This post is just to increase my post count in case that would become a criterion for deciding who gets access to the first beta units. Please ignore it.
Benefits for donators?
- Thread starter Mark
- Start date
Neelix
Insecticidal Maniac
:lol: as if you need it. :rolleyes: You currently have the 11th highest post count... and the top 10 includes both ED and craigix.
- Neelix
Ah, so Craig will get a beta unit?
Xcl4m4t10n
Advanced Member
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2009
- Messages
- 1,209
In fact, Craig actually have his own private beta with aluminum case. He got it 2 months ago...Ah, so Craig will get a beta unit?
comradekingu
Glowing ember
When the fair price is found, sending out units in the order they were funded is ok. That gives it a bit of urgency, which is fine. My money is as good as yours.
The only real hard limit is the minimum amount of orders needed to make it happen. Anything beyond that makes just makes the numbers better. Instead of having a system that rewards you being in before me monetarily, or the rather arbitrary post-count measure, we all drag in the same direction and help each-other.
The only real hard limit is the minimum amount of orders needed to make it happen. Anything beyond that makes just makes the numbers better. Instead of having a system that rewards you being in before me monetarily, or the rather arbitrary post-count measure, we all drag in the same direction and help each-other.
Last edited by a moderator:
rygD
Nihilistic Mystic
Why would your body be rotating? Lemme grab some tape.
Null
Snug
Do you have no shame?This post is just to increase my post count in case that would become a criterion for deciding who gets access to the first beta units. Please ignore it.
Glyph Reader
Member
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2014
- Messages
- 332
Don't we all have shame in some form, if you know what I mean.Do you have no shame?This post is just to increase my post count in case that would become a criterion for deciding who gets access to the first beta units. Please ignore it.
-Glyph Reader
Last edited by a moderator:
Null
Snug
^
Last edited by a moderator:
Glyph Reader
Member
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2014
- Messages
- 332
^
I have no counter arguement. You win.
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||
||
||
-Glyph Reader
I have no counter arguement. You win.
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||~~~~~~~~~~~
||
||
||
-Glyph Reader
Grench
Forum Addict!
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2008
- Messages
- 6,629
The purpose of having a 100 unit selective beta audience isn't an effort to exclude good people. It's an effort to find and fix anything that is broken AND give the primary developer audience a chance to get a few bugs hammered out of the OS and driver images BEFORE the rest of the good/nice people get their mitts on the thing.
It's an economic need to decrease returns.
By paying an arm & leg for a beta unit, those beta testers are more likely to be either a developer or a highly involved end user who's willing to put in the effort to properly test - and frequently update - the proposed beta units.
I was a Tapwave Zodiac beta tester. There were a few weeks when I installed a different OS image -nightly- in order to -recheck- the bugs I had submitted to report back if the OS update had/not repaired/unchanged/worse behavior and/or new bugs as a result.
For a beta test process you need a relatively small group of people who are going to spend at least 2+ hours per day finding AND documenting AND re-testing the bug list.
It saves money and makes a much better product in the long run.
Grench
Forum Addict!
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2008
- Messages
- 6,629
If he offers to pre-pay the $$$$ AND meets whatever criteria you choose to apply to 'developer' status AND repays whatever debt he currently has to you or your shop (if any), sure. He's likely knowledgeable about the product line and might have the time needed to help produce and report bugs.Ah, so Craig will get a beta unit?
The beta idea is to find a motivated audience of developers and early adopters to help ensure that the product is ready for prime time on general release. ED may choose to skip this step - which I suspect happened on the early CC Pandoras which may have been a factor in Craig's reported high return rate.
comradekingu
Glowing ember
Doing a run of 100 really conflicts with economy of scale. You could ship out 100 units early, but you cant make only 100 units, for reasons given. Giving reasons why 100 is a good number to ship out, doesnt make 100 any more feasible to produce.
Just like you think only developers and people who are ok with your preposition will buy them, the reality could just as easily be people who want more stable hardware wait for reviews.
No, craig can not be involved in any way whatsoever for whatever reason possible. If you want a early unit, get a dev-board, thats your option now.
