Pandora 2 probability debate

[bukkit]

I already admitted I was wrong for trying to suggest that you were afraid of losing your money, I don't know what more you want. It's obvious your view on reality (particularly when it comes to how word definitions are applied) is so far removed from my own that there can be no reconciliation. I should have realized this when you originally insisted you weren't asking for details, so I apologize.

I don't know what to say, except, I don't know what makes you think I should want anything (more).

I accepted your first apology. (This one seems to be kinda off-target, coupled with a veiled half-insult, and hard to decide what exactly it is for, so I skip. Apologies on my behalf if I misread that.)

Essentially, and I try to put that as careful as possible in the hope you don't again consider an attack or insult, which it isn't intended to be: You should try to learn where facts end and your view of the world begins. There can be many such views, and they can differ wildly, and there is differing and changing authority of those, depending on which part of the world is judged by whom. But in this discussion, up until your second to last post, you presented your view of the world, including your opinion about my feelings, as a factual truth and insisted on it.

To give another example: You shouldn't call questions irrelevant, just because it's your, possibly limited, understanding they are. My question was relevant to me and others. You're free to believe they're irrelevant however, and to (preferably politely) say so, too, but you also should allow a differing opinion. (A lot of which you didn't, I think you remember.)

Just the same: If you still believe I was asking about details, you're free to do so, and you always were. You should, however, make clear it's an opinion and allow me a different opinion. That's all. There's absolutely nothing I want beyond that, concerning what this thread meanwhile is about.

 

[WizardStan]

I don't know what to say, except, I don't know what makes you think I should want anything (more).

Because you keep going as if you're expecting further responses. Your post is full of more comments trying to prove your point after I already said I understood what the issue at hand is and that there is nothing further I can say to add to the debate.Do you want me to say "yes, absolutely, everything you have just said is 100% correct and there is no further need to say anything on the subject"? Because I will, if that's what it will take to get some closure.

 

[bukkit]

I also thought it best to lay low a bit and not come off as a total crazy person after a while.

FAIL.

This place is about a technological device and I'd rather learn what I can, while I can.  I seriously doubt that I'll be reprising my role as a TV show host in the near future...but thanks for remembering.  

Oh, to be true, I actually found you did remarkably well in both areas (I found the serious posts later). And I found both worth reading.

(In fact I never thought I could end up maintaining my own thread of comparative relevance and certainly less entertainment, but look, here I am.)

 

[bukkit]

I don't know what to say, except, I don't know what makes you think I should want anything (more).

Because you keep going as if you're expecting further responses. Your post is full of more comments trying to prove your point after I already said I understood what the issue at hand is and that there is nothing further I can say to add to the debate.
Do you want me to say "yes, absolutely, everything you have just said is 100% correct and there is no further need to say anything on the subject"? Because I will, if that's what it will take to get some closure.

Ah, no. That would be wrong, too. And it's another misunderstanding. This thread started with misunderstandings of what I want and misinterpretations of what I wrote, I kinda feel compelled to at least try to clear up all of them. That's the reason I'm writing on. But that might not work. And sorry if that troubles you, this is not what I want.


You are and were free to go anytime. I'm not expecting responses. But I seem not to be able to express that, so tell me what you need to go and be released from here? The last word? You can have it. (I should mention that it probably only works if it's not a misunderstanding or misrepresentation of my words or an insult or somesuch. Everything else should be fine.)

 

[WizardStan]

You are and were free to go anytime. I'm not expecting responses. But I seem not to be able to express that, so tell me what you need to go and be released from here? The last word? You can have it. (I should mention that it probably only works if it's not a misunderstanding or misrepresentation of my words or an insult or somesuch. Everything else should be fine.)

You've already had the last word several times, I keep telling you it is yours. Even this post you just made contains more of you trying to restart the debate with talk about clearing up misunderstandings. There is nothing more either of us can learn from continuing. Everything that needed to be said is contained in the last several pages. Just say something that pertains to the debate that doesn't carry a suggestion that you still have more things to say.

 

[aatu]

@WizardStan:

Actually, bukkit was right about you giving half-insults. The apology (or admission of a mistake or whatever) feels kind of hollow if you just follow it with an insult, challenge or something similar. It's like saying "I'm sorry you're weak" after punching someone. If you want to apologize, then say it like you mean it. If you don't see a reason to apologize, then just politely say you disagree with him on this matter.

And I would like to clear one apparent misunderstanding, that you're seemingly unwilling to address directly:
You didn't just SUGGEST he was afraid. You tried to drive through with that on brute force.

