Nintendo 64

[Cervante]

What are the chances of a nintendo 64 emu being full speed on the wiz ?

 

[plopperz]

Slim to none.

 

[Squidge]

You may want to read up on the Nintendo 64 requests in the Pandora forum. Find out why it would be extremely difficult to do there, and then come back here to see why it can't be full speed on a machine with less capabilities.

 

[b1ueskycomp1ex]

You may want to read up on the Nintendo 64 requests in the Pandora forum. Find out why it would be extremely difficult to do there, and then come back here to see why it can't be full speed on a machine with less capabilities.

Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram. Somehow I doubt running it on a 533Mhz arm processor with 64MB of ram is going to cut it. Not to mention that the wiz doesn't have enough buttons to play N64 with..... not to mention it's got half the screen resolution the N64 used internally..... not to mention trying to play N64 games on the wiz's controls would drive you half-insane.

a PSX emulator MAY SOMEDAY be plausible, but even that would probably suck, looking at how Quake is running on the wiz so far.... take a look at the PSX emulator in the beta forum, all of 2FPS in oddworld.

If you're looking for PSX or N64 to be possible, you should probably either look at the pandora, or give up. =P

 

[darkriku]

You may want to read up on the Nintendo 64 requests in the Pandora forum. Find out why it would be extremely difficult to do there, and then come back here to see why it can't be full speed on a machine with less capabilities.

Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram. Somehow I doubt running it on a 533Mhz arm processor with 64MB of ram is going to cut it. Not to mention that the wiz doesn't have enough buttons to play N64 with..... not to mention it's got half the screen resolution the N64 used internally..... not to mention trying to play N64 games on the wiz's controls would drive you half-insane.

a PSX emulator MAY SOMEDAY be plausible, but even that would probably suck, looking at how Quake is running on the wiz so far.... take a look at the PSX emulator in the beta forum, all of 2FPS in oddworld.

If you're looking for PSX or N64 to be possible, you should probably either look at the pandora, or give up. =P

i get 10 fps on most games

 

[magickam]

Controls would be a pain anyway.

 

[craigix]

The lack of a FPU on the Wiz also adds to the implausibility element.

 

[DaveC]

Slim to none.

And Slim left town...

 

[Exophase]

If the Wiz DID have an FPU I'd say it was worth a shot. Although it'd need someone who really knows what they're doing with a lot of time. I wish I knew the execution profile of N64 games a little bit better so I could know exactly what floating point performance they did demand. All I know is that floating point does matter, because optimizations in FPU emulation in Daedalus certainly improved emulation speed. If I had any kind of communication with StrmnNrmn I might ask him to profile it. You would expect 2D games to not use them that heavily but who knows. Besides that, how many 2D games are actually available for N64?

It's kind of funny that N64 games use the FPU much because the RSP and RDP are both fixed point parts, and they're the ones that'd be doing the heavy lifting with 3D math and any floating point vertices would have to be converted to the fixed formats. Incidentally, it might be possible for an HLE N64 emulator to offload the transform work that RSP microcodes do to the GTE (geometry transformation engine) block of the 3D core on the Wiz.

Too bad about that lack of FPU.

 

[portcitypetino]

You may want to read up on the Nintendo 64 requests in the Pandora forum. Find out why it would be extremely difficult to do there, and then come back here to see why it can't be full speed on a machine with less capabilities.

Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram. Somehow I doubt running it on a 533Mhz arm processor with 64MB of ram is going to cut it. Not to mention that the wiz doesn't have enough buttons to play N64 with..... not to mention it's got half the screen resolution the N64 used internally..... not to mention trying to play N64 games on the wiz's controls would drive you half-insane.

a PSX emulator MAY SOMEDAY be plausible, but even that would probably suck, looking at how Quake is running on the wiz so far.... take a look at the PSX emulator in the beta forum, all of 2FPS in oddworld.

If you're looking for PSX or N64 to be possible, you should probably either look at the pandora, or give up. =P

But see b1 thats why people ask for N64 so much on the newer next gen open source handheld devices such as the wiz or pandora because Ps1 has already been done on the regular gp2x at a decent speed without sound and ZodTTD has Ps1 running REALLY good (without sound of course but youd be surprised that some run good even with sound and when i say really good thats defined by 90% speed i guess you could say but dont hold me to that) on the iPhone. The Wiz really is more comparable to the iphone instead of the psp really in my opinion anyway.

