F200-like Scenario

[sold]

A question for any of the creators of pandora (if they see it and they have the time to respond)

Back in 2005:

QUOTE


Hello,

GPH inform you that we have no concrete plan about gp2x-F200.

The thing what GPH staff mentioned about gp2x-f200 is like we can say about Pentium6 waiting for it.

it is like though we have no plan about next model,we can talk about it putting certain name on it.

i understand why our foreign customers worry about so much,as there has been many delaying and it makes you guys wait too long.

In order to dispatch the complete device,we decided to fix some bugs on software. and it will take a few days more.

We are very sorry again for late shippment and we will do our best to
dispatch gp2x as soon as possible to foreign customers.

Best Regards,

Anna


I believe that this was the response of a GPH rep.

Seems a little strange that it took so long to release a hardware revision that ultimately divided the user base. Touchscreen and a d-pad without center click ended up boning everyone. New software focusing on touchscreen controls, and old programs with center click that the d-pad didn't support. Seems a little silly to me.

Will there be such drastic changes to the Pandora's hardware in a couple of years time? Or will it remain the same from day one until there is a new device i.e pandora II (the revenge )?

 

[icurafu]

This is just a silly question. The F200 did not divide the community. It added a dpad which improves the controls and added touchscreen which is hardly used.

What it did badly was to introduce multiple new hardware components that broke some games and apps, but this happened throughout the entire series and only because the old LCD screens for example were no longer sold. Craigix is not immune to that.

When Anna Hong spoke about this, they probably didn't have any real plans.

I'm sure if the Pandora MK1 has flaws, they will be fixed in MK2.

 

[Pickle]

I think its a different situation. F100 to the F200 was wierd because it was the same soc. In this case its a completly new model based on a new soc. Although the claim that it is expected to backwards compatible has been made.
Its not really a big deal though if theres enough interest in the device everything could be ported over.

 

[icurafu]

lol, GPH gets misunderstood often. Like with the center click on the dpad issue. They want the developers to add the feature of pressing all buttons, where we think they mean they will make the hardware produce another button with all buttons are pressed.

It's best just to trust your own instincts.

 

[sold]

This is just a silly question. The F200 did not divide the community. It added a dpad which improves the controls and added touchscreen which is hardly used.

What it did badly was to introduce multiple new hardware components that broke some games and apps, but this happened throughout the entire series and only because the old LCD screens for example were no longer sold. Craigix is not immune to that.

When Anna Hong spoke about this, they probably didn't have any real plans.

I'm sure if the Pandora MK1 has flaws, they will be fixed in MK2.

I realise that when i said the f200 divided the community, it seems like a strong statement, but what I meant by that is it changed the standard for developers by introducing a new interface that wasn't available to what I assume was the majority of gp2x users. The slight changes to hardware components wasn't really worthwhile in the end were they?

Granted, when Anna Hong made her statement, GPH may not have had any real plans for the f200, but an f200 eventuated none the less. This leads me to believe that they may have had plans to release an updated verision of the same hardware, but they didn't want to deter any potential customers and lose sales on the f100.

My question was basically, are the devs confident that their product will be released (relatively) bug free? I ask this because I dont think anyone would like the situation that would arise if buying a pandora early meant that there would be a future hardware revision that created a large gap between mk1 and mk2 buyers.

EDIT: I just wanted to clarify, I was merely using GPH as an example that most people here would obviously be familiar with. I hope that the Pandora is released as it is meant to be from day one. I think that customers deserve a certain standard in quality,especially considering the price. The question essentially is, is it likely that the hardware will be perfected before release, eliminating the need for silly hardware revisions?

I think it is a deciding factor in the success of this device.

EDIT2: It's kinda hard to get to the point after a few too many drinks. Sorry about the longish post

 

[openthebox]

It is often said to never buy the first release of a totally redesigned car (or brand new model), buy the 2nd or 3rd year release where majority of the kinks would be worked out. If big car companies can have problem, why couldn't a small shop? I think this applies to any manufactored products. If you are concerned that these kinks are too big, then just sit back and wait for the 2nd batch, just don't be envious of your friends who got their hands on a unit from the 1st batch.

 

[greendots]

if we dont buy the first batch there wont be a second

 

[Holokauston]

It's amazing that some people want the devs to answer questions regarding to the future development of Pandora when the first ever release is still being developed?

That's like asking a mother while she is giving birth if she thinks her baby will die of heartfailiure at the age of 25 since you once knew a guy how sorta, kinda, maybe did that?

