Fcc/ce Testing... Passed!


Monk said:
Sorry :(
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Nothing to apologise to me for! I'm just bemused by the initial reaction ;)
 
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MWeston said:
Craig should have said we won't be doing FCC registration and then it would have made sense but he probably assumed people such as Monk would know this from reading the forum for so long and not complain about it for two pages. ;)
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It's like a game of tennis, on an early Binatone console. Or even in real life. If no-one bats the ball back, the game ends. There are two sides - and at the moment the two sides appear to be "It looks to be wrong" vs "yeah it's wrong, stop complaining you should know what the TRUTH is by now". Which makes me (IMHO) only ALMOST as guilty as the folks on the other side of the fence.

Um...??? Paint me quizzical. It could have been ended in one post along the lines of "Oops, you know you're right!" in response to Asmo. My point is the official web site appears to be wrong, and end users/customers don't necessarily deserve to be berrated because they (helpfully) try to point such things out. Why the 'tude? Why does there always have to be so much 'tude????

MWeston said:
Maybe ED will see this and make the website more clear if it is really a problem for the select few. I'm looking forward to that page not even needing to exist anymore.
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{snip chatty sideline}

Personally, I'd have thought a simple "You know, it COULD be better - we'll get on that!" to Asmo, followed by a note to your co-dev ED to update the website, would have been the perfect response to Asmo in the first place, instead of creating a confrontational situation. But that's just my approach.

As discussed with my increasingly sarcastic wife, there appears to be very little actually standing between the Pandoras and their owners, now.
 
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Chip said:
Gruso said:
To be fair, that information has been on the unofficial roadmap (with source linked) for over a month. ;)
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To be even more fair, the roadmap is not inaccurate, it's just not totally clear. There is no requirement that devices pass an FCC test in the US, only that they meet the requirements. The CE tests are more stringent than the FCC. Any device that passes CE testing meets or exceeds the FCC requirements. So the CE tests do technically prove compliance with both sets of regulations.
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So you are saying if it pases the CE testing, it is automatically assumed by the FCC guys to be compliant as well? They sorta say "Oh great, it passed the much harder CE, so we'll just give them an honorary pass for FCC then". So no, passing CE does not 'technically' give it an FCC pass as well, it gives it a conceivable FCC pass should the test be done.

'Technically', I don't think that word means what you think it means. 'Technically', it doesn't pass an FCC test unless it actually takes one. No more than if a British Police person passes his local law tests, is he also 'technically' passing the American ones by doing so. He only passes the American ones if he takes them... 'Technically' speaking.

Yes, it only need to meet the regulations, and that is what an FCC test is for. A CE test is not a substitute. Does the Pandora need an FCC test? Probably not. Is it fair (or accurate) to say that a CE test is a substitute for an FCC test? No. No Propaganda please.

Edit: Just to be clear: Passing a harder test does not mean it would pass a simpler different set of tests... it is technically wrong to assume so, even if it is likely to be true, it is wrong to make the assumption. Also, it's is certain and technically accurate to say that the FCC won't simply say 'great, you passed CE, no need to register or test our standards'.

It has been said that the Pandora doesn't need FCC registration, so great... then don't imply there is implicit FCC compliance (from the CE tests) without actually doing FCC testing. If you do so, you seem to be insulting the intelligence/reasoning of the people you are talking to.

Edit2: I think the term you are looking for is "for all intents and purposes", which is fine, but way different than 'technically'.

Edit3: @Series-8 I hope you don't mean me... I love the Pandora, but can't stand when someone talks crap. I am a random internet person... but someone who is both a Mod and the PR guy for the Pandora... if that person uses a definitive term in an authoritative way, they better damn well be correct. Doubly so for someone who is a MOD *and* the PR guy for the team (e.g.. both roles require correctness in message, not just towing the company line). I can be as wrong as I like, I have no authority given to me... surely you see the difference?

Just to clarify: It's not ok for me to be wrong, I think everyone should only speak when they know... its that its inconsequential if I am inaccurate, I am not a voice of authority here, never-mind being two voices of authority in one.
 
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I think the naysayers are running out of bad things so say about the Pandora.

At least until they have one, to be sure of what to complain about.

Also Good to know the Pandora is A Tough little box!
 
