More Pandora 2 crap (MicroSD Split)

[_wb_]

Here. I took back one I listed before because while they were both rated as 30 MB/s read, one was "Ultra" while the other was "Ultra Extreme." On the other hand, I'm also not doing one like for like where they're both "Ultra" but one is 30MB/s and the other is 15MB/s. The former is probably more fair than the latter. This is from Sandisk's lists, where the same vendor is both offering the card. Note that in some cases Sandisk links to the wrong product, which may have messed me up before.

	 SD microSD

64GB 30MB/s $39.99 $39.99 Radio Shack

32GB 30MB/s $23.99 (sale from $69.99) $69.99 Staples

32GB class 4 $69.99 $79.99 Staples

16GB 95MB/s $74.99 $99.99 Best Buy

16GB 30MB/s $15.99 (sale from $39.99) $39.99 Staples

16GB class 4 $49.99 $49.99 Staples

$9.95 $9.95 Adorama

8GB 95MB/s $45.98 $59.99 Best Buy			

8GB 30MB/s $12.95 $12.95 Adorama

$13.50 $12.95 B&H

$24.99 $24.99 Best Buy

8GB class 4 $6.95 $6.95 Adorama			

4GB class 4 $5.95 $4.95 Adorama

$19.99 $19.99 Staples

2GB class 4 $9.99 $9.34 Best Buy

$6.99 $9.99 Radio Shack

$6.99 $5.99 CDW

Tell me if I made any errors.

Thanks for making that list! Grench, I suggest you also spend some time on making such lists (for other brands), it is this kind of information that really helps to get an idea of the reality of prices.


The conclusion for Sandisk real retail prices seems to be: microSD and SD are roughly the same price, but you can get very significant discounts for SD in the higher-end range.


Also note that in this comparison there are no high-speed 64GB cards or 128GB cards because those are not available in microSD.

 

[Grench]

Now if you could clamp down on your douche nozzle and point me to where this "As stated several times the microSD interface/pinout is capable of the same speeds as the SD equivalent" could be found I'd be obliged not to comment on your evident predilection for swinging from my nads.

Name calling isn't a proper way to carry on a civilized conversation. You want examples - search is your friend.











There are more - that should be enough to keep you reading for a few weeks though.


Ahh EDIT - This should be easier for you to find/understand than dredging through all that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsd#microSD


Look st the technical details section - it shows how the cards are electrically identical.

 

[overgauss]

You are doing a fine job destroying your own argument. PM sent. Address me there from now on.

 

[Exophase]

Thanks for making that list! Grench, I suggest you also spend some time on making such lists (for other brands), it is this kind of information that really helps to get an idea of the reality of prices.

The conclusion for Sandisk real retail prices seems to be: microSD and SD are roughly the same price, but you can get very significant discounts for SD in the higher-end range.


Also note that in this comparison there are no high-speed 64GB cards or 128GB cards because those are not available in microSD.

Well, from that list alone I'd say Staples is highly favoring SD over microSD pricing in the higher end, but that it's hard to care given that Staples' pricing isn't very good to begin with. It turns out that Sandisk isn't actually keeping up to date on listings (sigh..) and Adorama for instance has 64GB SD and microSD (same price for both). But they can't compete with Radio Shack's price. Who would have ever expected Radio Shack to have a reasonable deal on anything.


Their 32GB prices are the same or very close as well, even for other brands of SD cards. But yeah, this is hardly an exhaustive comparison. If you really want to start nailing this down you could do a community contributed spreadsheet or something, but really that's too far to go just to prove a point (that SD is NOT always cheaper, and "sometimes cheaper" does not qualify that claim, especially when microSD is "sometimes cheaper" too). The real lesson is simple, and should be pretty obvious:


If you want to buy a new SD card, pick a size and specification and actually search for what people are selling. If the SD variant is cheaper buy that. If the microSD variant is cheaper (and comes with an SD adapter, or you already have one lying around) buy that. Refusing to spend a couple minutes even looking at microSD prices because you assume SD is always cheaper/better/whatever is stupid. Really, really stupid.

 

[Grench]

You are doing a fine job destroying your own argument. PM sent. Address me there from now on.

Hey dude don't ever talk to me about civilized conversation. When you accused me of lying I calmly stated my position and proved why you were mistaken. Instead of admitting you were and are still wrong you continue to antagonize the discussion with things unrelated to my point or statement.


If you don't want to be called out for your behavior act like a man and admit you were wrong! That simple. Stop acting like an asshole and let it go. People are gently trying to tell you to do your own research and STFU. Take the hint. Make yourself look better by apologizing for claiming I did stuff I didn't do.


