Will The Pandora Will Be Able To Run The 3d Arcade Sega Games?

[homestar4000]

I was wondering if the Pandora will be able to run the games from the Sega Model 1, Model 2, and Model 3 arcade boards. Model 1 emulation would look like it would run fine on the Pandora without errors or frameskipping. Model 2 emulation would work fine too, maybe with frameskipping or going without sound? Model 3, I guess it would run decently. Also will Sega ST-V emulation will be possible top. Maybe if some Sega arcade games don't work, I guess you can run Sega PC games for MS-DOS.

 

[God Ginrai]

I was wondering if the Pandora will be able to run the games from the Sega Model 1, Model 2, and Model 3 arcade boards. Model 1 emulation would look like it would run fine on the Pandora without errors or frameskipping. Model 2 emulation would work fine too, maybe with frameskipping or going without sound? Model 3, I guess it would run decently. Also will Sega ST-V emulation will be possible top. Maybe if some Sega arcade games don't work, I guess you can run Sega PC games for MS-DOS.

Well, from a google search, I couldn't even find an emu for the Model 3. I haven't looked for the others yet. Are there any emus for them?

-God Ginrai

 

[Prometheus]

Maybe if some Sega arcade games don't work, I guess you can run Sega PC games for MS-DOS.

I'm afraid I don't know the answer to your main question, but I had to comment on the above quote - unfortunately, as far as I'm aware, the "Sega PC" line began life with Windows 95 and so wouldn't be possible to run. Sorry. :/

 

[mcobit]

QUOTE

Well, from a google search, I couldn't even find an emu for the Model 3. I haven't looked for the others yet. Are there any emus for them?


CODE
http://nebula.emulatronia.com/descargas.php


There you go.

 

[x68000]

I don't know if Model 2 emulation is possible, but can you imagine some Day-tonnnnnn-aaaaaaa on a handheld!

Or how about some Virtual On, using the analogue nubs as the Twin Sticks!

 

[mindlord]

Or how about some Virtual On, using the analogue nubs as the Twin Sticks!

* drools uncontrollably *
Virtual On was one of the main reasons I bought a Dreamcast.

 

[ledow]

Sega Model 1:

Main CPU : 32bits RISC NEC V60 uPD-70616 @ 16 MHz (2.5 MIPS)
Graphics Co-Processor : Fujitsu TGP MB86233 FPU 32bits 16M flops
Sound CPU : 68000 @ 12Mhz
Sound chip : 2 x Sega MultiPCM Custom 28 channel PCM chips @ 8 MHz, 1 for Music and 1 for Effects. Each can access up to 8meg sample rom *per chip*
Sound Timing Chip : YM3834 @ 8MHz (only used for its timers)
Co-Processor Abilities : Floating decimal point operation function, Axis rotation operation function, 3D matrix operation function
Geometry : 180,000 polygons/sec, 540,000 vectors/sec
Rendering : 1,200,000 pixels/sec
Video : Shading Flat Shading, Diffuse Reflection, Specula Reflection, 2 Layers of Background Scrolling, Alpha Channel
Video resolution : 496x384 in 65536 colors

Not enormously out of the question, but will need a lot of optimisation. Fortunately, MAME handles this system, so it's just a question of recompiling and optimising. Possible (but probably slow?).

Sega Model 2:

Main CPU : Intel i960-KB @ 25 MHz 32bits RISC
Graphics Co-Processor : Fujitsu TGP MB86234 FPU 32bits 16M flops
Co-Processor Abilities : Floating decimal point operation function, Axis rotation operation function, 3D matrix operation function
Sound CPU : 16bits 68000 @ 10Mhz
Sound chip : 2 x Custom 28 channel PCM chips, 1 for Music and 1 for Effects (Can access up to 8meg sample rom *per chip*)
Sound Timing Chip : YM3834 @ 8MHz (only used for its timers)
Audio RAM : 540 Kilobytes (4 megabits)
Video resolution : 496x384 in 65536 colors
Geometry : 300,000 polygons/s. 900,000 vectors/s
Rendering : 1,200,000 pixels/s
Video : Shading Flat Shading, Perspective Texture, Micro Texture, Multi Window, Diffuse Reflection, Specula Reflection.

I think the word's "pushing it a bit" might apply here. Even just adding them up naively, that's about 60MHz of chips that need to be emulated in order to work... Even taking into account 3D-handoff, disabling sound, etc. you're pushing it without a highly optimised emulator and there aren't as many of those as Model1 emulators. You're not quite into N64 territory (93.75 MHz NEC VR4300 and SGI 62.5 MHz), but it's probably damn close if the interactions between those chips are highly timing-sensitive.