The iphone has only 400mhz with on board 3d acceleration, the Wiz has 533mhz with on board 3d acceleration, now i know theres ALOT MORE to compare here then just mhz and 3d but lets be realistic here 3d acceleration is what everyone wanted on the gp2x back a few years ago, and then the only handheld console that had it besides the mainstream psp and ds was the gizmondo which unfortunately was just like the psp and ds in terms of being closed system and not open source. But i really think the wiz can learn alot from devices like the iphone and android phones (like the G1 which i also have) and the wiz like these have built in 3d but more raw power in terms of mhz. And also make a note too that the iphone and android also use ARM processors comparable once again to the Wiz.

I find that the Wiz is very capable of a lot more than what people give it credit for and i think its partly because of the Pandora, now i, myself have a Pandora preordered but im VERY impressed with the Wiz. Really I like to think of the Wiz as a Mini Pandora rather than a GP2X on steroids i mean 600mhz ARM isnt THAT BIG of a difference between 533mhz ARM hell the 2nd gen itouch has 5xxmhz while the 1st gen itouch, iphone, and iphone 3g are stuck with 400mhz and NOTHING has come out EXCLUSIVELY for the 2nd gen itouch to really even show that it is more powerful than its siblings and thats a bigger difference than the wiz and the pandora. I mean sure the pandora is a full freakin UMPC with a much bigger screen and full QWERTY keyboard its gonna be freakin awesome but thats the price difference in my opinion; for $330 you get this bad ass handheld gaming machine with full UMPC functionality or for $180 you get the bad ass gaming machine minus the UMPC and the convertibility of your pocket.

Do i think the Wiz can do n64 perfect speed... no i dont really even think the pandora can but i know the pandora can pull it off to be playable and i think the wiz, although a couple miles behind could at least pull of a proof of concept with commercial games running and not just a some PD demos and i think Ps1 is very doable on the wiz cause the previous generations have already done it, although not perfect but playable and that's my point people want to see new things not something that's already been done and just done a little tiny winnnie bit better although it is a plus don't get me wrong.

 

[Squidge]

But see b1 thats why people ask for N64 so much on the
Ow! My brain just exploded from a huge clump of text wall.

Hint for the future: If you read this link: http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=define%3Aparagraph and do what it says, more people will read your posts.

 

[portcitypetino]

But see b1 thats why people ask for N64 so much on the
Ow! My brain just exploded from a huge clump of text wall.

Hint for the future: If you read this link: http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=define%3Aparagraph and do what it says, more people will read your posts.

Good point.... fixed!

 

[Exophase]

Actually, Pandora's default speed is 500MHz and despite being 33MHz "slower" it wipes the floor with Wiz in benchmarks, think 2x difference. It's all because it's a much more advanced CPU with L2 cache and a better memory subsystem.

 

[aho]

[...]
Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram.[...]

UltraHLE ran perfectly fine on a K6-2 with 350mhz if I remember correctly. The HLE bit in the name means high-level emulation. So, basically they went an extra mile to optimize specific hotspots by rewriting them in native code. However, only a few hand selected games were supported but these did run very well indeed.

I don't really see that happening on the Wiz though.

 

[b1ueskycomp1ex]

[...]
Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram.[...]

UltraHLE ran perfectly fine on a K6-2 with 350mhz if I remember correctly. The HLE bit in the name means high-level emulation. So, basically they went an extra mile to optimize specific hotspots by rewriting them in native code. However, only a few hand selected games were supported but these did run very well indeed.

I don't really see that happening on the Wiz though.

well, if you want N64 just to play super mario.... :rolleyes:

 

[aho]

[...]
Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram.[...]

UltraHLE ran perfectly fine on a K6-2 with 350mhz if I remember correctly. The HLE bit in the name means high-level emulation. So, basically they went an extra mile to optimize specific hotspots by rewriting them in native code. However, only a few hand selected games were supported but these did run very well indeed.

I don't really see that happening on the Wiz though.

well, if you want N64 just to play super mario.... :rolleyes:

And Zelda!

