All Refunds Not Sent Yet


Just came here after a few days and read 10 pages worth of thread. Some other people's posts have got me in reply mode. And I've decided to reply in reverse order to when they were originally posted.

TaG said:
j.pickens said:
Chairman_Now said:
My bank informs me that my full dollar amount will be refunded, and that the equivalent in GBP will be deducted from the seller's accounts.
Wanna' bet on that fantasy?Can't see how that's gonna work if it was a GBP transaction. Be sure to let us know when you finally get all your dollars CN.
That WILL work actually. I once ordered something from the UK, then got into a situation where I had to get the bank to do a chargeback. I got back every cent I paid, then the bank themselves go after the full amount with the business in question, and believe me, with the size of most banks over most businesses, they WILL get ALL their money back. A small operation's like Craig's won't stand a chance of stopping this from happening. So let's just hope more US people (who are more smart than CN) and actually still want their P won't do this too or Craig could be in for some serious trouble.

GunPei2X said:
Yigguth said:
When will the credit card reorder page be up? I'm starting to lose my patience
It doesn't really matter when it's up, our places for preorder units are being kept. My guess though, is that it will be up around 30 days prior to when they expect to ship the first units.
If that's the case then the difference between what people get refunded and what they pay for reorder could well be more than a few $, since exchange rates could improve/destabilise (insert word needed as required) even more by then.

For instance, those in Australia should be getting back about $480 (or more) as opposed to the $450 we paid. What happenes if the reorder page isn't up for another month (or more) and the exchange rate continue in the current trend? We could well be up for a reorder cost well over $500.

I hope this doesn't happen and the reorder page is up very soon, but if not and the above happens then I may well reconsider my reorder.

GunPei2X said:
however in exchange you will be getting *double the RAM and NAND*.

GunPei2X said:
salasg is correct -- the RAM upgrade was specifically stated to compensate for the reordering.

These kind of comments really shit me. The RAM upgrade was NEVER the reason for needing to reorder. What about the people who DIDN'T need a refund/reorder? They are getting the EXACT SAME upgrades for NO EXTRA COST. So it is hardly fair really that some of us have to pay extra (no matter how little) while others just sit back with no extra outlay.

Sure, it's unfortunate this has happened but that doesn't make it fair.

As for the comment about the upgrades being spefically stated to compensate for this, I don't entirely believe that, if the bank fiasco had not happened, that Craig would not have put in these upgrades. Craig was very excited himself by the upgrades, so I believe they would have happened anyway.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
QUOTE
A ) Does it matter?

Yes, it does. For me the only part about the refund debacle that actually annoys me is the appearance of dishonesty. The answer to this question would resolve the "appearance" into fact or falsehood.

From the poll in another thread, over half the "interested" parties on the forum ordered the Pandora without having ever ordered a GP* device. In other words, they are "new customers" (such as myself) who have nothing but the current appearances on which to judge the honesty of the Pandora company.

QUOTE
B ) They're all being done by hand, so it probably took a few days. Could be why some people got their e-mails before the actual refund, and some after - they just hadn't got to those ones yet, and the bank beat them to it.

If this is the case, then let Chip verify it for us and/or let us know this is the case. Right now, everyone is making guesses as to what happened (including yourself).

For the record, I don't think this is a million dollar scam. But I can see how some people could think that with all the obfuscation around the issue and the pressure applied to posters that speak out on it.
 
That retarded bank is causing more problems than we had ever thought would happen in the first place..
 
Kloplop321 said:
That retarded bank is causing more problems than we had ever thought would happen in the first place..
In all fairness, we don't actually know the gory details.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
WELL gunpeix and others.. craigx, chip, etc. I got my refund today and guess what? I'm out 60 bucks now and you want me to pay you again? Even if it is your banks 'fault' this happened, it is YOUR responsibility. Whether this is an open source/homebrew project or not, this is still a business transaction. Just to let you know I will NOT be reordering and I have lost some faith in this project due to the crappy way it was handled. I will get the 60 dollars back as well and will be replying to your email about the refund. Here is the proof of the 60 dollars taken from me:

Original Transaction:
10/06/2008 GP32 DISTRIBUTION, NEWCASTLE UPO NC CHECKCARD TRANS. Debit $350.64

Refund:
12/08/2008 GP32 DISTRIBUTION GB NC CHECKCARD TRANS. Credit $290.92

To all of those who say "oh no.. not another bitching and moaning post" How the hell do you expect people NOT to be pissed off about this? You can only have so much faith and support in someone or something before standing up for yourself and not taking it in the ass and 60 dollars to me is a decent amount to be screwed on.. because if I were to pay again to get the pandora, I would have to pay 350 and in turn lose even more money... stupid! To others who live in other countries where your exchange rates were higher and you didn't lose any money, don't reply to me. <_<
 
Wolfspirit said:
...I'm out 60 bucks now and you want me to pay you again?... Here is the proof of the 60 dollars taken from me:

Original Transaction:
10/06/2008 GP32 DISTRIBUTION, NEWCASTLE UPO NC CHECKCARD TRANS. Debit $350.64

Refund:
12/08/2008 GP32 DISTRIBUTION GB NC CHECKCARD TRANS. Credit $290.92

To all of those who say "oh no.. not another bitching and moaning post" ...

Various people, including myself keep saying this, but once more:

If you choose to repay now, by bank transfer, you will only repay the $291 and you will not loose the $60 you quote. You will only be out if you have to pay a bank transfer fee.