Although technically, it's not *impossible*, it's a hard job and a lot of porting and optimisation, most probably. I doubt you'll see it for a system that has precisely 6 games written for it (4 of them being Daytona titles).

 

[cools]

Sega Model 2:

Although technically, it's not *impossible*, it's a hard job and a lot of porting and optimisation, most probably. I doubt you'll see it for a system that has precisely 6 games written for it (4 of them being Daytona titles).

There are plenty of Model 2 games - just on slightly different hardware variants from the original

 

[MiL0]

Sega Model 2:

Although technically, it's not *impossible*, it's a hard job and a lot of porting and optimisation, most probably. I doubt you'll see it for a system that has precisely 6 games written for it (4 of them being Daytona titles).

There are plenty of Model 2 games - just on slightly different hardware variants from the original



precisely - just off the top of my head:

Daytona USA
Virtua Fighter 2
Sega Rally
House Of The Dead (1 maybe? definitely 2)
Virtua Cop 2

Maybe not loads, but the ones that were made were great games on Model 2 - I would love to see it emulated. Is Nebula open source though? i don't think it is... also, it's only very recently that it's been able to emulate Daytona's 3D system... I think model 2 might be pushing it, as has already been said.

 

[jaycee900]

Yeah i would say zero chance of Model 3 and Model 2 being emulated on the Pandora, these have been technically hard to emulate and as someone has said Model 2 games have only just been emulated to a small degree on pretty high end machines, so you can kiss goodbye to those straight away.
ST-V emulation after a quick check seems to have been very slow like Saturn emulation (which its based off) and considering it was a bitch to program for and a bitch to emulate well I wouldn't be getting on hopes up for a playable release this side of Michael Jacksons retirement!
Model 1 however has been emulated on the PC for a while, but CPU power alone won't be enough to emulate as it requires a GPU to process in parallel, i know my laptop 1.4ghz couldnt run it, but my 3ghz p4 and plain intel onboard graphics could, so technically it could run if someone spends the time optimising and using the PowerVR in the Pandora, good times will be ahead, Virtua Racing is one of my fav arcade racing games to date and a keyboard doesnt do the game justice!
Here's the Model 1 game list;

* Wing War (1994)
* Star Wars Arcade (1994)
* Virtua Fighter (1993)
* Virtua Formula (1992)
* Virtua Racing (1992)

Lets hope someone gets it running through MAME or a seperate emulator.

 

[Yod4z]

* Star Wars Arcade (1994)

Only really fun on real arcade

 

[hedwards]

* Virtua Racing (1992)

I used to love hitting the horse. Great game, one that I wish I could play. Wait a tick, I saw that in one of the videos.

 

[jaycee900]

Even if no-one can get model 1 running fast enough through a verson of MAME that supports it, there is still the Megadrive version (yeah i know!) and 32-X version that I think i recall Notaz was implementng into Picodrive sometime and 3 out of the 5 games were on 32-X as well, so hope yet either way to play these games.

 

[Pleng]

* Virtua Racing (1992)

I used to love hitting the horse. Great game, one that I wish I could play. Wait a tick, I saw that in one of the videos.


Horse? Which track is there a horse in in Virtua Racing?

I often went horse chasing in Daytona CCE on Saturn but never managed to hit one.

If somebody could get model 1 working that would be awesome! Model 2, even better! Not bothered about Model 3. Daytona and Sega Rally are my wet-dream games. If I could play them on the move I'd be hoopy!

Even if no-one can get model 1 running fast enough through a verson of MAME that supports it, there is still the Megadrive version (yeah i know!) and 32-X version that I think i recall Notaz was implementng into Picodrive sometime and 3 out of the 5 games were on 32-X as well, so hope yet either way to play these games.

MAME doesn't yet seem to support Virtua Racing... not that I've been able to get working anyway. VF works pretty well, just a couple of flickering polygons

Virtua Racing on 32X was pretty good gameplay-wise, but nothing on the arcade version visually. VF looked clooser to the arcade version but gameplay was pretty unresponsive.

Never played the Star Wars games on any systems.

Oh, there's also a verson of Virtua Fighter II for the Megadrive, and it plays just fine on a standard GP2X

 

[x68000]

I don't think the latest version of MAME supports VR, but some previous versions do, and it played almost flawlesly (for an emu).

The best bet for VR on the Pandora has to be VR Deluxe from the 32X, plays just like the arcade with a great framerate - More depth too, just lacks the polish on the graphics side.

Virtua Fighter 2 on the Megadrive though had almost NOTHING in common with the Arcade/Saturn/PS2 versions as it was a fully reprogrammed 2D fighter.