Hoping this thread can return to benefits for donators.
Just like you think only developers and people who are ok with your preposition will buy them, the reality could just as easily be people who want more stable hardware wait for reviews.
No, craig can not be involved in any way whatsoever for whatever reason possible. If you want a early unit, get a dev-board, thats your option now.
Hoping this thread can return to benefits for donators.
Last edited by a moderator:
Grench
Forum Addict!
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2008
- Messages
- 6,629
100 IS an arbitrary number for the beta test idea. It needs to be large enough to garner -some- economy of scale AND get enough active beta developers and participants/testers. To be a self-funded beta testing audience, the price they pay for a beta unit would be much higher, both in cost and hours, than what the unit will sell for later when produced in the thousands with no expectations of 'testing hours'.
Two ends of the spectrum.Developers/BetaTesters------------------EarlyAdopters-----------------WaitForReviews
As a stated beta testing audience, a proper disclaimer is that the unit you receive may simply not work for any purpose, no refund, and their sole remedy for issues is that they may claim a replacement mass produced unit at some point IF such a unit gets made.
Will there be a few reckless individuals who jump on a beta-testing-preorder-list just so they can be the first one in their City/Nation/Block/Household to get a Pyra? Sure. They're also subsidizing the beta test then by the sizable over-pricing needed for the short run.
That is an emotional argument. This is business. If the man has legal tender (cash upfront) and no outstanding debts to the company, there is no reason to not allow him to put his name in the beta testing pre-order hat - other than emotion. Note in my original plan for this, ED is to rank order the responses such that Developers take priority. Next would be known active community members - which is where post count came in as a possible option for ranking. I also noted that he's welcome to throw out anyone he doesn't want to deal with in a beta test AND that I may not qualify as I am not a developer. Craig could be excluded just as easily.
You're missing the point. Beta testers ARE donors. They are some of the biggest $$$ donors that the Pyra is likely to see.1. They pay an inflated price (more or less) for a lightly tested unit that may (likely does) have flaws.
2. They are expected to spend several hours a day/week during the beta test period to document flaws, apply fixes, validate fixes, etc.
3. They are expected to be responsive to the developers requests for additional information around bug items.
4. They are spending $$$$ in time and money on a unit that will, by definition, be obsolete as soon as the production unit rolls out.
Face it. You hate the idea just because someone else may be able to spend more money than you and get one of the 'early units' when they 'don't deserve' it. Yep. That's going to happen. However their willingness to purchase an overpriced beta unit and claim 'FIRST!!!' is still beneficial in it's underwriting the beta testing AND the very few free beta units that should be sent to known high-producing developers (Notaz, Exophase, etc...)
Beta testers ARE 'donators' (donors) by definition. Both money AND time.
comradekingu
Glowing ember
How is filing bug-reports different from public review? Why limit publicity of the few units that will be for testing?
If you read what is already presented you will see an empathic argument, please realize my position isn't centered around myself.
If you read what is already presented you will see an empathic argument, please realize my position isn't centered around myself.
Last edited by a moderator:
Grench
Forum Addict!
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2008
- Messages
- 6,629
There should absolutely be a complete gag order, with legal paperwork and sign-off, for beta testing participation. NONE of these units should be subjected to publicity or public review EVER. They're BETA. They're NOT DONE. They're cupcakes that haven't spent enough time in the oven and the eggs inside them are likely to cause vomiting and other nasty side effects.
Pre-order Beta testers are people who get in line to give their money to the project so that they can give their time to the project so that the first units ordered by everyone else get shipped with lower failure rates, higher software quality and more working applications.
Your argument is all about perceived fairness and puppies - and completely irrelevant.
Taking a product like this straight from drawing board and 1-3 'Alpha' units with hand-placed components in 3d printed cases to full-on production would be outright reckless. There NEEDS to be an intermediary audience. What I have stated is that I believe given the active community, this beta test could be self funded by the beta testers.
No, not everyone could afford it. As noted I propose that a very few exceptions (5? 10?) be made for free units to high-productivity developers as part of the beta test batch that are funded by the rest of the beta test group's 'over payment'.
