calzone
Still Fresh
BRAVO!maxSteiner said:
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Transfers... Tranzfers..
- Thread starter craigix
- Start date
Haven't read the whole thread. Still popping in here about once a week to see if you're any further on and this topic intrigued me.
1 Are there even 2000 people still willing to pre-pay for a Pandora?
2 With all this in mind and with all the crap that the banks, credit card companies and online payment services have thrown at you, what you should have done was form a company and offered 4000 private shares (out of 100000 or however many you wanted to dilute it.) Sell the shares for 200 quid each, on the understanding that the shares could be redeemed in exchange for a nominal cash value (less than was paid) or a Pandora when it was available.
"I am angry at the rabid, foaming at the mouth blind fan boys, who have been denying for the past 4 months that theres any chance that anything could ever ggo wrong, stiffling any kind of discusion on what might happen at this stage because their fragile world view cannot handle the chance that they were wrong about something!"
That's probably one of the biggest things that soured the Pandora for me. The level of censorship and mindmeld expected on the forums is very off-putting to a free-wheeling free speech advocate like myself. It's terrible to consider but there's a LOT that could go wrong with this project, even now.
1 Are there even 2000 people still willing to pre-pay for a Pandora?
2 With all this in mind and with all the crap that the banks, credit card companies and online payment services have thrown at you, what you should have done was form a company and offered 4000 private shares (out of 100000 or however many you wanted to dilute it.) Sell the shares for 200 quid each, on the understanding that the shares could be redeemed in exchange for a nominal cash value (less than was paid) or a Pandora when it was available.
"I am angry at the rabid, foaming at the mouth blind fan boys, who have been denying for the past 4 months that theres any chance that anything could ever ggo wrong, stiffling any kind of discusion on what might happen at this stage because their fragile world view cannot handle the chance that they were wrong about something!"
That's probably one of the biggest things that soured the Pandora for me. The level of censorship and mindmeld expected on the forums is very off-putting to a free-wheeling free speech advocate like myself. It's terrible to consider but there's a LOT that could go wrong with this project, even now.
MaxSteiner
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I agree about the shares +1
Had a nice thread a couple of weeks after putting down my money for a preorder, about ways to increase the companies revenue should things go tits up, and becoming a private limited company and distrubuting shares was one of the ideas which was floated.
Unfortunatly, thie mearest hint of dissent caused a swarm of fanbois to descend, flapping and squaking their incoherant ramblings about how nothing could ever happen to this project, and anyone who didn't like it should cancel their order and leave.
The thread was then locked.
And this has happened EVERY SINGLE time I've seen somebody question the way things are being handled.
But at this stage thats obviously not enough for our fanboy cadre. They need something to hold over the lesser doubters they encounter, those who's hearts are not truly dedicated to the Pandora.
Bank transfers.
If you aren't willing to wire the money over, then you should just kill yourself right now, for you are not truly alive in the light of Pandora!
Blah blah, kaw kaw.
Sick of it.
Honestly, I don't even care about it now.
When I preoderdered my Pandora it wass due in November. '
£220 for a device like that in time for christmas?' I thought to myself, I wants a piece of that! the date slipped to December, then January, now Feb, next month it'll be March, and so on.
The fact is, each and every month we move past November, my need for the Pandora has become less urgent.
I'd still like one, but Im in no rush to recieve it.
I don't really need one, noone needs one.
So why are people getting so worked up over it, or claiming that we have to go against the dictates of common sense and our own internal logic and wire through the cash right now?
Why can't we all just hang on till they've got it sorted?
And if it turns out that a device comes along which you personally belive will give you what you want out of it, decide for yourself whether to cancel your order, or to stick with the Pandora!
Worst comes to the worst, the community will still have the Wiz to develop for
Had a nice thread a couple of weeks after putting down my money for a preorder, about ways to increase the companies revenue should things go tits up, and becoming a private limited company and distrubuting shares was one of the ideas which was floated.