 

[Pleng]

Virtua Fighter 2 on the Megadrive though had almost NOTHING in common with the Arcade/Saturn/PS2 versions as it was a fully reprogrammed 2D fighter.

Yes. And it sucked pretty hard.

 

[x68000]

It had a nice highish res title screen though! ..........................oh yeah, and it made the same sound effect when you pressed start as the arcade!

The Saturn version was/is a stunning achievement, especially considering it came out early in the Saturn's life - the first 2nd gen game.

 

[jaycee900]

It had a nice highish res title screen though! ..........................oh yeah, and it made the same sound effect when you pressed start as the arcade!

The Saturn version was/is a stunning achievement, especially considering it came out early in the Saturn's life - the first 2nd gen game.

Trouble was when the arcade version came out it was a milestone, stunning 3D, but by the time the Saturn version was made, Namco were showing off Tekken a texture mapped 3D fighter which was a little while later nigh on arcade perfect converted to the PS1, while the Saturn couldn't quite pull off the flat polygon fighters of the Model 1 arcade game...this was rectified later with a stunning conversion of the Model 2 game Sega Rally, and much better VF2 but the damage was done a year earlier when people could see which was the more powerful of the 2 home consoles, i did like my Saturn but i only bought one when it was reduced to £99 with Sega Rally and Worldwide Soccer! Oh and don't even mention those cases! Whoever designed them needed shooting, worst cases in history bar none!
Sorry going off course a little here!

I've always wanted a arcade perfect conversion of Sega's 1992's Virtua Racing, but it still hasn't happened,
Megadrive Version (1994): Not bad for a 16-bit machine with co-processor in the cartridge, but way off arcade original.
32X Version (1994): Much better, though resolution and framerate still not up there.
Saturn Version (1996): Well made by Time Warner, that was enough to put anyone off! Remember hearing they would convert it and thought oh no! And rightly so, the graphics and sound were ok, but it just 'play' like the original, the added extras didnt do the original justice either.
PS2 Version (2003): I thought right this is it they have the power to do right this time, it was better it seemed all there, but the magic that was the original seemed lacking, you will probably say well it was an arcade game, its magic is in the sit down cabinet etc, well thats partly true but even playing the original through MAME its still they great game that no conversion has matched, i think the 32X version is the best home version to replicate a part of the VR magic, i think esp with the latter releases they try too hard and add more extras, when they should be concentrating on getting it playing like it should, maybe Sega will release as a rom file emulated on the PS3 store, at least that way no-one can screw the conversion up!

 

[x68000]

My comment above (1st line) was about the megadrive version, and below comment was about Virtua Fighter 2 not VF1.

Since this thread is pointless, i feel ready to be flamed so here goes.............

Saturn was more powerful than PS1! We all know that the Saturn was better with 2D titles, but 3D stuff like Panzer Dragoon Zwei is just stunning - even today. Plus, VF2 always looked technically superior to Tekken 2. It was a massive technical success!

Oh, and TimeWarner did make one good title, Taromaru - hard to find though for under £150!

....and since you love Virtua Racing, you need to try the MD version in a Sega Nomad, for some reason it plays about 20% faster than it should (must be a incompatibility issue with the SVP) but it makes a major difference, plus it looks superb on such a small screen!

 

[jaycee900]

My comment above (1st line) was about the megadrive version, and below comment was about Virtua Fighter 2 not VF1.

Since this thread is pointless, i feel ready to be flamed so here goes.............

Saturn was more powerful than PS1! We all know that the Saturn was better with 2D titles, but 3D stuff like Panzer Dragoon Zwei is just stunning - even today. Plus, VF2 always looked technically superior to Tekken 2. It was a massive technical success!

Oh, and TimeWarner did make one good title, Taromaru - hard to find though for under £150!

....and since you love Virtua Racing, you need to try the MD version in a Sega Nomad, for some reason it plays about 20% faster than it should (must be a incompatibility issue with the SVP) but it makes a major difference, plus it looks superb on such a small screen!

Yeah sorry just noticed it was VF2 you were referring too duh! :unsure:
Yeah the Saturn was better 2D wise, but even later 3D titles when the programmers got to grips with the hardware the polygon count wasn't enough to challenge the PS1 you only have too look at like for like releases on both systems and not just 1st party games, i always hated the fact it couldn't do transparent effects in real time, it always ended up with the black tea strainer effect!
I stand by my comment about Time Warner! :lol:
Lastly i have actually played Virtua Racing on a Nomad when i had one 7-8 years ago, yeah it looks stunning on the screen, pity about the massive cartridge pretruding out of the top, i cant even look up to see what the weather's doing on the TV!