Nintendo Sixty Fooooooooooooooooooour!

[rv6502]

@WizardStan: If camera transformations don't affect overlays and only the 3D scene instead then the camera could be "adjusted" by the emulator to have wider FOV (essentialy compressing the 3D scene horizontally) and the scene is rendered with wide screen resolution. The overlays will remain streched though.

Which is exactly what Exophase said should not be possible. And yet we're seeing it. Conclusion: magic!

its simple to do when emulating a system with hardware-transform,
projections matrices with perspective are different from 2D/Ortho matrices.

Ortho (HUD) matrices have [3,3] set to 1 to force the vector's [w] as 1,
Perspective (3D Environment) sets the resulting [w] component to a factor of [z] so [3,3] is usually zero

you then know when the game's trying to render a scene or the HUD, you can then scale the scene's FOV

the only issue is if the game hides off-screen geometry in software or using a hardware-transform feedback mechanism.
if the game does it in software, things wont show up until they're within the game's normal FOV.

 

[WizardStan]

its simple to do when emulating a system with hardware-transform,
projections matrices with perspective are different from 2D/Ortho matrices.

Yes yes, it can be done, but as far as I am aware it needs to be done intentionally by changing the renderer. This was just a simple conversion which should (if I'm understanding correctly) have resulted in a uniform stretch. We're not seeing a uniform stretch, we're seeing some stretch, and some increased FOV, which leads me to think it's a fortunate bug somewhere.

 

[Exophase]

Yes yes, it can be done, but as far as I am aware it needs to be done intentionally by changing the renderer. This was just a simple conversion which should (if I'm understanding correctly) have resulted in a uniform stretch. We're not seeing a uniform stretch, we're seeing some stretch, and some increased FOV, which leads me to think it's a fortunate bug somewhere.

What he was saying is that you can differentiate based on the projection matrix. You otherwise have to scale and change the clip space based on this. An LLE N64 emulator would not be capable of performing this, but clearly with HLE at least changing the clip region is possible, or MDave's screenshot wouldn't make sense. This might not apply for all ucodes.

If glN64 really is doing anything like this then it should really be turned off so it isn't wasting resources switching scaling/clipping inbetween different perspective matrices. It would also not be doing things straight to 800x480, or else Mario wouldn't be off aspect.

 

[Phawx]

Hopefully I am getting my point across. The more important thing is that Craig already stated that adjustments can be made, so all is well. It's not that we care to have Mario do his tippy-toe animation, it's that the full range of control is available for us to finesse. Otherwise, why not just replace the analog stick with a digital button and have him run everywhere?

I think you're worrying over nothing. We saw Mario run everywhere because Craig was pushing the pad fully in all directions. It's not because it isn't capable of the finer motion, it's that he didn't demonstrate it, and that is fine.

I'm not worrying at all. If you read what you quoted me on, I already stated "...the more important thing is that Craig already stated that adjustments can be made, so all is well."

And right now, *in it's current form*, Craig DID demonstrate Mario walking by barely pushing on the analog stick. So it's not a problem with the analog controls, its just a matter of adjusting. Again, nothing to worry about.

I was merely replying to the person saying, Why do we care if Mario can tip-toe or not. My only point was that tight controls are the root issue.

 

[Sphinxter]

Lol, I can already see it now...2Pac receiving his Pandora in the mail and showing us YouTube vids of it, while he raps in the background.

[quote name ='Tupak']
Tra la la la la la
all you doubters die
[/quote]

 

[danielliu88888]

craig playing starfox on the pandora has got me all rehyped again

 

[Ravnos]

Everyone's got their games they want to see in these videos, but I'd be interested in seeing how Paper Mario runs. And Doom64, but I think I might be the only person who considers that a priority. I'll be happy as long as this thing runs the Zelda games reasonably well, but those two would be gravy.

 

[Phawx]

@Ravnos

Does Doom64 have something Doom doesn't have?

 

[wermy]

@Ravnos

Does Doom64 have something Doom doesn't have?

Twice as many bits!

Just kidding. Wikipedia tells the differences: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doom_64

 

[WizardStan]

Everyone's got their games they want to see in these videos, but I'd be interested in seeing how Paper Mario runs. And Doom64, but I think I might be the only person who considers that a priority. I'll be happy as long as this thing runs the Zelda games reasonably well, but those two would be gravy.

