Any News From The Assembly Line ?


moxie

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EvilDragon said:
We started building them, improved quality control, try to finish those units as fast as possible.
How come this is not enough information? Asking over and over again will only slow down things... I spent a few hours replying to the same questions over and over again last week... I'd rather have worked on the next Hotfix, but that will have to be delayed now.

And if there is a question unanswered, it means we ourselves do not know the answer at the moment. There's no need for another another another and another thread....

Like a madman, I quote myself:

Moxie said:
Nothing is gained, neither in quality of information, nor quality of the end product, nor speed of delivery, by acting like this. Nothing.
 
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sryidc

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Moxie said:
Magic Sam said:
My initial post is 8 hours old, and still unanswered...
Is the hired assembly team that bad ? Do they fry every Pandora they touch ?
I can't believe ED doesn't know what his financial partner (who lives in a neighbour country, not in Hawaii) is doing, and I can't believe Craig doesn't know how well his employees work !
The more the OP team remains silent, the more this thread and the whole situation will go mad :(
Bye, Magic Sam

For FUCKS SAKE!!! IT IS F*CKING SUNDAY!!!

I do not know how to put this politely: Have you no f-ing manners at all? Have you got no parent to tell you right from wrong? Are you a complete imbecile?

The team is not your personal slaves. Yes, you have contributed money to this project, as has most others on this board. Still, this does not entitle you to BE ON THE F-ING BACKS OF THESE PEOPLE 24/7!!! If you want to be a drooling nagbucket, then by all means be that IN THE WORKING WEEK, even though you know it will be useless, because you, like all the other people on the board, already know all there is to know. You also will get to know news as they come, just like everybody else. But this is THE WEEKEND!!! How the hell do you expect these people to live? When are they going to sleep? How the F*CK can you possibly expect anybody to answer you inane nagging ON A SUNDAY!!!

This thread literally has me trembling with anger. No, it is not fair to compare you to a six-year-old. Most six years old children have more sense than this. I fully understand Craigs sometimes weird outbursts of anger, if this is the level of idiocy he is met with. Damn. Förbannade jävla kötthuven.

I fully expect this to be deleted quick as f*ck. So be it. I had to get this out of the system.
1115466316c7b31948e61111279339c0.gif
 
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CoLDSToRAGE

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EvilDragon said:
We started building them, improved quality control, try to finish those units as fast as possible.
How come this is not enough information? Asking over and over again will only slow down things... I spent a few hours replying to the same questions over and over again last week... I'd rather have worked on the next Hotfix, but that will have to be delayed now.

And if there is a question unanswered, it means we ourselves do not know the answer at the moment. There's no need for another another another and another thread....

Fearful as I am of leaping in here (here goes anyhow!). ;)

Maybe the questions that get asked over and over could be held in an F.A.Q. that gets updated as and when things change? Then there would be no real reason to answer questions in disparate threads.

Simply add a forum rule; "Please consult the F.A.Q. before you ask a question. If the question is not answered there, please ask it in the forum and we will add this to the F.A.Q.".

To my knowledge there is no such repository, and I think it might alleviate some tensions. I've read lots of useful posts here and on other non-official sites such as the PandoraPress, and these would be great brought together in a sensible place. If worded unambiguously I'm sure it would prevent most of the misunderstanding that I've read in the forums.

It might seem like overkill to have a forum largely concerning the production of the Pandora, but as it looks likely to go on for some time to come, it would probably benefit customers and Open Pandora Team members alike in the long run.

I'm sure there a many willing volunteers to maintain such an F.A.Q. and it would free up the Pandora Team to get on with more important issues. :D
 
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Edy

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EvilDragon said:
We make assumptions - people are annoyed they turn out to be true.
We don't make assumptions - people are annoyed there is no information.

We had this over and over during the last years - regardless what we do, people will be annoyed.

People just want their Pandoras at home... it's easy to understand their frustration.

I preordered at day one, two hours after the preorders started, and still nothing.... I've started to feel quite apathetic on this. Other exciting things have take over my attention and now I feel that if my Pandora arrived tomorrow I would try it for some hours and then switch it off and go back to have fun with my current (unrelated) projects.

An alternative would be to keep posting my frustation on the boards, but I prefer to spend my energies on more productive and exciting things. When will my Pandora arrive? well, now it's not a relevant subject to me. Maybe my feelings may change when it's here.

So long, and thank you for the fish.
 
