Our New Machine, Pandora

[God Ginrai]

The keyboard feeling all depends, IMO on how large the keyboard actually will be. If the keyboard is large enough that you can actually put your hands over it and type on it like a real keyboard, then I would suggest that making them feel like Laptop keys. But if it's something we're going to have to thumb, then I think it would be better to make them feel more like game buttons.

-God Ginrai

 

[zaffercharles]

I think the keyboards on the Psions are the best I ever tried. If that's the first type MWeston brought up try to go for something that feels like that.
Initially hard to press, clicky phone buttons with barely any travel sound awful and would seriously affect my desire to use it, personally. I'm someone who wants to use this thing in every way open to me not just gaming, I know that's the emphasis of this and I'm here for that too, but if the keyboard cannot be of a high quality and comfort, then I'd tend to switch positions on the lighting matter and say sure, leave the light out and just make it as cheap as you can and add either something else to it or enhance another aspect instead. That's if it will never feel comfortable to use regardless.

That said though I can't help thinking it might be best to click them having so little travel. If they have to be so shallow perhaps it's for the best if they do.
Because I'm just thinking- if the keyboard is awful (and 1mm travel doesn't sound great for stuff focused on key use) there will be even less inclination to use it in the dark!!

I realise this will be smaller and I don't know if it's feasible to feel similar to, I think it was the 5 series Psion with so little travel in the keys but I'd rather them feel padded.

 

[atomicthumbs]

I think the keyboards on the Psions are the best I ever tried. If that's the first type MWeston brought up try to go for something that feels like that.
Initially hard to press, clicky phone buttons with barely any travel sound awful and would seriously affect my desire to use it, personally. I'm someone who wants to use this thing in every way open to me not just gaming, I know that's the emphasis of this and I'm here for that too, but if the keyboard cannot be of a high quality and comfort, then I'd tend to switch positions on the lighting matter and say sure, leave the light out and just make it as cheap as you can and add either something else to it or enhance another aspect instead. That's if it will never feel comfortable to use regardless.

That said though I can't help thinking it might be best to click them having so little travel. If they have to be so shallow perhaps it's for the best if they do.
Because I'm just thinking- if the keyboard is awful (and 1mm travel doesn't sound great for stuff focused on key use) there will be even less inclination to use it in the dark!!

I realise this will be smaller and I don't know if it's feasible to feel similar to, I think it was the 5 series Psion with so little travel in the keys but I'd rather them feel padded.

That sounds about the same as my Jornada 720. I almost bought a Psion 7 instead of that, but I lost the auction. The 720 is better anyway.

we will type with our thumbs anyways


I won't.

 

[God Ginrai]

we will type with our thumbs anyways


I won't.

You will if the keyboard isn't very large, unless you are partial to poking with your index finger. Remember, they never told us how big the keyboard would be.

-God Ginrai

 

[capnhack]

is the click people are talking about here referring to the sound or the tactile nature of the buttons? obviously it wouldnt be good if it made a clicking noise but there are definite usability advantages from keys which provide resistance before making contact across the switch, rather than something like the types of switches they use in remote controls or gamepads where theres no way to tell whether a keypress has gone through or not (ie those little rubber nipples with the conductive material underneath).

i just realised how badly i explained that, so to clarify: a key should resist up until a point and when that resistance gives way it should immediately register the keypress. no grey area between touching the key and it registering, just up or down.

 

[zaffercharles]

You will if the keyboard isn't very large, unless you are partial to poking with your index finger. Remember, they never told us how big the keyboard would be.

-God Ginrai

And what you said above was basically what I was thinking, but better said. If it will have to be pokey and functional, let's not spend money on lighting it after all. And do whatever ends up working best considering size.

I don't mean to sound negative I can live with whatever we get after all it has already got some high specs and I suppose we can't expect luxury throughout here within its estimated price range. And as far as Americans are concerned it best not go up much I guess :lol:


Anyway off topic, I still have no idea if Craig got my address after getting email problems.. I cocked it up a couple of times maybe he got them maybe not- I hope he's around to see this sometime and just let me know if the info is on its way or not? I can't bear thinking I might be missing out lol, and it's in everyones interest I get it too because I'll share it anyway provided I don't get told not to

 

[atomicthumbs]

we will type with our thumbs anyways


I won't.

You will if the keyboard isn't very large, unless you are partial to poking with your index finger. Remember, they never told us how big the keyboard would be.

-God Ginrai

If I can type normally on a Blackberry keyboard, I can type normally on this thing. And I can type normally on a Blackberry keyboard.

 

[realyst]

The regular Alt button isn't used for that. As atomicthumbs states in the quote below, it is AltGr:

AltGr or AltChar are only used to bring out characters that are tied to existing alphabetical keys. When I want to type my name (Réal), I type R[alt+0233]al.

AltGr(or AltChr or whatever language your keyboard is in) is nothing more then an extra "shift" key for a specific language. We have AltChar on French Canadian keyboards, but many of the places I've worked at don't have them so either I set up the language options in Windows and remember what key does what or use the alt+#keys.

This is a standard that dates way the hell back and I remember reading somewhere that this is handled by the keyboard controller itself. Having an application use alt+[number key] is stupid and shouldn't be done because it probably wouldn't even work.

