Right, and I want to join the Army because I enjoy being yelled at by every rank above my own.

Egotistic? You made that club, I just joined it (apparently).

No, it's fanboyism.

No it is enthusiastic people and there is nothing wrong with that, not to mention that it is in no way fanboyism. Pandora is the ultimate handheld <- That is fanboyism.

I want to see it become as big as it can

Why though? This is something I find very odd about the whole attitude towards the Pandora - people think they should support it to the point where there have been one or two instances of members contacting companies themselves to get them to port their products to the Pandora. It is madness!


Why? Isn't this an easy answer? If the Pandora becomes a really big thing this would mean better things for the users and the Pandora. So what if people are enthusiastic about it. Suggesting that a company port a game isn't that crazy. It may work or it may not, but there is no loss in doing so. It is an email that would take five minutes out of someones day and could bring good results.

 

[A_SN]

Egotistic? You made that club, I just joined it (apparently).

Now we want to open it, and you're against it.

No, it's fanboyism.

No it is enthusiastic people and there is nothing wrong with that.

Fanboys are by definition enthusiastic people.

It may work or it may not, but there is no loss in doing so. It is an email that would take five minutes out of someones day and could bring good results.

No loss? You mean besides making anyone associated with the Pandora sound like a bunch of crazy fools? Mind your damn business and let the people in charge do what they have to do. If you could be to any true use to them you'd be on their payroll.

 

[atomicthumbs]

Nobody here has any obligation to make the Pandora successful

I'm just gonna poke my head in here for a moment and say that I feel that I have an obligation because the Pandora is SO AWESOME

 

[Tobriand]

Just a heads up. I'm paying attention to this thread. Please don't add extra metaphorical lighter fuel to it anyone (you know who I mean), or I'll be forced to use a much bigger extinguisher than the one I've been using already.

On another note, at least in sentiment, I agree with A_SN, although as a non-dev, it doesn't really matter that much what I think.

 

[JakeK]

It may work or it may not, but there is no loss in doing so. It is an email that would take five minutes out of someones day and could bring good results.

No loss? You mean besides making anyone associated with the Pandora sound like a bunch of crazy fools? Mind your damn business and let the people in charge do what they have to do. If you could be to any true use to them you'd be on their payroll.


It is how a lot of things get better. Steam only become better because of the community that surrounds it, asking for features, getting indie games on it and extensive bug searching.

Look it is obvious we are not going to agree with each other so can we just leave it threre?

 

[A_SN]

Look it is obvious we are not going to agree with each other so can we just leave it threre?

Agreed . Like I said before anyways this very discussion stopped mattering a while ago. Now it's all happening on IRC.

 

[Svartalf]

Why? Isn't this an easy answer? If the Pandora becomes a really big thing this would mean better things for the users and the Pandora. So what if people are enthusiastic about it. Suggesting that a company port a game isn't that crazy. It may work or it may not, but there is no loss in doing so. It is an email that would take five minutes out of someones day and could bring good results.

Heh... It's wasting someone's time on a maybe. Studios are often resource constrained and we've enough
trouble getting them to consider x86 Linux right now. Pandora's still a bloodly long-shot. Unless you can provide proof of at least something along 3k units overall sold or more, they're going to turn their noses up at you unless you're ponying up $25k or so for the rights to do the job yourself.

That's why. It's NOT going to be likely to be bringing good results. This is from a professional IN that industry.

It is how a lot of things get better. Steam only become better because of the community that surrounds it, asking for features, getting indie games on it and extensive bug searching.

Considering that this isn't Steam, a delivery system with something on the order of 5-10k (or MORE) users using it... It's a nice sentiment, but until the first 3k units do well and we have a few professional titles do well on it (Heh... Isn't the stuff I've mentioned good enough?) you're not going to actually GET any traction in the ways you're contemplating.

Just because Steam did well, doesn't mean that it's going to work out the same way with this stuff without a little different thinking on our parts before it gets to critical mass. We don't have Valve or someone like it pushing it like Steam has. We're going to have to use a different model to make this one work for us.

 

[JakeK]

It was just an example. Obviously there are the differences but just that one aspect that I was talking about. But anyway all is sorted.

Look it is obvious we are not going to agree with each other so can we just leave it threre?

Agreed . Like I said before anyways this very discussion stopped mattering a while ago. Now it's all happening on IRC.


*Does happy dance*

 

[J201605]

I want to see it become as big as it can

Why though? This is something I find very odd about the whole attitude towards the Pandora - people think they should support it to the point where there have been one or two instances of members contacting companies themselves to get them to port their products to the Pandora. It is madness!

Yes it was stupid when atomicthumbs contacted opera on his own but besides that trying to help out the pandora is fine because honestly at the price and quantity being produced, i dont think that craigix is going to get too rich off of them. Also, when more people buy the pandora it will bring more devs and more donations for existing devs (like yourself). I don't want to buy this device and have it die like the zodiac, i want it to flourish and be around for longer than the gp2x, the pandora is the underdog, its not being made by sony, there is no reason this community shouldn't support it to the fullest.

 

[Svartalf]

Yes it was stupid when atomicthumbs contacted opera on his own but besides that trying to help out the pandora is fine because honestly at the price and quantity being produced, i dont think that craigix is going to get too rich off of them. Also, when more people buy the pandora it will bring more devs and more donations for existing devs (like yourself). I don't want to buy this device and have it die like the zodiac, i want it to flourish and be around for longer than the gp2x, the pandora is the underdog, its not being made by sony, there is no reason this community shouldn't support it to the fullest.

There's support- then there's over the top. Contacting commercial interests to support the Pandora when it's not even in the tail end of the engineering prototype stages is a bit over the top, unfortunately...

What we really need to do to support this is to encourage the firmware people to gel something that we can target and start developing for, a' la Maemo's environment, so that people can at least simulate the machine, have stuff largely ready and have something to show right out of the gate when the first couple hundred become available. I know I've got maybe one to two more week's worth of work before I think I'll be free of the main fixing needed for the title I'm working on for LGP. Once that's done, I've several projects- but I could timeslice in some rework for the titles I've got access to. But that's only if we've got a fully consistent API for me to target. We don't even HAVE that, guys. Unless you do that, there's no good reason to have anyone contacting anyone for "ports" or versions of things for the Pandora.

 

[A_SN]

But that's only if we've got a fully consistent API for me to target. We don't even HAVE that, guys.

What are you talking about man? Everybody knows that we're getting a Debian with SDL and OpenGL ES 2.0. So quit looking for excuses and get coding already