Everyone can see that you're wrong and your refusal to admit it just adds to your doucheyness. Your doucheyness is a proven fact because I asked you long ago to take it to pm's if you still couldn't understand. Not only did you have a comprehension fail you just had to unleash the douche. Maybe you're just into salt and vinegar. /shrug

Nope, still not wrong. You WAY over exaggerated your SD prices - to the tune of 4:1. I stand by that - and you've admitted to it.


Not going to play the IM game with you. If you're going to insult me, at least keep it in the open so that others can judge your character.


If your method of argument is name calling, profanity and 'insisting on apology' - then you're not worth the time to talk to. And what is it with you and feminine sanitary products anyway? That is one weird fall back argument you got there.


Have a nice day.

 

[Grench]

But they can't compete with Radio Shack's price. Who would have ever expected Radio Shack to have a reasonable deal on anything.

THAT is the real bombshell finding here. I'm rather amazed too.

If you want to buy a new SD card, pick a size and specification and actually search for what people are selling. If the SD variant is cheaper buy that. If the microSD variant is cheaper (and comes with an SD adapter, or you already have one lying around) buy that. Refusing to spend a couple minutes even looking at microSD prices because you assume SD is always cheaper/better/whatever is stupid. Really, really stupid.

Yes, real world pricing is very dynamic - and Sandisk's MSRP is pretty 'out there'.


Your advice is good with one exception - and that is that if you have an actual need for a card size and speed that simply has not been released yet in the microSD format and don't want to wait 18 months for it to get there - then SD will always be the clear winner.


Or are you going to show me where I can buy a 128GB 90MB/sec read 45MB/sec write microSD card?

 

[Exophase]

Or are you going to show me where I can buy a 128GB 90MB/sec read 45MB/sec write microSD card?

No. I never will, never said I did, and never brought it up. And if you ever bring this up with me again I swear I am going to find a way to smack you.


If you need a card specification that is not available in microSD then surely that makes SD the winner by default. My advice doesn't contradict that in that slightest, you just want to shout this at every possible opportunity. My contribution to this thread was AND ONLY was with regard to pricing of SD vs microSD where like for like models are available. So if you have something to say that doesn't apply to that tell it to someone who cares.

 

[overgauss]

Nope, still not wrong. You WAY over exaggerated your SD prices - to the tune of 4:1. I stand by that - and you've admitted to it.

Grench, now you are flat out lying.

Hi this is what I based my post off. I don't know if the search return is the same in your location. 32gb Sd and 64 gb SD. The top result for the 64 gb had a sandisk class 10 I believe for $93 the other was a Lexar for $199 (yes both are class 10). Now the micro SD card price I used was this one which is a class 4. So I wasn't exaggerating to prove a point. That's not my style entirely. However I didn't bother to try to find a class 4 64gb SD card. My fault, I was just doing a quick google. So here is a search for class 4 64gb SD cards.

So as you know the top results returned by google in the sponsored portion are sponsored and apt to change. Originally the lowest price for a 64gb sd showed up as $99. Now it's $78.25. So since you are unfamiliar with technology I'm going to click the links for you. We'll start with a 64gb SD search. Remember to multiply it by two as that is where my $200-$400 price range came from (odd that I have to remind you as you figured out I was talking about 4 microSD cards). Then we'll move onto the class 4 microSD card (not class 2 as you claimed and also namebrand) that cost around $20. Now if you want, I also have images for the class10 links for bothSD/microSD as well as the class 4 SD search.


After that hopefully you'll be smelling rosy.

You have greatly exaggerated the price for SD media.


Those 4 32GB microSD cards that you're getting for $84 are most likely Class 2 speed - and off brand at that. I was unable to find an example of your four for $84.


[snip] FAR short of the $200-$400 per 64GB that your post claimed. I realize it was, 'an exaggeration to prove a point,' but it was off by more than 400% over reality in price alone, not counting performance.

 

[Askarus]

So, your comnparisons may be nice but useless to me.


Micor SD is, as you said about one year behind SD.


That's my problem. When 256 GB cards will be out it'll take one year untill 256 GB micro SD will be out.


Pandora 2 will meed lots of room for data.


And for pricing: http://www.amazon.de/Platinum-64-Class-SDXC-Speicherkarte/dp/B0063QGWZM/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1349592767&sr=8-2


I got two of those working fine in my pandora

 

[Binky]

So, your comnparisons may be nice but useless to me.


Micor SD is, as you said about one year behind SD.


That's my problem. When 256 GB cards will be out it'll take one year untill 256 GB micro SD will be out.


Pandora 2 will meed lots of room for data.