Unfortunatly, thie mearest hint of dissent caused a swarm of fanbois to descend, flapping and squaking their incoherant ramblings about how nothing could ever happen to this project, and anyone who didn't like it should cancel their order and leave.
The thread was then locked.
And this has happened EVERY SINGLE time I've seen somebody question the way things are being handled.
But at this stage thats obviously not enough for our fanboy cadre. They need something to hold over the lesser doubters they encounter, those who's hearts are not truly dedicated to the Pandora.
Bank transfers.
If you aren't willing to wire the money over, then you should just kill yourself right now, for you are not truly alive in the light of Pandora!
Blah blah, kaw kaw.
Sick of it.
Honestly, I don't even care about it now.
When I preoderdered my Pandora it wass due in November. '
£220 for a device like that in time for christmas?' I thought to myself, I wants a piece of that! the date slipped to December, then January, now Feb, next month it'll be March, and so on.
The fact is, each and every month we move past November, my need for the Pandora has become less urgent.
I'd still like one, but Im in no rush to recieve it.
I don't really need one, noone needs one.
So why are people getting so worked up over it, or claiming that we have to go against the dictates of common sense and our own internal logic and wire through the cash right now?
Why can't we all just hang on till they've got it sorted?
And if it turns out that a device comes along which you personally belive will give you what you want out of it, decide for yourself whether to cancel your order, or to stick with the Pandora!
Worst comes to the worst, the community will still have the Wiz to develop for
DisgruntleElf
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The whole thing appears to be a fear tactic to get bank transfers and its working very well. Craig is ignoring this thread and all its suggestions completely. Face it people he wants bank transfers and nothing else.
mali
-
maxSteiner is somewhat on the other side of the fence, but he has always been a straight level-headed guy from his point of view and I appreciate that. For me the situation we have now is a little bit disturbing. And the silence seems to be intentional. Depending on the further development of this situation and reaction of OP(or lack of), I might change my attitude towards this project and just back out. I'd appreciate, if ED would participate more in communications like he did in the past, even though CC and bank probs are not his business. HONESTY is virtue.
theehman
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Couple of suggestions:
1) Any reason why I couldn't purchase a VISA/AMEX/MC prepaid credit card and ship it to the Pandora team as payment for my Pandora? Saves transfer fees and probably transfer headaches.
2) Someone suggested a central US-based account that would collect all the US customer payments and transfer them at one time, cutting most of the transfer fees. I would certainly be willing to act as agent for this. I've done similar things with other people for buying large amounts of semiconductors and guitar effects. Maybe just a $10 added charge for my trouble/share of the final transfer fee? I have an extra bank account I set up just for wire transfers and it's currently sitting there doing nothing. If everything falls through I just transfer the funds to my checking account and write checks to everybody who made a deposit.
1) Any reason why I couldn't purchase a VISA/AMEX/MC prepaid credit card and ship it to the Pandora team as payment for my Pandora? Saves transfer fees and probably transfer headaches.
2) Someone suggested a central US-based account that would collect all the US customer payments and transfer them at one time, cutting most of the transfer fees. I would certainly be willing to act as agent for this. I've done similar things with other people for buying large amounts of semiconductors and guitar effects. Maybe just a $10 added charge for my trouble/share of the final transfer fee? I have an extra bank account I set up just for wire transfers and it's currently sitting there doing nothing. If everything falls through I just transfer the funds to my checking account and write checks to everybody who made a deposit.
RajTakhar
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I Agree With Mali
Starting this furr ball thread - then seeing it ignite, with lots of voices of concern and anxiety cause by this thread might not have been the best thing to do.
DEVS - some positive either from yourselves or Chip are really needed now or else this thread will become the mother of all THREADS!!
Starting this furr ball thread - then seeing it ignite, with lots of voices of concern and anxiety cause by this thread might not have been the best thing to do.
DEVS - some positive either from yourselves or Chip are really needed now or else this thread will become the mother of all THREADS!!
