Center Click Vs More Travel

[Dasasman]

Better control is much higher priority for me than centre click!

We shouldn't have to choose between them. It should be both.

-God Ginrai


I have to respectfully disagree. We can't get everything we want. Heck, I want a 2.5mm and click nub myself. But, At the point its at travel is more important.

 

[gaterooze]

At first I thought I'd like both, but to be honest now I would slightly prefer it without the click even if we had the choice (just for durability and less finicky while playing). I know most won't agree, and if it *did* have the click it wouldn't be a big problem.

 

[prairiefire]

voted more travel. we have enough buttons to substitute for the centre click. I like the L/R for left right click.

Just because you can substitute buttons for center click doesn't mean that you'll be able to play emulated games, that use most if not all of the buttons of the system, well.

-God Ginrai

My comment was directed more towards L/R for mouse clicks. I also think there would be way more times i'd prefer it not to click then a few emulated games where it would be useful. That's just me though. I don't really care if you have a different opinion. Just stating my vote.

 

[God Ginrai]

At first I thought I'd like both, but to be honest now I would slightly prefer it without the click even if we had the choice (just for durability and less finicky while playing). I know most won't agree, and if it *did* have the click it wouldn't be a big problem.

There have been no tests that have said that analog nub clicks would bring down durability. If you can find some, then please link me.

voted more travel. we have enough buttons to substitute for the centre click. I like the L/R for left right click.

Just because you can substitute buttons for center click doesn't mean that you'll be able to play emulated games, that use most if not all of the buttons of the system, well.

-God Ginrai

My comment was directed more towards L/R for mouse clicks. I also think there would be way more times i'd prefer it not to click then a few emulated games where it would be useful. That's just me though. I don't really care if you have a different opinion. Just stating my vote.


One person who isn't part of the development team said it "looked" like it might click while they were using it, and all of a sudden everyone takes it as fact that it does. We have no proof that it is easy to make that mistake, and also, as long as you don't have it set to anything that you don't want to happen, then it's fine. (Like if it was set to Z-target in OoT)

Better control is much higher priority for me than centre click!

We shouldn't have to choose between them. It should be both.

-God Ginrai

Boo hoo, deal with it.


Fuck off.

-God Ginrai

 

[prairiefire]

At first I thought I'd like both, but to be honest now I would slightly prefer it without the click even if we had the choice (just for durability and less finicky while playing). I know most won't agree, and if it *did* have the click it wouldn't be a big problem.

There have been no tests that have said that analog nub clicks would bring down durability. If you can find some, then please link me.

The '2X suffered from this durability issue. You're correct that there is no evidence that the analog nub would be prone to the same lack of build quality, but since it's an issue that has happened before to this scene, I think it's a legit concern.

 

[God Ginrai]

At first I thought I'd like both, but to be honest now I would slightly prefer it without the click even if we had the choice (just for durability and less finicky while playing). I know most won't agree, and if it *did* have the click it wouldn't be a big problem.

There have been no tests that have said that analog nub clicks would bring down durability. If you can find some, then please link me.

The '2X suffered from this durability issue. You're correct that there is no evidence that the analog nub would be prone to the same lack of build quality, but since it's an issue that has happened before to this scene, I think it's a legit concern.


I considered that that was what you were thinking of, and to tell you the truth, that is as much proof against analog nub stick click as it is against the B button, because the only thing they have in common that has any effect on the outcome is that they are pressed. The fact that they are both used for direction has nothing to do with the durability of it due to clicking. I really don't think you can try to compare it to that, because then you're almost required to say: It shouldn't have buttons due to durability issues.

-God Ginrai

 

[Suntan]

hehe for some reason your post reminded me of this xkcd drawing -

I don't know what kind of clit you've been fingering, but if it feels like those abrasive little trackpoints, you need to turn the lights back on!

-Suntan

 

[JakeK]

I voted for no click. For me it would mean no accidental pressing of that button and there are other buttons that could perform that task.

 

[ingrin]

At first I thought I'd like both, but to be honest now I would slightly prefer it without the click even if we had the choice (just for durability and less finicky while playing). I know most won't agree, and if it *did* have the click it wouldn't be a big problem.

There have been no tests that have said that analog nub clicks would bring down durability. If you can find some, then please link me.

The '2X suffered from this durability issue. You're correct that there is no evidence that the analog nub would be prone to the same lack of build quality, but since it's an issue that has happened before to this scene, I think it's a legit concern.


I considered that that was what you were thinking of, and to tell you the truth, that is as much proof against analog nub stick click as it is against the B button, because the only thing they have in common that has any effect on the outcome is that they are pressed. The fact that they are both used for direction has nothing to do with the durability of it due to clicking. I really don't think you can try to compare it to that, because then you're almost required to say: It shouldn't have buttons due to durability issues.

-God Ginrai

I disagree. There are 53 buttons on the unit, and only 2 analog sticks. Which should be more durable? Complex mechanical things are more likely to fail than simple ones simply because of the increased points of failure. Aside from accidental pressing of the analog button when it isn't intended increasing the frequency of pushes artificially, there is also the fact the stick will be in unusual positions when pressed hard, which may lower the life of the stick itself.
The whole reason the original model was discontinued was because it was too complex and expensive. Why do you have so much faith in a piece of equipment the manufacturer themselves had no faith in, even when there was an offer on the table to purchase 100,000 units?