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Magic Sam

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Hi :)

EvilDragon said:
Well - guess what... I did post that AS AN ANSWER to a question how things currently are. And no, I could not know that UPS did need two days longer than they planned to deliver the LCD cables from UK to me, so I did not know I couldn't ship them back soldered before Thursady to Craig's place.

If those two days delay hadn't been shipping would've been started on Thursday / Friday.

And THAT is the problem. If we say what's currently happening and what we try to do ("probably have!!"), there will be complaints when it didn't work out for any reason.

We make assumptions - people are annoyed they turn out to be true.
We don't make assumptions - people are annoyed there is no information.

We had this over and over during the last years - regardless what we do, people will be annoyed.

We started building them, improved quality control, try to finish those units as fast as possible.
How come this is not enough information? Asking over and over again will only slow down things... I spent a few hours replying to the same questions over and over again last week... I'd rather have worked on the next Hotfix, but that will have to be delayed now.

And if there is a question unanswered, it means we ourselves do not know the answer at the moment. There's no need for another another another and another thread....

Thanks for the update, and I'm sorry, I didn't want to bother you on a Sunday, it was not my intentions, really :) There's room for a better communication though...

EvilDragon said:
Assembly had not been stalled, just other things had been done like putting the LCDs into the top frame so that later on the LCD Cables can be applied.
Or testing broken boards to see if they can be fixed here or need to be sent back to Texas.
Or drilling more L/R Buttons.
Or applying DPads to the keymat.

This is all part of the building process - even if no Pandora is fully assembled after them. But they speed up assembly in the future.

And last week, 500 had been shipped alltogether, as the 200 units were currently in building process. That's why I clearly wrote "probably" in my post and not "for sure".

Thanks ! But you have to understand that your post do create expectations on our side, even when we read "probably" . I really thought my Pandora would arrive last week, and seeing no updates I thought I had the right to ask for an update, on a Sunday, which was my only day off last week.

kuru said:
It has been a really long wait. The wait during an actually running production feels like mere formality to me.
Prepare yourself to be disappointed, IMO

Moxie said:
Polite gets as polite does. When you are polite, I'll be polite. When you behave like an ass, I'll do likewise.
Very clever behaviour on behalf of a 37 years old University teacher !

I work as a university teacher. I sometimes have students IMing me in the middle of the night, or calling me on saturday evening (having somehow found my mobile number).
Tried the ON/OFF switch ?

At the very least, grown-up people ought to realise the basic division between professional and private time. If you have anything to ask of me in my professional capacity, you do it (and expect answers in) office hours.
Is there a placard anywhere with such information: OpenPandoraTeam will be open from 08.00 to 12.00am / 02.00 to 06.00pm, from Monday to Saturday ?
No ?
That's what I thought, because OP is NOT A REGULAR BUSINESS WITH OFFICE HOURS !!! It's an hobbyist project ran mostly by volunteers so far. This is not your University office here, you know ? They were, are, and will always be free not to answers post on weekends, but you can't stop people from posting, even on Sundays !

sryidc said:
Thanks for your support :p
Bye, Magic Sam
 
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Lanonov

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LuvClub said:
mr.miyagi said:
I think it is unbelievable that they have come so far with this pandora, especially when many guys in here act like children for Christmas that can't open their presents before evening.
Except it is nearly 6 months after Christmas now!
No, its 6 months before Christmas. :lol:
 
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moxie

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Magic Sam said:
Moxie said:
Polite gets as polite does. When you are polite, I'll be polite. When you behave like an ass, I'll do likewise.
Very clever behaviour on behalf of a 37 years old University teacher !

I work as a university teacher. I sometimes have students IMing me in the middle of the night, or calling me on saturday evening (having somehow found my mobile number).
Tried the ON/OFF switch ?

Well, see, that is the point. To what lengths should someone has to go in order to have private time? I am, after all, formally "off-duty". Should I have to pull out the phone plug and turn off the computer in order to be able to lead a private life? Should I have to, in effect, block out my family and friends in order to not have to deal with my professional life at a weekend?

To me, the answer is an obvious "Of course not". And this common courtesy ought to include anybody. Even builders of obscure handhelds. Especially so - After all, in my position my students actually have a legitimate right to the information - Their exam results. Here, there is only want, no right.