Phawx
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Delete this fucking thread already. We all get the picture. Only people who paid by bank transfer will get a Pandora. Unless economies of scale tipped against our favor and 1000 parts cost $0.68 a piece instead of $0.49. Instead of 200 Euro / Pandora it will not cost us 256 Euro per at the quantities OpenPandora CAN purchase.
Of course, ALL of the LCDs have already been paid for. So maybe the number is much higher.
Basically, what we need right now is some truth to the matter. Or say nothing. I'm still busy trying to get Amex to refund my money, so that I can give it back to you.
Of course, ALL of the LCDs have already been paid for. So maybe the number is much higher.
Basically, what we need right now is some truth to the matter. Or say nothing. I'm still busy trying to get Amex to refund my money, so that I can give it back to you.
calzone
Still Fresh
I've long thought that and it's the cheapest and most effortless way for them to run the business, but their lack of communication has really put me off. It really does look like this silence is intentional!DisgruntleElf said:
Not sure how these threads and the swing towards negative opinions on OpenPandora will play out in the wider web in terms of it's marketing especially as we are (allegedly) so close to launch. Could be damaging.
So come on OP.... TALK TO US - YOUR CUSTOMERS!!!!
If OpenPandora would actually respond then of course the thread would die a natural death and be buried within a couple of days...Phawx said:
However, they continue to ignore it.....
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.Gogeta§§J4BR.
that brazilian guy =`]
no one is lying here, we just have problems to solve ¬¬
Phawx
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There is no problem. We've reached an impasse.
OpenPandora needs money. The remaining balance must be paid through transfer, of which the remaining pre-orderers do not wish to use.
4000 LCDs have been paid for, yet they can't build that many Pandora's. Economies of scale may be against OpenPandora LTD, because of the much smaller quantity they can afford.
I very much doubt they will be able to cover the bill for all Amex users, unless they will get their money after they ship the product, but I have no idea.
Silence may not be lying, but it's just as bad because we are all in the dark and we only hear noises that our imaginations run wild with. We are scared.
I am not scared of losing $300. I am scared that I might not see my Pandora.
OpenPandora needs money. The remaining balance must be paid through transfer, of which the remaining pre-orderers do not wish to use.
4000 LCDs have been paid for, yet they can't build that many Pandora's. Economies of scale may be against OpenPandora LTD, because of the much smaller quantity they can afford.
I very much doubt they will be able to cover the bill for all Amex users, unless they will get their money after they ship the product, but I have no idea.
Silence may not be lying, but it's just as bad because we are all in the dark and we only hear noises that our imaginations run wild with. We are scared.
I am not scared of losing $300. I am scared that I might not see my Pandora.
zaffercharles
Member
Maybe I would not be able to buy a P after all and my reorder place in line, which was guaranteed once, means nothing any more because there's no choice but to gamble on a bank transfer. And that's exactly how it seems right now, you've said pretty much that.
This stringalong business has gone on long enough for me. I neither need one of these badly enough, have 200 to gamble on P seeing the light of day, nor have enough faith in OP to go for it anyway, even if the first two criteria were met. And that's because of the shoddy way info is given here and the constant guessing game about release.
First it's out october. No, november. No,december. No, january. wait, january 15th we get a prototype (!) and out feb. No, march.
I spread the word around about P, and as you guys are obviously having difficulties but not saying exactly how it really is right now, I feel like a bit of an idiot to have hyped and believed in this at all.
If the deal is that we need to gamble to make it happen clearly say so, if the deal is, bank transfer or wait until the (alleged) second batch say so, if the deal is you're going ahead and finishing anyway and CC can start later, what the hell is all this for in the first place?
True it doesn't matter to me any more since I'll be waiting indefinitely now, hopefully buying one later on this year (MUCH later?) if and when it's an actual physical, finished model.
But come on. I still want to believe it will see the light of day, and watched this from the very start..
What's the real point of this stirring with no replies?
If the wider web gets hold of this mess it's really going to hit you. The project seems to be going to shit and even true believers are starting to doubt. Say something!
