I've been doing a lot of research on here as well as elsewhere about the Pandora, I'd really like to get one, but I need to be fairly sure it can be setup to do what I want considering the cost.
I'm looking to do this with the least modifying / fuss - ie not installing pandebian or rolling my own .pnd files for the programs I need etc. I may want to do something like that down the road, but I need it to be a drop in (with minimal configuration changes) replacement for my current PDA. I currently use a Palm IIIxe syncing with evolution on my Debian desktop via gpilot. I miss having a keyboard on my pda, (old sharp wizard, no snyc abilities, thus the palm) and the Pandora seems to be the best candidate for something with a real keyboard that can snyc with a desktop Linux setup. If there are better options for my needs that I should look at I'm open to suggestions. I do really like the idea of having my 'pda' be more powerful than my current laptop, running my dos cad program on the road and other apps would be a bonus plus playing old Atari games would be cool. I get that the Pandora is not a PDA, but a full on desktop Linux computer, but the form factor and the fact that it is a native Linux machine makes it seem like the perfect PDA replacement for me.
here's the condensed Verizon of my understanding on PIM apps (please correct / add any info that I'm missing / have wrong) my thinking is run the same program on the Pandora and the desktop, would make sync easier.
qorganizer - seems quite a few people use this on Pandora, but after running it on my PC I cant see that it has the month view like Evolution does where you can see the actual appointments, and thus is not a good candidate for me.
Sunbird - tried this one too, if memory serves correct the month view issue was similar to qorganizer
simpleagenda - might be able to work with this, but would need separate programs for other PIM functions, like address book
evolution - would this even run on Pandora? its a bit heavy to me, I only use it because it was the only program I could get to properly(ish) sync with the Palm way back when I set that up. Also, I heard there are issues around trying to sync 2 computers Evo databases, something about the database having info on the host name encoded into it, causing errors when copied to another computer?
BORG -
http://mbcsoft.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=23&Itemid=38
I've messed around with this program a bit, being its a java .jar, that should be easy to run on the Pandora, right? It's interface is something I can get use to easily, and has several other features that Evo doesn't so this is my preferred PIM. Its designed to run in a window that 800x600 so the lower part of the window will be off the bottom of the Pandora's screen, but if I under stand correctly from a post I read here by holding one of the shoulder buttons and scrolling down with either a nub or the stylus I can scroll the virtual desktop down, like in the old days of Linux when we were dealing with crummy 2mb vid cards..... is that right?
Connectivity:
I don't have nor do I plan to have wireless in my house, from the user manual it appears there are many USB->Ethernet adapters that work with Pandora, but do they need me to download some special kernel modules? Or is it like most hardware on desktop Linux where there is a module already in the stock setup that auto loads when the hardware is plugged in?
I looked in the docs, and on the boards, but am still fuzzy on how connecting the Pandora as a USB mass storage device to my desktop works. I'm guessing physically it hooks up just like an mp3 player etc, using the USB port (not the "A" host port). But how does the NAND and the 2 SD cards show up? Do they act like any other mass storage device, IE show up as /dev/sdX /dev/sdY /dev/sdZ, one device for each, NAND, SD1, SD2? I read some posts about having a 'mass storage settings' on the Pandora, but it seemed they were aimed at getting Windows to recognize the Pandora correctly, is that not necessary for Linux?
SYNC:
my general plan is to have a directory tree on my desktop that synchronizes with the same tree on the Pandora, and storing all important data (like the PIM database etc) in those trees.
Rsync - as I understand it, there already exists a .pnd for rsync, which should make installation trivial. I use rsync from a remote server to backup my desktop already, so I have some experience with it. As I under stand it, rsync is only a one way operation, and thus I would have to sync PC -> Pandora and Pandora -> PC as 2 separate operations, depending on which was the 'up to date' one. Not idea in that I might have some files on each that were newer than the ones on the other...
Unison - claims to be bidirectional overcoming that limitation of rsync, I tried to use it, but ran into a major caveat, unison has to be installed on both machines, *and* has to be the exact same version to work properly. I don't know if a .pnd exists, and I imagine regular updates to the desktop machine would quickly cause a version mismatch, I could always do a package hold on the unison package, but all this is contingent on unison being available for Pandora.
I saw other options like luckybackup, but it seems most of them are just derivatives of rsync / unison, usually with a snazzy GUI. my initial thoughts on snyc was to have the Pandora operating as a computer on the network and sync as 2 separate networked machines, but I'm thinking that the Pandora could also be hooked to the PC as a USB mass storage device, and just snyc the 2 directories on one machine, would eliminate the "version mismatch" issues with unison....
Any thoughts / ideas / other ways to do this?
Final thoughts:
- For sure I'm trying to stay with free (as in speech, and beer) software if at all possible.
- I run Debian (etch, but will upgrade to squeeze after getting this figured out) on my desktop machine, do not have easy access to a windows machine.
- have not dug around in the system much since UDEV came along, but can do relatively simple shell scripts if needed to glue things together.
- preformed my testing using my etch desktop and or my squeeze laptop (sync testing etc)
Thank you to all who are willing to read my long post! I hoped to be as descriptive as possible, at the unfortunate expense of brevity. It is my hope that I can get a better sense of feasibility, and that the thread might help others that are looking to use the Pandora in a similar fashion. I've never used discussion boards etc before, I hope that I posted this in the correct area etc, unfortunately the link to the rules didn't work when I tried to follow it.