I would prefer Craig didn't demo any of the games I want to play. I like the idea of discovering first hand whether a particular game will or won't work, like opening up a gift at Christmas: even if it's an itchy sweater from Gramma, I'd still be upset if someone else opened it first

 

[HackModford]

I seriously can't wait to travel across Hyrule field again (for the umpteenth time) on my Pandora.

I've avoided playing the game for the last year and a half in the hopes I'd play through it once again on my Pandora.

I've done just that with Ocarina and Link to the Past :lol:

 

[kingoddball]

my report on n64iphone(only tested the roms in my collection):

Crashing Games:
Goldeneye Crashes.
Carmageddon Crashes.
Perfect Dark Crashes.(one of my fav n64 games)
C&C Crashes.
Holy Magic Century Crashes when starting a new game.
Mission: Impossible crashes after first screen.
Quest 64 crashes after first screen.
Pokemon Stadium 2 crashes after N64 screen.
South Park(one of my fav n64 games) crashes.
Starcraft 64 Crashes.
Turok crashes.
Turok 2 crashes.
Turok 3 crashes.
Vigilante 8 - 3nd Offensive says something about controller pack and i cant click it away to continue.

Working games(no framerate counter and sound enabled):
Banjoo Kazooi: Very slow, would not call it playable. But it runs and i cant see graphical bugs/errors. (i'd say 8~15FPS)
Duke Nukem 64: A tiny bit faster then Banjoo Kazooi, but i cant move forwards. No graphical bugs so far.
Earthworm Jim 3Done of my fav n64 games): Runs pretty smooth, playable. No graphical bugs.(so far) (i'd say 15~25FPS)
Legend of Zelds Ocarina of Time Master Quest: Runs slow, but also none graphical bugs.(i'd say 5~10FPS)
Rampage 2 - Universal Tour: Plays almost full speed with no graphical bugs or whatever. (i'd say 20~30FPS)
Super Mario 64: I would call it playable but i have no entered first mission yet. Some graphical glitches are available to(although not many) (i'd say 18~25FPS)
Super Smash Bros: Slow, but playable. Just like mario 64 some graphical bugs. (i'd say 15~20FPS)
007 The world is not enough: I'd say 10~15 FPS but it crashes once going ingame.(the ingame cutscene works)

Remember this is on n64iphone not on the pandora emulator. The Pandora will be able to run it faster because the iphone still has its large OS and other things pre-loaded.
Also, this is a early version of n64iphone. Im sure the most crashing games will be supported in the future.
N64iphone already runs faster then Daedalus for psp, although not alot.

Hi There borgqueenx,
I have a few quick questions about your expierence with iPhoneN64.

Are you using a 3GS?
Do you have SBsettings installed?
(if so)Did you kill all processes that are running AND free up memory?
Did you put your phone into Aeroplane mode? (It does help speed on games)
Also, did you test N64 in SAFE MODE? It helps with Speed and Memory.

Another things that MAY help (no clue if it does), play the N64 games from UNZIPPED. Just a thought, no info to back that up.

If someone can test with the above being done, I'm sure the results may differ from BorgQ's.

 

[HackModford]

Okay... First off I have an iPod Touch 3rd Gen 64GB
I have SBSettings
I freed up memory
and ran Super Mario 64
So far it seems consistent...
I'm going to try safemode now...
Didn't seem to make a difference...

 

[kingoddball]

That Sucks.
I does make a difference playing higher ended games on my iPhone 3G.
Nevermind then.
It's lucky I don't want to play N64 on my phone.
I'm very excited and waiting like a kid on christmas for my Pandora.

Although, with the iPhone running N64, as good as it in in such early stages (at 600mhz/non overclockable IIRC), it's great news, as the Pandora can also clock to 900Mhz (why is everyone running at 850Mhz for testing? Are they like the GP2X where not everyone can get a decent clock speed? My GP2x dies at anything over 240Mhz).

 

[gruso]

the Pandora can also clock to 900Mhz (why is everyone running at 850Mhz for testing? Are they like the GP2X where not everyone can get a decent clock speed? My GP2x dies at anything over 240Mhz).

900mhz isn't guaranteed for everyone, it was done a few times very early on and somehow became the defacto specification. It should be thought of as a 600mhz CPU and nothing more - any speed you achieve above that is a nice bonus. (Like the GP2X, overclockability will vary between units).

Seeing a number of different dev units happily running at 850 is a nice sign though.