 

[DaveC]

I have another question for the group. What type of feel is your favorite for a mobile keypad? Obviously the travel is low and the button only presses down 1mm or even less, but would you rather it felt like a game button with the slight 'springy-ness' of those buttons, or be a more stiff press with that click sound (like a lot of cell phone numeric pads)?

What does the new Nokia N810 feel like? anyone know?

Game button since sometimes the keys may be used for games. If you rotate the unit for arcade stuff you will probably use some keyboard keys for fire buttons etc. Other times we may use the keyboard buttons for games that have more keys that are needed. I would definetly go for something that has good game action. Clicky keys will feel like some old TI calculator.

 

[trooper]

I`m not too sure about the overall physical size of the machine, But here`s a pic of my trusty Psion series 5`s keyboard with a tape measure along side for size reference.

Here`s a larger pic, Click.

If the Craiginator is large enough to accommodate a keyboard of this size, I think is would be the best alternative to anything else out there. It has a low profile (Very much like a laptops), But only 5 mm in height and could slide out from underneath the console, Without making the machine too thick.

Here`s a closer pic, Click.

Excuse the rusty tape, It`s my work tape and the only one i had to hand. :rolleyes:

Trooper

 

[icurafu]

I have another question for the group. What type of feel is your favorite for a mobile keypad? Obviously the travel is low and the button only presses down 1mm or even less, but would you rather it felt like a game button with the slight 'springy-ness' of those buttons, or be a more stiff press with that click sound (like a lot of cell phone numeric pads)?

A lot of people seem to think that the OQO has the best keyboard on a handheld device.

http://www.umpcportal.com/modules/news/art...hp?storyid=1046

 

[MWeston]

I`m not too sure about the overall physical size of the machine, But here`s a pic of my trusty Psion series 5`s keyboard with a tape measure along side for size reference.

The Psion series 5 is bigger than the craiginator in both width and length so that keyboard would never fit. I would imagine that keyboard is what I meant by springiness. More like a laptop keyboard but not quite because the buttons are smaller and have less depth to work with.

Also, the clicky button option would be like the old Nintendo DS buttons. They aren't terribly loud but they do click.

 

[zaffercharles]

That's the beauty to use, the 5. If it can happen make them as similar as you can to that

edit: how small is tis going to be? I'm all for putting it in my pocket but jeez less than 6.5 ins wide and ultra slim? I wasn't expecting that

 

[Firefox]

The Psion series 5 is bigger than the craiginator in both width and length

Ah-ha! More info!

The feel of the Psion 5's keys is pretty good for gaming. Not that I have many games for it...

For me, one of the things that makes the Nokia N800 poor for gaming (apart from the layout) is that the buttons and d-pad are too "crunchy"; you need a fair amount of force to make them click which isn't good for quick reactions in games. I'd personally welcome light and responsive keys on the Craiginator.

 

[JyCet]

This keyboard is not to write a book so for me a small key like zaurus pda familly is perfect:

I like telecommande keys when the fingers dont slide

 

[teggun]

err I will for ctrl+alt+del when I load windows up on this badboy!

and how are you going to do that exactly?


Using 1337 techniques that you n00bs don't even know about!

Seriously though I think a lot of people are starting to get bored with this thread, considering when the discussion is about what kind of lighting we're going to use for the keyboard, when the design has apparently been pretty much completed anyway so really no one cares.

Just show us a sneak preview or close the thread! this is getting dumb.

 

[Tobriand]

considering when the discussion is about what kind of lighting we're going to use for the keyboard, when the design has apparently been pretty much completed anyway

Actually, that was sparked by MWeston asking whether they should use lighting on the keyboard or not, and since MWeston is involved in the design of the beast, it makes sense that the discussion branches down such paths when defined by him.

But yes, we are all impatient for actual design images. I'm guessing promotional packs will start arriving next week (pure guess, no knowledge about that at all) though, so hopefully that'll give us some more detailed ideas .

 

[javaJake]

Arrghh, when can we see some pictures of this? I'm refreshing this page each day, hoping some pics are posted. :rolleyes:

Yeah, this prick-tease is starting to wear thin.


What you rather have: them not tell you anything until they release the device, or them tell you tenative information or tenative dates with no guarantees attached?

I'll say it again: If we expect them to give us more information or dates, we have to expect this sort of thing. If we moan about their teasing (which I'll bet isn't done just for the purpose of "prick-teasing") that will cause MWelson and CragIX and the rest to not give us information or dates.

Really, in the development world, dates are troublesome beasts that developers can't predict easily.

 

[Squidge]

Seriously though I think a lot of people are starting to get bored with this thread, considering when the discussion is about what kind of lighting we're going to use for the keyboard, when the design has apparently been pretty much completed anyway so really no one cares.

Just show us a sneak preview or close the thread! this is getting dumb.

Thats a bit selfish isn't it? Just because you are getting bored with a particular thread, you want it closed?

When I get bored with a thread, I stop reading it. Maybe you could do the same? However, I think you do want the info, but you are getting impatient about the lack of concrete information. Nothing can be done about that however. It's pointless saying "It's going to be like this" and then changing it a month later when it's found out to be too costly, impractical, etc.

Yes, the design has been pretty much completed, but there are still an amount of tweaking to be done, specially on the keyboard front.

 

[lubidog]

Give them time to get it right! A bit of trust wouldn't hurt.