BackAssward said:
'Technically', I don't think that word means what you think it means. 'Technically', it doesn't pass an FCC test unless it actually takes one. No more than if a British Police person passes his local law tests, is he also 'technically' passing the American ones by doing so. He only passes the American ones if he takes them... 'Technically' speaking.
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Technically :)P) there is no such thing as FCC or CE testing*. FCC and CE provide a list of safety requirements (radiation levels, cut offs, what happens under certain scenarios, etc), and it's up to the developer to ensure it meets these requirements. Testing is done by a trusted third party who will then vouch for your product should it be called into question.
Since CE requirements are stricter than FCC requirements (radiation levels must be lower, cutoffs must happen sooner, etc) it's not unfair to say that if it meets CE requirements, it also meets FCC requirements.

*there is official FCC certification that could be considered a real FCC test, but the Pandora doesn't need that.
 
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BackAssward said:
Edit: Just to be clear: Passing a harder test does not mean it would pass a simpler different set of tests... it is technically wrong to assume so, even if it is likely to be true, it is wrong to make the assumption. Also, it's is certain and technically accurate to say that the FCC won't simply say 'great, you passed CE, no need to register or test our standards'.
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The tests are no different. The tests for passing FCC are fewer and the limits are higher.

i.e.:
You drive a car.
In CE City, the car is not allowed to drive faster than 80km/h. If it can't do that, it passes.
Also, in CE City, they test if your car survives when you throw a big piano from above onto it. If it still works fine, it passes.
The car is allowed to drive through CE City, as it is within all regulations.

In FCC City, the car is not allowed to drive faster than 120km/h. As it has already been tested in CE City that it can't go faster than 80km/h, it passes.
They do not care if it survives when you throw a big piano onto it. That test doesn't exist. So there is no need to pass here.
So, each car that is allowed to drive through CE City is also allowed to drive through FCC City, as it is clearly within all regulations.
 
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Just read this thread, looks like someone is trying to pass the buck.

CE tests can (depending on the testing company) cover (i.e. encompass) all the FCC tests, but does it mean it's now FCC certified?

The answer is no, you need to pay for additional fees (i.e. paperwork) to use the existing covered tests to get an FCC ID number/ID.

In short, the Pandora (with active 802.11) is technically illegal to be sold to the general public in the USA.

It's like jaywalking, people do it, but still illegal.
 
spaceballs3000 said:
In short, the Pandora (with active 802.11) is technically illegal to be sold to the general public in the USA.
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That's great news!
So all the US preorders will be cancled and the rest of the world can get into teh first batch?

AWESOME
 
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Who is this man (spaceballs3000) and why does it seem like he knows stuff about the pandora that he couldn't possible know if he ain't ED, Craig, or Mweston?
 
Just to be clear, the statement given
In short, the Pandora (with active 802.11) is technically illegal to be sold to the general public in the USA.
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is under the assumption that the Pandora will have working WiFi, will not have an FCC ID, and be sold in the USA.
 
mali said:
Nullo actore, nullus iudex.
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But they cared about the EU laws.
So, are they treatign the US like a "bananA republic"? Where they do not have to fear the laws?
 
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CE and FCC being not identical is banana in my opinion. I don't have enough background knowledge to make up an opinion, though. The company is located in the UK and there is no middle man in the US selling Pandoras so it might work out without hassle. I'm just guessing, though.
 
It is mentioned often before they need to be fcc compliant (ie they need to be able to provide the test results which they can provide) they dont need fcc registration or certification (they could but it is not required for this machine)

http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?/topic/49885-c-e-test-booked-for-14-oct-2009/page__view__findpost__p__763156

some extra info:

An Unintentional Radiator is a electronic digital or radio device that, because of the rapid oscillation of electric current in the device, produces radio signals that are broadcast through space, or conducted along power lines. Devices that receive radio waves (such as AM/FM radios and Televisions) electronically resonate and also unintentionally radiate radio waves.

• Unintentional radiators are very common everyday electronic devices like television sets, computers, electronic

games, radar detectors, digital cameras, USB peripherals, radios, digital clocks, musical equipment, MP3

devices -- Pretty much anything with a computer chip in it.

source: http://www.bureauveritas.com/wps/wcm/connect/bv_com/group/home/news/did-you-know-that/fcc_faqs?presentationtemplate=bv_master/news_full_story_presentation
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however:

An Intentional Radiator is a device that broadcasts radio energy (not infrared or ultrasonic energy) to perform its function.

• Intentional radiators are things like cell phones, CB radios, walkie-talkies, wireless connections, Bluetooth

connections, and short range broadcast equipment, wireless key-access systems. Clearly radio waves are

needed for the thing to work. These devices intentionally use the radio spectrum and therefore always require

FCC equipment authorization.
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But I guess the pandora functions without bluetooth and wireless
 
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static.gif


Edit:
nopompom.gif

Ok, back to Latin...
 
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