 

[sold]

I would really like to support this device from the beginning and I hope many others feel the same. I just hope that the team involved are taking their time so they can make the first batch as good as those that follow.

However, I don't think there is any justification for ANY company in any industry for releasing sub-standard products and treating early adopters as a sort of test group and making small improvements in subsequent releases.

I'm hoping that the Pandora sets a high standard from the beginning. There should be no reason to change the hardware at all (unless its to make a "lite" model like nintendo did with the DS, which has the same functionality as the original) until there is a more powerful successor.

If the initial buyers are going to be treated as testers, I think this should be made clear from the get go. I personally wouldn't mind, and would gladly contribute. If it wasn't made clear from the start, I believe it would result in a lot of early buyers feeling like they had been duped. There are lots of companies duping people these days, I think Craig and co. should strive to be better than that. Especially given the nature of the pandora and what they are trying to achieve.

EDIT: QUOTE
It's amazing that some people want the devs to answer questions regarding to the future development of Pandora when the first ever release is still being developed?

That's like asking a mother while she is giving birth if she thinks her baby will die of heartfailiure at the age of 25 since you once knew a guy how sorta, kinda, maybe did that?


Its not a question about future development. Its a question of build quality.

And dont get me wrong, its all looking awesome so far.

 

[TaG]

Look for Craig's posts. He's has said several times that they are taking their time to get it right first ime, and that the dev units are the test not the mk1s. Each potential customer has to decide if they are happy to be early adopters.

What do you really expect? Craig to post 'yeah, sorry, mk1 = beta, they'll be shite and I want you to test them, you'd be better waiting til mk2'? You've got to either trust them, or not.

 

[sold]

That's a good point you make there But pretty much, yeah, if Craig had to post 'yeah, sorry, mk1 = beta, they'll be shite and I want you to test them, you'd be better waiting until mk2' I'd respect that more than if it was gonna be the case and it wasn't made clear.
But I suppose you're right, its gonna come down to trust.

 

[nubie]

4 Buttons is NOT a D-PAD

I agree with your point though. Since Craig and Co. don't live in korea and believe that a handheld merely needs to play divx poorly to be a success I think we don't need to worry about it.


Mostly it is the software that is the problem, if GPH had given any thought to the usability of their device most problems could have been solved in software.

More importantly is communication, both with the general user base and the developers (NDA or private), GPH generated multiple epic fails on this front.

Even if the control scheme changes it is not the end of the world, as long as the controls are implemented from the beginning in a sane manner, to illustrate:

• Game X uses analog nubs and touchscreen.
  
• The (theoretical for sake of argument) Pandora 2 "Lite" does not come equipped with said controls.
  
• The controls are implemented in such a fashion that an external USB analog gamepad and a mouse can control the legacy apps.
  
• There is a workaround in the firmware/OS of the Pandora Lite that enables various alternate control schemes to account for older apps written for original Pandora.

If the controls interface with the programs through a standard control layer in Linux already, then supplementary controls should be easy to use.

The major problem facing control issues with the GP2X was not the F200, it was the lack of USB at launch. Most of the apps written that are "less compatible" were not designed with anything but the GP2X buttons in mind, thus they were/are still unusable with external control units.

The Pandora will have USB host at launch, and TV-Out in the box. Unlike the GP2X Pandora Devs will have good reason to program apps that properly utilize controls and TV-Output.

So very good question, but I don't think it should be a big issue. Any problems that come up should have a software work-around, or a hardware one.

I don't think there will be versions with different controls though.

Edit: I think that the main problem with GPH is that they didn't (or wouldn't) speak our language, and had no idea what the community actually wanted (or at least no intention of satisfying them).

Mk1 Pandora: I don't think that the MK1 units will be perfect, but I wouldn't call us "beta testers". Every product is bound to have a "quirk" that is only noticed after a large scale deployment. This is why you shouldn't buy a new car model the first couple years if you aren't prepared to face issues.

I think that quality control and overall design is much better (heck, Craig is one of the guys who was opening pre-order GP2X's to quality check them before shipment, and his design "team" actually thought about using the controls on the device for games and applications.)

 

[cb88]

n()()b ...i mean nubie you speeld *fail* wrong ...should have been epic fayl LOL they may have had thier epic failures but at least they arn't sony or nintendo...

sadly i don't have the money to get a MK1 and will have to wait on the MK2's

My it will be nice to plug the pandora into a TV to play games