This stringalong business has gone on long enough for me. I neither need one of these badly enough, have 200 to gamble on P seeing the light of day, nor have enough faith in OP to go for it anyway, even if the first two criteria were met. And that's because of the shoddy way info is given here and the constant guessing game about release.
First it's out october. No, november. No,december. No, january. wait, january 15th we get a prototype (!) and out feb. No, march.
I spread the word around about P, and as you guys are obviously having difficulties but not saying exactly how it really is right now, I feel like a bit of an idiot to have hyped and believed in this at all.
If the deal is that we need to gamble to make it happen clearly say so, if the deal is, bank transfer or wait until the (alleged) second batch say so, if the deal is you're going ahead and finishing anyway and CC can start later, what the hell is all this for in the first place?
True it doesn't matter to me any more since I'll be waiting indefinitely now, hopefully buying one later on this year (MUCH later?) if and when it's an actual physical, finished model.
But come on. I still want to believe it will see the light of day, and watched this from the very start..
What's the real point of this stirring with no replies?
If the wider web gets hold of this mess it's really going to hit you. The project seems to be going to shit and even true believers are starting to doubt. Say something!
I believe Chip already stated it. The Pandora IS being made. Whether it's 1,000 or all 4,000, they will be made. The problem IS the payment method. Most are not willing to do bank transfer, which is the preferred method. So right now we are at a stand still. Those who already paid through bank transfer and those who are waiting for CC to reopen.
My issue is with HSBC who is holding my money for no apparent reason. I'll probably do a bank transfer sometime this week and wait until the AMEX issue clears up. If I end up buying 2 Pandoras, then my avatar doesn't lie.
Let's sum it up here for those who got refunds. If you want a Pandora, do a bank transfer. If you rather pay through CC, then wait. You've waited this long already.
For us AMEX customer, if you really want a Pandora first and have the extra funds, do a bank transfer and wait for the bank issue to clear up. I am pretty sure you will get your money back. It's all a matter of when. Even though Craig said he'll take the hit, I'd hate to see him or anyone start a project like this and not get rewarded for their hard work.
My issue is with HSBC who is holding my money for no apparent reason. I'll probably do a bank transfer sometime this week and wait until the AMEX issue clears up. If I end up buying 2 Pandoras, then my avatar doesn't lie.
Let's sum it up here for those who got refunds. If you want a Pandora, do a bank transfer. If you rather pay through CC, then wait. You've waited this long already.
For us AMEX customer, if you really want a Pandora first and have the extra funds, do a bank transfer and wait for the bank issue to clear up. I am pretty sure you will get your money back. It's all a matter of when. Even though Craig said he'll take the hit, I'd hate to see him or anyone start a project like this and not get rewarded for their hard work.
Zeno Arrow
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@all
Still think that if we're prepared to drop the idea that your place in the pre-order queue must be maintained at all costs then all the problems with the current payment situation will go away. Why no one else seems to be really picking up on this is beyond me.
Still think that if we're prepared to drop the idea that your place in the pre-order queue must be maintained at all costs then all the problems with the current payment situation will go away. Why no one else seems to be really picking up on this is beyond me.
superquake
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Can OP just put an end to this misery?
If money isn't an issue as far as manufacturing goes, just make the bloody units and sell to the people who HAVE paid. When you actually have the product on hand, sell to the people who want to pay with a credit card - after all, it shouldn't be a problem to accept credit card orders when you are within 30 days of being able to deliver the product, right?
Being stuck in limbo is terrible. My confidence in this project is almost so low that I almost couldn't care less about the Pandora any more. I'm glad I got my money back, as how this situation has been handled the last couple of months as far as the customer is concerned is an absolute shambles. The fact that Craig has been running his business successfully for some years now, selling the GP32 (yes, I bought one of those), the GP2X etc., it is absolutely astounding that there have been so many cock-ups of such magnitude and so many unforeseen bumps in the road on the business-side of things.