I'm looking to do this with the least modifying / fuss - ie not installing pandebian or rolling my own .pnd files for the programs I need etc. I may want to do something like that down the road, but I need it to be a drop in (with minimal configuration changes) replacement for my current PDA. I currently use a Palm IIIxe syncing with evolution on my Debian desktop via gpilot. I miss having a keyboard on my pda, (old sharp wizard, no snyc abilities, thus the palm) and the Pandora seems to be the best candidate for something with a real keyboard that can snyc with a desktop Linux setup. If there are better options for my needs that I should look at I'm open to suggestions. I do really like the idea of having my 'pda' be more powerful than my current laptop, running my dos cad program on the road and other apps would be a bonus plus playing old Atari games would be cool. I get that the Pandora is not a PDA, but a full on desktop Linux computer, but the form factor and the fact that it is a native Linux machine makes it seem like the perfect PDA replacement for me.
here's the condensed Verizon of my understanding on PIM apps (please correct / add any info that I'm missing / have wrong) my thinking is run the same program on the Pandora and the desktop, would make sync easier.
qorganizer - seems quite a few people use this on Pandora, but after running it on my PC I cant see that it has the month view like Evolution does where you can see the actual appointments, and thus is not a good candidate for me.
Sunbird - tried this one too, if memory serves correct the month view issue was similar to qorganizer
simpleagenda - might be able to work with this, but would need separate programs for other PIM functions, like address book
evolution - would this even run on Pandora? its a bit heavy to me, I only use it because it was the only program I could get to properly(ish) sync with the Palm way back when I set that up. Also, I heard there are issues around trying to sync 2 computers Evo databases, something about the database having info on the host name encoded into it, causing errors when copied to another computer?
BORG -
http://mbcsoft.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=23&Itemid=38
I've messed around with this program a bit, being its a java .jar, that should be easy to run on the Pandora, right? It's interface is something I can get use to easily, and has several other features that Evo doesn't so this is my preferred PIM. Its designed to run in a window that 800x600 so the lower part of the window will be off the bottom of the Pandora's screen, but if I under stand correctly from a post I read here by holding one of the shoulder buttons and scrolling down with either a nub or the stylus I can scroll the virtual desktop down, like in the old days of Linux when we were dealing with crummy 2mb vid cards..... is that right?
Connectivity:
I don't have nor do I plan to have wireless in my house, from the user manual it appears there are many USB->Ethernet adapters that work with Pandora, but do they need me to download some special kernel modules? Or is it like most hardware on desktop Linux where there is a module already in the stock setup that auto loads when the hardware is plugged in?
I looked in the docs, and on the boards, but am still fuzzy on how connecting the Pandora as a USB mass storage device to my desktop works. I'm guessing physically it hooks up just like an mp3 player etc, using the USB port (not the "A" host port). But how does the NAND and the 2 SD cards show up? Do they act like any other mass storage device, IE show up as /dev/sdX /dev/sdY /dev/sdZ, one device for each, NAND, SD1, SD2? I read some posts about having a 'mass storage settings' on the Pandora, but it seemed they were aimed at getting Windows to recognize the Pandora correctly, is that not necessary for Linux?
SYNC:
my general plan is to have a directory tree on my desktop that synchronizes with the same tree on the Pandora, and storing all important data (like the PIM database etc) in those trees.
Rsync - as I understand it, there already exists a .pnd for rsync, which should make installation trivial. I use rsync from a remote server to backup my desktop already, so I have some experience with it. As I under stand it, rsync is only a one way operation, and thus I would have to sync PC -> Pandora and Pandora -> PC as 2 separate operations, depending on which was the 'up to date' one. Not idea in that I might have some files on each that were newer than the ones on the other...
Unison - claims to be bidirectional overcoming that limitation of rsync, I tried to use it, but ran into a major caveat, unison has to be installed on both machines, *and* has to be the exact same version to work properly. I don't know if a .pnd exists, and I imagine regular updates to the desktop machine would quickly cause a version mismatch, I could always do a package hold on the unison package, but all this is contingent on unison being available for Pandora.
I saw other options like luckybackup, but it seems most of them are just derivatives of rsync / unison, usually with a snazzy GUI. my initial thoughts on snyc was to have the Pandora operating as a computer on the network and sync as 2 separate networked machines, but I'm thinking that the Pandora could also be hooked to the PC as a USB mass storage device, and just snyc the 2 directories on one machine, would eliminate the "version mismatch" issues with unison....
Any thoughts / ideas / other ways to do this?
Final thoughts:
- For sure I'm trying to stay with free (as in speech, and beer) software if at all possible.
- I run Debian (etch, but will upgrade to squeeze after getting this figured out) on my desktop machine, do not have easy access to a windows machine.
- have not dug around in the system much since UDEV came along, but can do relatively simple shell scripts if needed to glue things together.
- preformed my testing using my etch desktop and or my squeeze laptop (sync testing etc)
Thank you to all who are willing to read my long post! I hoped to be as descriptive as possible, at the unfortunate expense of brevity. It is my hope that I can get a better sense of feasibility, and that the thread might help others that are looking to use the Pandora in a similar fashion. I've never used discussion boards etc before, I hope that I posted this in the correct area etc, unfortunately the link to the rules didn't work when I tried to follow it.