Personally I'm not really interested in playing N64 games on the Wiz. The controls just wouldn't work.

 

[mrpogo]

me either. If its there Il play it but im not overly bothered about this being emulated. 16bit emulation including A500, snes, megadrive etc is what this handhelds all about mi thinks

 

[portcitypetino]

[...]
Nintendo 64 Barely gets fullspeed on a fast Pentium 3-based PC with 128MB of ram.[...]

UltraHLE ran perfectly fine on a K6-2 with 350mhz if I remember correctly. The HLE bit in the name means high-level emulation. So, basically they went an extra mile to optimize specific hotspots by rewriting them in native code. However, only a few hand selected games were supported but these did run very well indeed.

I don't really see that happening on the Wiz though.

well, if you want N64 just to play super mario.... :rolleyes:

And Zelda!

Personally I'm not really interested in playing N64 games on the Wiz. The controls just wouldn't work.

You got the touch screen for virtual controls just like they do with other emulators on the iPhone now granted its 2.8" so it wont be very comfortable but itll do the job none the less.

me either. If its there Il play it but im not overly bothered about this being emulated. 16bit emulation including A500, snes, megadrive etc is what this handhelds all about mi thinks

Thats just what i was saying earlier in the post 16bit HAS BEEN DONE already get a regular gp2x if you want genesis and snes i mean sure the wiz will run em alot better than the gp2x especially if its optimized so itll be a plus dont get me wrong but people buy next gen open source handhelds to run next gen emulation in their hands. Now sure if you really only bought a wiz for n64 then you really bought the wrong device, as the pandora will be able to do it better but once again that wont do it perfectly either, but theres more to "next gen handheld emulation" than n64 and i dont mean 8bit or 16bit really i dont even mean ps1 either as thats been done. I think N64 is doable on the wiz BUT not as good as the Pandora and as many people have already said that Pandora wont do it perfectly either but for what it packs i think the wiz can do it just as a proof of concept cause if n64 is what you really only want than the pandora is gonna be the closest to getting it done as far as this generation of handheld devices go.

 

[DaveC]

If the Wiz DID have an FPU I'd say it was worth a shot. Although it'd need someone who really knows what they're doing with a lot of time. I wish I knew the execution profile of N64 games a little bit better so I could know exactly what floating point performance they did demand. All I know is that floating point does matter, because optimizations in FPU emulation in Daedalus certainly improved emulation speed. If I had any kind of communication with StrmnNrmn I might ask him to profile it. You would expect 2D games to not use them that heavily but who knows. Besides that, how many 2D games are actually available for N64?

It's kind of funny that N64 games use the FPU much because the RSP and RDP are both fixed point parts, and they're the ones that'd be doing the heavy lifting with 3D math and any floating point vertices would have to be converted to the fixed formats. Incidentally, it might be possible for an HLE N64 emulator to offload the transform work that RSP microcodes do to the GTE (geometry transformation engine) block of the 3D core on the Wiz.

Too bad about that lack of FPU.

There were a couple of 2D games on the N64 but you could count them on one hand and have fingers left over.

The N64 used the FPU allot as it had perspective correct textures that stayed true no matter how close you got to them (the PSX doesn't that is why textures get all wiggly when you get close). It also had advanced z-buffering which is why you didn't get polygon show-through when polys intersect (planks in water that form a perfect intersection when they sink at angles etc). I think allot of that relied on the FPU.

 

[Exophase]

You got the touch screen for virtual controls just like they do with other emulators on the iPhone now granted its 2.8" so it wont be very comfortable but itll do the job none the less.

That would never work. iPhone's touchscreen is multitouch, Pandora's isn't. So you can only press one thing at a time.

Trust me, I once tried playing Bonk's Revenge with the onscreen keyboard. It isn't possible.

QUOTE (DaveC)
The N64 used the FPU allot as it had perspective correct textures that stayed true no matter how close you got to them (the PSX doesn't that is why textures get all wiggly when you get close). It also had advanced z-buffering which is why you didn't get polygon show-through when polys intersect (planks in water that form a perfect intersection when they sink at angles etc). I think allot of that relied on the FPU.


These things didn't have anything to do with the FPU, they were features of the 3D accelerator.