 

[zhasha]

It should be thought of as a 600mhz CPU and nothing more - any speed you achieve above that is a nice bonus. (Like the GP2X, overclockability will vary between units).

well, TI did raise the bar a little and admitted that that specific chipset was more of a 720MHz-ish caliber. No change to the hardware as you most likely know, just admitting to it being more capable than they originally dared. So technically, it should now be thought of as a 720MHz device.

 

[borgqueenx]

my report on n64iphone(only tested the roms in my collection):

Crashing Games:
Goldeneye Crashes.
Carmageddon Crashes.
Perfect Dark Crashes.(one of my fav n64 games)
C&C Crashes.
Holy Magic Century Crashes when starting a new game.
Mission: Impossible crashes after first screen.
Quest 64 crashes after first screen.
Pokemon Stadium 2 crashes after N64 screen.
South Park(one of my fav n64 games) crashes.
Starcraft 64 Crashes.
Turok crashes.
Turok 2 crashes.
Turok 3 crashes.
Vigilante 8 - 3nd Offensive says something about controller pack and i cant click it away to continue.

Working games(no framerate counter and sound enabled):
Banjoo Kazooi: Very slow, would not call it playable. But it runs and i cant see graphical bugs/errors. (i'd say 8~15FPS)
Duke Nukem 64: A tiny bit faster then Banjoo Kazooi, but i cant move forwards. No graphical bugs so far.
Earthworm Jim 3Done of my fav n64 games): Runs pretty smooth, playable. No graphical bugs.(so far) (i'd say 15~25FPS)
Legend of Zelds Ocarina of Time Master Quest: Runs slow, but also none graphical bugs.(i'd say 5~10FPS)
Rampage 2 - Universal Tour: Plays almost full speed with no graphical bugs or whatever. (i'd say 20~30FPS)
Super Mario 64: I would call it playable but i have no entered first mission yet. Some graphical glitches are available to(although not many) (i'd say 18~25FPS)
Super Smash Bros: Slow, but playable. Just like mario 64 some graphical bugs. (i'd say 15~20FPS)
007 The world is not enough: I'd say 10~15 FPS but it crashes once going ingame.(the ingame cutscene works)

Remember this is on n64iphone not on the pandora emulator. The Pandora will be able to run it faster because the iphone still has its large OS and other things pre-loaded.
Also, this is a early version of n64iphone. Im sure the most crashing games will be supported in the future.
N64iphone already runs faster then Daedalus for psp, although not alot.

Hi There borgqueenx,
I have a few quick questions about your expierence with iPhoneN64.

Are you using a 3GS?
Do you have SBsettings installed?
(if so)Did you kill all processes that are running AND free up memory?
Did you put your phone into Aeroplane mode? (It does help speed on games)
Also, did you test N64 in SAFE MODE? It helps with Speed and Memory.

Another things that MAY help (no clue if it does), play the N64 games from UNZIPPED. Just a thought, no info to back that up.

If someone can test with the above being done, I'm sure the results may differ from BorgQ's.

i was already scared that i was testing and typing for nothing.
Yes ofcource i use a 3GS. No i didnt kill processes and didnt clear my ram. My 3gs never runs out of ram and never has any speed problems. And yes i have sbsettings installed.
No i didnt try in save mode and neither i uses airplane mode. bluetooth was off though

I dont think save mode or clearing ram makes a difference on the beautiful 3GS phone

Also, all Rom's where zipped. I really dont think it matters a tiny bit when running compressed or not compressed.

Maby exophase can enlight this for us.

But we cant clock the iphone to 850Mhz so the pandora will be much more faster

 

[Phawx]

what is the bottleneck for the N64 Emu? The CPU or GPU? Because the iPhone 3GS has a better GPU than the Pandora.

 

[gruso]

the video made it on engadget
http://www.engadget....own-playing-su/

Wait, those fiends stole my actual words.

The recent reports on Pandora's case design and controls have been nothing short of glowing.

(Balzac2m's) hands-on experience was nothing short of glowing

I think they're being more than a little facetious there.

 

[kingoddball]

From what I have seen in earlier posts on a different thread, I think the bottle neck is the GPU.
iPhone has a better GPU?? Thats news to me?? That Sucks.

As for 3GS. Aeroplane mode eliminates the cpu time going to the gsm module and saves ity waiting for calls/sms.
Clearing ram, mate, the more ram the better!
As for save mode, it seems to make no difference in performance for N64 emu apparently, but as for cpu again, it does not run as many background processes and therefor better cpu performance.