At the very least, grown-up people ought to realise the basic division between professional and private time. If you have anything to ask of me in my professional capacity, you do it (and expect answers in) office hours.
Is there a placard anywhere with such information: OpenPandoraTeam will be open from 08.00 to 12.00am / 02.00 to 06.00pm, from Monday to Saturday ?
No ?

No, because that is something that usually needs not be said. It is a part of common courtesy. Politeness, if you like :/

That's what I thought, because OP is NOT A REGULAR BUSINESS WITH OFFICE HOURS !!! It's an hobbyist project ran mostly by volunteers so far. This is not your University office here, you know ? They were, are, and will always be free not to answers post on weekends, but you can't stop people from posting, even on Sundays !

And neither can you. You are completely free to behave like an ass on a sunday, and I'm completely free to call you out on it. But the comment about the hobbyist project is interesting, because it shows how muddled up this thinking really is. Now, what is this project? If it is a hobbyist project, how come you are expecting professional-grade accounting and reporting from it? If you expect professional accounting and reporting, why are you not expecting professional communication practices when it comes to answers and availability? You can't have both, you know.

That said, even if we go with the "hobbyist project" tag, I still would find it far, far out of line to treat people like in this thread. To be clear: Posting questions is not the problem. The problem is the terrible attitude exhibited in the posts like "My question has now been unaswered for 8 hours" and "Well, I saw that Craig was online, so he has no reason not to answer". That is just plain rude, on a level that at least to me is unacceptable - Also known as "Behaving like an ass".
 
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mali

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Fatih has always done it right. Weekend is off :)
Btw, we got some info in an other thread, which I put in the quotes thread, so maybe it's time to stop the bickering. Or continue if you want to, it's amusing sometimes :p
 

Magic Sam

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Hi Moxie,

Moxie said:
Well, see, that is the point. To what lengths should someone has to go in order to have private time? I am, after all, formally "off-duty". Should I have to pull out the phone plug and turn off the computer in order to be able to lead a private life? Should I have to, in effect, block out my family and friends in order to not have to deal with my professional life at a weekend?

To me, the answer is an obvious "Of course not". And this common courtesy ought to include anybody. Even builders of obscure handhelds. Especially so - After all, in my position my students actually have a legitimate right to the information - Their exam results. Here, there is only want, no right.

I'm sorry but I disagree with you, again. The problem is not remaining plugged to your electronic devices on weekends (for your family and friends), the problem is actually using them, like answering phone calls or IM from your students when off-duty. Who's forcing you to do so ? Do your students threaten you ? Are you part of that uncivilized crowd (IMHO) who answers phone calls/text messages/mails/IM anywhere anytime (restaurants, theatres, while talking with friends, in the bed) ? I'm not...
Well it is the same here, I had the right to ask for an update, and OPT were free not to answer. BUT CRAIG DID, with one of his famous replies which answers nothing, then ED repeated well know facts, that's why I have insisted ! I didn't mean to be rude, OK ? I knew it was Sunday, and these guys have the right to rest like all human beings ! I have a lot of respect for them and their work, and I'm sure that when my Pandora will finally arrive, I'll be immensely pleased :)

No, because that is something that usually needs not be said. It is a part of common courtesy. Politeness, if you like :/

We shouldn't post any serious stuff on these boards on weekends, is that what you say ?

And neither can you. You are completely free to behave like an ass on a sunday, and I'm completely free to call you out on it.
No you're not, and PM'ed / reported about it by the way.

To be clear: Posting questions is not the problem. The problem is the terrible attitude exhibited in the posts like "My question has now been unaswered for 8 hours" and "Well, I saw that Craig was online, so he has no reason not to answer". That is just plain rude, on a level that at least to me is unacceptable - Also known as "Behaving like an ass".

As I have explained elsewhere, I didn't expect the OPT to answer my posts on Sunday, it was only a kind of provocation to make them react and tell what was really going on, but as we're dealing with online discussion here, you can never know the real intentions of the guy you're talking to. Mine were not bad, I can assure you. Even though I seemed rude, impolite or whatever to you, you were not entitled to insult me like you did !

Moxie, I think this discussion could last for pages and pages, yet we will never agree :( Can we please now put it to an end, or resume it privately by PM ? I wish you know me in real life, I'm not the bad, imbecile, uncultured guy you think I am.