And for pricing: http://www.amazon.de...49592767&sr=8-2


I got two of those working fine in my pandora

Surely the lower capacities are due to the lower volume. - twice as much physical space corresponds to twice as much data storage.


Wasn't somebody proposing to fit the P2 with 4 microSD cards instead of 2 fullSD?

 

[Askarus]

Surely the lower capacities are due to the lower volume. - twice as much physical space corresponds to twice as much data storage. Wasn't somebody proposing to fit the P2 with 4 microSD cards instead of 2 fullSD?

Exactly, that's my problem with micro SD.


Why not using a full sized and a micor SD slot?


Is that so much of a problem?


The verry fast one with 256 GB as SDXC and a slower one with 64/128 GB for Music and other data you'd probably also could use on your phone.


And of course one 32/64 GB internal for Angström, Slackware, Android and other OS stuff, as well as for PNDs for the every day usage or some important data.


Woiuldn't this be the best compromise?


Of course I'd prefare 2 full sized SDXC slots.


It'd be much cheaper to use 2 128 GB SDXC than one 256 GB card.


Think of one verry important fact:


P2 will be able to play HD stuff.


It'll support Dreamcast and we can run for Gamecube and PS2.


Those consoles use DVDs. The games are verry big.


I don't want to run out of space. That's aweful.


Only SDXC cards can grant the maximal size to the best price.

 

[bismuthdrummer]

Woiuldn't this be the best compromise?

I think the versatility to accept either size does appeal, but as Grench has pointed out microSD cards have SD adapters but not vice versa. This interchangeability problem strikes against having different sized external slots.


And while I don't hate microSD I do share in the spirit that their size sucks to handle. So why compromise?

 

[Exophase]

I'm starting to think Craig intends for the slots to be behind the screen and that's why he's scrapping SD. The rationalization that "that's what everyone else is doing" or "SD is becoming obsolete" is comical. The ONLY reason microSD should be chosen over SD is if the latter compromises something else in the design due to space constraints, for the same number of slots. Now, if the decision is down to one SD or two microSD things become a little more complicated.

 

[craigix]

Space is of course one of the main reasons, but I also firmly believe 'big' SD is dying. Sure it will stick around for a long time yet, but it won't remain the most popular.


Once we see sizes of 256GB and 32GB or 64GB are cheap as chips, does it really matter that much anymore?

 

[Exophase]

Big SD will always, ALWAYS have the highest capacity option and if it's going away in any significant sense it'll be years away. Your fixation on the cell phone market is making you myopic, think about what really drives the high end of SD cards right now - digital cameras (especially video cameras). If you think quality cameras have been moving away from full SD you've got another thing coming.


So yes, so long as you can continue to get SD cards that are 2x larger than microSD it'll matter to some people. You can't honestly think that people will stop caring about capacity once it hits 256GB. Are people generally content with 256GB hard drives? You'd have to get into several TBs before people really start running out of ways to fill the space.


It'll also matter that they can reuse their (sometimes pretty expensive!) SD cards that they bought for Pandora 1, and it'll matter that microSD cards are tiny and a pain in the ass to insert/remove and store. Ditching SD, or any other feature, because you think it's going to be less popular among other devices, is incredibly bizarre, and given Pandora's previous mission statements it's astounding to see this mentality at play.

 

[craigix]

We're ditching it because we want to make the P2 smaller and not a brick.


And yes, I think once we reach sizes like 256GB *2 (ie 512GB) it ceases to be a big issue - and 512, 1TB will come.


I don't see phone owners refusing to buy the latest super-phones because they don't have giant SD slots on them.


You don't fancy compact flash?

 

[Exophase]

I still don't understand how something with a 5+" screen doesn't have room for even one SD slot. You insist it but it makes no sense. The height it adds is close to nothing.

 

[craigix]

There isn't enough room. It's that simple. It's the same reason other manufacturers don't use old SD on portable, compact devices.

 

[ferrule]

Space is of course one of the main reasons, but I also firmly believe 'big' SD is dying. Sure it will stick around for a long time yet, but it won't remain the most popular.


Once we see sizes of 256GB and 32GB or 64GB are cheap as chips, does it really matter that much anymore?

Based on what? If your requirements are space and speed you land on SD. MicroSD just doesn't have the speed you need for a portable computer.

 

[DAP]

These guys seem to have no clue how high a percentage of the surface area of the board that a full sized SD card takes. I would think that the two SD card slots take more than 5% of the surface of the circuit board. The uSD card sockets take only 1/4 the surface area as the full sized socket.


I would like to see them add an interface to support some form of solid state drive that can do wear levelling.