I'm quite willing to sacrifice my place in the queue (if that's even still valid) to see how this is resolved. I want a Pandora, but like any sane person I'm not willing to put up with this nonsense, and given the track record of business proceedings so far I am absolutely not willing to take the risk of doing a bank transfer. I really believe that OP are not scammers, but after so many problems I simply don't trust them enough to risk the £200. I'll bide my time and buy one of the leftovers from the first batch, or one of the second batch if necessary.
OP - we, the customer, just need to know EXACTLY where we stand. Tell us the state of the production, and what criteria need to be met before the first batch (whether it's the full batch, or a reduced 'part batch') is produced and shipped. Put an end to this bullshit - you're jeopardising your potential success with the device for future batches and people outside these forums by making yourselves seem utterly incompetent.
If money isn't an issue as far as manufacturing goes, just make the bloody units and sell to the people who HAVE paid. When you actually have the product on hand, sell to the people who want to pay with a credit card - after all, it shouldn't be a problem to accept credit card orders when you are within 30 days of being able to deliver the product, right?
Being stuck in limbo is terrible. My confidence in this project is almost so low that I almost couldn't care less about the Pandora any more. I'm glad I got my money back, as how this situation has been handled the last couple of months as far as the customer is concerned is an absolute shambles. The fact that Craig has been running his business successfully for some years now, selling the GP32 (yes, I bought one of those), the GP2X etc., it is absolutely astounding that there have been so many cock-ups of such magnitude and so many unforeseen bumps in the road on the business-side of things.
I'm quite willing to sacrifice my place in the queue (if that's even still valid) to see how this is resolved. I want a Pandora, but like any sane person I'm not willing to put up with this nonsense, and given the track record of business proceedings so far I am absolutely not willing to take the risk of doing a bank transfer. I really believe that OP are not scammers, but after so many problems I simply don't trust them enough to risk the £200. I'll bide my time and buy one of the leftovers from the first batch, or one of the second batch if necessary.
OP - we, the customer, just need to know EXACTLY where we stand. Tell us the state of the production, and what criteria need to be met before the first batch (whether it's the full batch, or a reduced 'part batch') is produced and shipped. Put an end to this bullshit - you're jeopardising your potential success with the device for future batches and people outside these forums by making yourselves seem utterly incompetent.
Consequence_9
have you realized that rock stars always seem to l
Thats a bit much & you need to take into account that hawking consoles made by someone else & making one of your own are two different things entirely. Plus this project is of a much bigger magnitude.superquake said:
Having said that I must agree that we need a statement from the team and soon.
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Phawx
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@superquake
I think the problem is, the people who HAVE paid are the only way they will have product on Hand.
They've already said that they won't be making any money since they chose to do 256MB of ram. We know they have paid for 4000 LCDs.
They *may* only have enough money to "sell" to those who have paid. But there is no profit as far as I can see.
No Profit = No Second Batch. No Second Batch = No CC Orders.
So EVERYONE who wanted a Pandora needs to pay by Bank transfer (upto 60% of total order) So that we can finish CC orders. Unfortunately, I don't think people trust OpenPandora to deliver.
Unless some angel investor steps in, I don't see a Second batch happening, unless the second batch pays by bank transfer.
I think the problem is, the people who HAVE paid are the only way they will have product on Hand.
They've already said that they won't be making any money since they chose to do 256MB of ram. We know they have paid for 4000 LCDs.
They *may* only have enough money to "sell" to those who have paid. But there is no profit as far as I can see.
No Profit = No Second Batch. No Second Batch = No CC Orders.
So EVERYONE who wanted a Pandora needs to pay by Bank transfer (upto 60% of total order) So that we can finish CC orders. Unfortunately, I don't think people trust OpenPandora to deliver.
Unless some angel investor steps in, I don't see a Second batch happening, unless the second batch pays by bank transfer.
Consequence_9
have you realized that rock stars always seem to l
Phawx said:
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calzone
Still Fresh
according to his profile, Craig seems to be logged on right now....
maybe he's preparing a nice long detailed response???
lol!
maybe he's preparing a nice long detailed response???
lol!