@ ED, OPT, and everybody else: If I did hurt your feelings on Sunday I'M REALLY SORRY, it was not my intentions, but now the discussion is over, everything is fine :)

Bye, Magic Sam
 
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hedwards

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If people are this anxious about things, perhaps they should just ask for their money back, let the rest of us move up in que. And when the second or third batch opens up with a shorter time frame order then. I'm not sure what the point of berating people for information that's not reasonable to get is really accomplishing. At best it's just making the wait longer.

EDIT: Missed the previous edit, but this is a more general statement than what it probably looks like.
 

mali

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hedwards, you are really starting to annoy me, btw. There is rarely constructive input from you.
The broken record you turn around all the time has never ever done any good, except stirring up further trouble.
 

moxie

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Rearranging a bit for topicality

Magic Sam said:
Hi Moxie,
I'm sorry but I disagree with you, again. The problem is not remaining plugged to your electronic devices on weekends (for your family and friends), the problem is actually using them, like answering phone calls or IM from your students when off-duty. Who's forcing you to do so ? Do your students threaten you ?

I do not know how they do things around your place, but around here we actually use things like mobile phones and IM to, you know, keep in touch with family and friends. Apart from that, you do not understand the point. It is a question of stress management. It is not about answering (do you only answer phone calls from numbers you recognize?) or replying, it is a question of being able to handle your own time. A phone call or an IM appears NOW, and puts you back in the work stress situation, never mind how it is dealt with. A single email is quite simple to postpone to later, but a torrent of emails saying "You haven't answered yet!!!" is not OK. Is this difficult to understand?

We shouldn't post any serious stuff on these boards on weekends, is that what you say ?

Nope. I say "Whe shouldn't hound them like they are our own information slaves", that is what I say. The problem is not the posting of questions, it is the unreasonable expectations on when they should be answered.

Well it is the same here, I had the right to ask for an update, and OPT were free not to answer. [...], that's why I have insisted !

Do you not see your own contradiction here?

And neither can you. You are completely free to behave like an ass on a sunday, and I'm completely free to call you out on it.
No you're not, and PM'ed / reported about it by the way.

Of course you did. As I wrote, I expected that. But don't be silly - Of course I'm as free as you are to post.

you can never know the real intentions of the guy you're talking to. Mine were not bad, I can assure you. Even though I seemed rude, impolite or whatever to you, you were not entitled to insult me like you did !

We've been talking that bit over in PM. Perhaps next time it will not be necessary to call you an imbecile in order to make you actually read and react to your own rudeness? I mean, I was not the first one pointing out to you that this thread was a bit over the top, right?


I didn't mean to be rude, OK ? I knew it was Sunday, and these guys have the right to rest like all human beings ! I have a lot of respect for them and their work, and I'm sure that when my Pandora will finally arrive, I'll be immensely pleased :)
@ ED, OPT, and everybody else: If I did hurt your feelings on Sunday I'M REALLY SORRY, it was not my intentions, but now the discussion is over, everything is fine :)

There is hope, then. Now, let that respect show in action.
 
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moxie

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It is obviously not the same avatar - ED is dressed in black and has shoes on. Apart from that, I am a bit confused. See, there are those little flyspecks above the avatar that actually spell out names, you know, and I am pretty certain that EvilDragon is not spelled M-O-X-I-E.

As for asses, I'm only aware of the acting kinds. Perhaps you have reserves of experience that you can use in explaining a bit further?
 

hedwards

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mali said:
hedwards, you are really starting to annoy me, btw. There is rarely constructive input from you.
The broken record you turn around all the time has never ever done any good, except stirring up further trouble.
You're entitled to your opinion, but for what it's worth it's perfectly sensible advice. If people are getting this worked up about how things are going, then they probably should be asking for a refund so that those in a better position to take the risk can do so. The fact that people disagree with that bit of common sense is hardly my fault.

Ultimately, it's not my fault that a subset of the people here are failing to properly read my posts. I'm not responsible for people that fail to read or understand English properly. I'm also not responsible for certain people around here being kind of tetchy.
 
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mali

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^ I've seen some of the biggest supporters turn into threateners over the long time this project is already running. It's a matter of _respect_ to listen to the worries of members of this community. Telling them to cancel is insulting in my opinion.

And especially putting some teasing on top when the fight is already over, is bad taste. IMO.
 

Perky_Goth

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Any news from the assembly line?

I don't think that discussion is taking us anywhere, you've made your points, you don't agree with each other, and I don't think I agree with either of you by the way you've behaved.
OTOH, if this helps you, use the thread for your discussion.
 
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