PS. Not saying that bukkit's posts wouldn't contain half-insults, too.
PS2. Hmm, actually scratch that. He's probably not giving half-insults, it's more like he's just being quite blunt with what he's saying.
PS3. While your last post doesn't contain any obvious insults, it doesn't directly admit a mistake or disagreement, either.
PS4. Actually, the thread could have simply ended with your last post, but I'm quite insensitive with that regard, so sorry about that...

 

[WizardStan]

Actually, bukkit was right about you giving half-insults. The apology (or admission of a mistake or whatever) feels kind of hollow if you just follow it with an insult, challenge or something similar. It's like saying "I'm sorry you're weak" after punching someone. If you want to apologize, then say it like you mean it. If you don't see a reason to apologize, then just politely say you disagree with him on this matter.

Nope. There's just a fundamental difference in how we perceive the world. I apologized that I didn't catch it sooner, and failed to realize how it would be perceived. There was no insult intended, just a fact of reality. I'll do better in the future.

You didn't just SUGGEST he was afraid. You tried to drive through with that on brute force.

Case in point.

 

[aatu]

 

[Exophase]

Glad to see this has evolved from an obnoxious and pointless argument to an obnoxious and pointless argument about an obnoxious and pointless argument.

Calling this blown out of proportion is putting it mildly. I don't know why you two are so bent out of shape over WizardStan describing bukkit's reluctance and reservation as being afraid of the outcome.

Case in point. Sounded a lot like "I'm sorry you're so stupid and that you don't understand anything". If I were on the receiving end, I wouldn't accept that as a proper apology or an admission of a mistake.

Only that's not at all what he said, only that their two perceptions are very different, and I don't see what's so insulting about that. But I guess there's no problem with you ascribing deeper intent to his words, it's just bad when he does it..

 

[Binky]

Anyone want me to move the pointless argument to a new thread?

 

[Exophase]

Anyone want me to move the pointless argument to a new thread?

Me.

 

[aatu]

@Exophase:

Regarding why so out of proportion:
Well for me, I like to debate.

Although I do want to apologize for the last interpretation (but only that). I was hungry and a little bit on the edge, so it came out as a little extreme. Though I still stand behind the point itself.

Regarding the insult and interpretation:
No, the idea behind the post isn't what's the problem. It's the way he presents it. If he wanted to simply back out of the conversation, he could do it graciously. And I'd reckon he would know how to. But instead he downplayed the other party. Or do YOU (or anyone else?) disagree that there's a certain "sting" in his words? And no, I won't insist on the interpretation if he gives viable arguments for it.

But yeah, I personally won't mind if this "fear" discussion is moved to Off-topic (which it really is), we can continue there.

And I'm sorry if this feels like I'm dragging anyone else into the debate against their will...

 

[vcoleiro1]

Anyone want me to move the pointless argument to a new thread?

So you are going to move this whole thread to another thread ? 

 

[bukkit]

Glad to see this has evolved from an obnoxious and pointless argument to an obnoxious and pointless argument about an obnoxious and pointless argument.

Hehe.

Only that's not at all what he said, only that their two perceptions are very different, and I don't see what's so insulting about that.

I could explain that. But it'd probably blow everything out of proportion even more and I guess you're not really interested, which I absolutely don't mind.

But I guess there's no problem with you ascribing deeper intent to his words, it's just bad when he does it..

This is kinda uncalled for. The main difference, and that's what was driving this thread, is that WizardStan was claiming his perceptions as truth and didn't accept any objections. Which aatu both didn't. He's clearly marking his words as "sounding as" and in subjunctive, and if WizardStan would object and claim that it wasn't intended as an insult, it would be accepted as his view on the truth. Both wasn't granted to me for quite a while.

 

[bukkit]

You've already had the last word several times, I keep telling you it is yours. Even this post you just made contains more of you trying to restart the debate with talk about clearing up misunderstandings. There is nothing more either of us can learn from continuing. Everything that needed to be said is contained in the last several pages. Just say something that pertains to the debate that doesn't carry a suggestion that you still have more things to say.

That's what I tried to do the last three posts. Would "good bye" work?

 

[Franko]

Fin

Fini

End scene....

...(pulls curtains together)....

 

[Binky]

Anyone want me to move the pointless argument to a new thread?

So you are going to move this whole thread to another thread ? 

No - the forum database has borked and gives me error messages whenever I try (other mods are OK though)