 

[CronoTriggerfan]

I considered that that was what you were thinking of, and to tell you the truth, that is as much proof against analog nub stick click as it is against the B button, because the only thing they have in common that has any effect on the outcome is that they are pressed. The fact that they are both used for direction has nothing to do with the durability of it due to clicking. I really don't think you can try to compare it to that, because then you're almost required to say: It shouldn't have buttons due to durability issues.

-God Ginrai

Okay, since you obviously have absolutely no idea how these things work, let's straighten it all out for you, mmkay? :lol: A typical button on a gaming controller is an elastamor pad. It's a little piece of rubber with a conductive strip at its base. When the physical plastic button pushes down on this rubber pad, it pushes with it the conductive strip. On the motherboard itself, there are two leads from traces that are not quite connected. The conductive strip completes the circuit, and a button press is registered.

The button under the analog stick is a different story, however. Notice how normal buttons are "mushy" whereas analog stick buttons "click"? That's because they're tact switches and not rubber pads. Those tact switches are held in place, typically, by a small solder joint or metal bracket within the potentiometer of the analog stick. With continued use, this joint becomes more and more susceptible to snap or bend, which increases the odds that the button itself will break. So while they may be a nice addition, there are indeed logical justifications for not including them.

And I'd really appreciate it if you didn't tell me to "fuck off". From what I've seen you write in this thread, you obviously have some analytical skills, so in the future, it'd be nice if you could articulate yourself in a manner that didn't make you look so petulant. Thanks.

 

[jmetal88]

I'm getting sick of all this arguing. Can we stop please?

 

[AireTamStorm]

QUOTE
F@!2 off.
-God Ginrai


No need for language. Responding in such a manner, to any post, is unproductive and childish.

And I'd really appreciate it if you didn't tell me to "f&% off". From what I've seen you write in this thread, you obviously have some analytical skills, so in the future, it'd be nice if you could articulate yourself in a manner that didn't make you look so petulant. Thanks.

Ahem.QUOTE
Boo hoo, deal with it.


That's both petulant and childish. Edit: AND Arrogant.

On topic:

Click AND throw would be nice, as Ginrai suggests. PlayStation emulation would be much more intuitive with a center click which is there in the original controller, even though we can easily map controls to a keyboard key. There are potential durability issues, as you said chrono. However, you cannot judge the durability of something of which you do not have direct contact with. Joysticks in general have durability issues. So do buttons, and touch screens, and LCDs, and plastic in general for that matter. Should we throw those out too? You can't know the potential for such issues when you have no idea what sticks are being considered, let alone have actual experience with them.

 

[CronoTriggerfan]

I was simply saying with brevity that that's the situation we're faced with. He really does need to get over it.

 

[AireTamStorm]

Aire, I had a smiley face in that original post, I was clearly joking. Jeez.

Ah. Overlooked that.

 

[waffles]

like ingrin said, there was a reason it was discontinued, the manufactures are not stupid, they thought it sucked so considering we cant see for ourselves we might as well trust them.
Also its fairly simple logic to guess that something with more things that can go wrong, doing more functions, with more use, is more likely to go wrong.
device + normal events that may damage device = normal breakage.
device + more events that may damage device = higher than normal breakage.
is everyone following?

 

[Gilrad]

I don't think the manufacturers discontinued it because of quality... The stated reason was because the sticks have too many parts and are too complex to manufacture... In other words, it's too expensive to produce them; they're not making enough money off them.

If the developers were so set on using them, enough to be willing to place a bulk order and set themselves up for a lose/lose situation in the future (either the Pandora doesn't sell enough, and they wasted money on a bunch of nubs they aren't going to use, or they would eventually need to do a major hardware change when they used every nub), I would say the nubs were probably ideal build and quality at least in the developer's eyes.

But in the end, I think it all works out. An extra 0.5mm of throw would be ideal, but pragmatism has to take over at some point, as much as my inner idealist cries at the prospect.

 

[.Gogeta§§J4BR.]

:mellow:
what a sad way to know there won't be any center click
also a sad way to realise the pandora is kinda far away from release... I hope no major delays happen when they usually happen (when actually mass-producing the units)

 

[BackAssward]

Realization is a bitch. I wont miss the click as much as I will the area of movement (even 2mm seems less than desired).

The real question is this: there are already a 1mm with click and a 2 mm without (psp analog): Do you want the available 1mm movement with click, or do you want the available device with 2mm of movement and no click?

Personally, I'm for more movement than 2mm, but that would be custom, and the above two options are clearly about what is currently available. I'd front the $25K myself, if I knew I'd turn an equivalent return for it, if not a profit.


So they are really asking you: Since they're not going for a custom solution, which would you rather? The existing 1mm with click, or the existing 2mm without?


I'd still prefer a 2.5mm or 3mm without click, but there doesn't sound like an already produced (and readily available) version of either.

 

[Arialia]

In fact i prefer nub without click : too bad experience with phone and camera , it always click when i don't want :huh:
i prefer too max travel available

this made by Analog device seems great but too late for Pandora and for gaming i don't know :unsure:

 

[JakeK]

In fact i prefer nub without click : too bad experience with phone and camera , it always click when i don't want :huh:
i prefer too max travel available

this made by Analog device seems great but too late for Pandora and for gaming i don't know :unsure:



Exactly.

Well the flash presentation won me over , but I doubt it could be any good for gaming purposes.