If you want or need to wait for credit card re-ordering you might be affected by forex between your refund and your re-order. You may have to pay a small percentage extra.

If you re-order, openpandora have increased the RAM to make up for the distruption and possibly small extra cost.

If you choose not to re-order, you have effectively 'cancelled' your order and lost on the forex.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Just to reinforce the refund point...

QUOTE


Hi,

Yes you will only have the pay around the same amount you were
refunded. We'll send you the link to re-order by credit/debit card as
soon as the page is online. Should be in the next few days.

Thanks

Debs
 
BenT said:
QUOTE
B ) They're all being done by hand, so it probably took a few days. Could be why some people got their e-mails before the actual refund, and some after - they just hadn't got to those ones yet, and the bank beat them to it.

If this is the case, then let Chip verify it for us and/or let us know this is the case. Right now, everyone is making guesses as to what happened (including yourself).

Regarding verifying things, I think Chip's latest update (on the first post of this thread) is worth pasting in here, so it's available here, later in the thread (well, currently the current page :p), as well;

Chip said:
Update - Dec 7
Just got another message from Craig. As has become obvious, the refunds have not all been processed yet. They have been processed on our end, and the bank had told us that everything was done a week ago when this topic was first started, but clearly this was not the case. They now admit that they have yet to process a good chunk of the US refunds. We're told they "should be done this week", but we've heard that before. Further details will be posted when I get them.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Any idea when you guys will be able to get the credit card site set up? My mom doesn't want to pay the fee for an international money transfer. :p
 
atomicthumbs said:
Any idea when you guys will be able to get the credit card site set up? My mom doesn't want to pay the fee for an international money transfer. :p
Not to mention the daily fluctuations to forex... this is getting ridiculous.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
TaG said:
If you choose to repay now, by bank transfer, you will only repay the $291 and you will not loose the $60 you quote. You will only be out if you have to pay a bank transfer fee.

If you want or need to wait for credit card re-ordering you might be affected by forex between your refund and your re-order. You may have to pay a small percentage extra.

If you re-order, openpandora have increased the RAM to make up for the distruption and possibly small extra cost.

If you choose not to re-order, you have effectively 'cancelled' your order and lost on the forex.
Everyone who is out because of exchange rates would be subject to some level of transfer fee (& conversion fee), because they are only free within the UK and obviously UK customers won't have been affected.
The refunds have spread across a couple of weeks already. Not everybody will even be getting a refund at the same rate! This is fair?

Nobody who paid by credit card should be expected to agree to now pay by transfer. If they have no qualms, that is their prerogative. Others have well founded fears about the risks. Had transfer been the only option at the start of this, plenty of people (myself included) would not have boarded this ship until we saw how the first batch played out.

If they are expected to wait to pay again by Card, at what point is patience supposed to run out waiting for the CC reorder facility? 2009? The dollar could go on a rollercoaster in the meantime.
Is it still the position that it's not up for want of access to a working PC?

If anyone chooses not to reorder because the Card facility has not become available, this has not been a 'voluntary' cancellation of the order. The order was already terminated and the ability to reinstate it under the original terms removed. It's a position they have been put in, at a loss.

The extra RAM as consolation is a red herring. Welcome, but surely something they began to consider as desirable if not essential for future batches, and there would be a lot of angry people next year with non-upgradeable first-gen machines if they didn't add now what they intended later - especially if some software required it.

/flees the hail of rotten fruit and abuse
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Asmo said:
TaG said:
If you choose to repay now, by bank transfer, you will only repay the $291 and you will not loose the $60 you quote. You will only be out if you have to pay a bank transfer fee.

If you want or need to wait for credit card re-ordering you might be affected by forex between your refund and your re-order. You may have to pay a small percentage extra.

If you re-order, openpandora have increased the RAM to make up for the distruption and possibly small extra cost.

If you choose not to re-order, you have effectively 'cancelled' your order and lost on the forex.
Everyone who is out because of exchange rates would be subject to some level of transfer fee (& conversion fee), because they are only free within the UK and obviously UK customers won't have been affected.
The refunds have spread across a couple of weeks already. Not everybody will even be getting a refund at the same rate! This is fair?

Nobody who paid by credit card should be expected to agree to now pay by transfer. If they have no qualms, that is their prerogative. Others have well founded fears about the risks. Had transfer been the only option at the start of this, plenty of people (myself included) would not have boarded this ship until we saw how the first batch played out.

If they are expected to wait to pay again by Card, at what point is patience supposed to run out waiting for the CC reorder facility? 2009? The dollar could go on a rollercoaster in the meantime.
Is it still the position that it's not up for want of access to a working PC?

If anyone chooses not to reorder because the Card facility has not become available, this has not been a 'voluntary' cancellation of the order. The order was already terminated and the ability to reinstate it under the original terms removed. It's a position they have been put in, at a loss.

The extra RAM as consolation is a red herring. Welcome, but surely something they began to consider as desirable if not essential for future batches, and there would be a lot of angry people next year with non-upgradeable first-gen machines if they didn't add now what they intended later - especially if some software required it.

/flees the hail of rotten fruit and abuse

No rotten fruit from me. Yours is one of the best argued cases so far.

I agree that we would probably have gotten the RAM anyway, but it was given at the time of the re-order situation arose as, lets say, an olive branch. Good news / bad news thing.

And please, I really am not saying anyone should pay by bank transfer - I'm not, my funds ar sitting on a credit card and as soon as they want it back from the credit card they can have it.

As to fair, or those that haven't had to re-order also getting the RAM upgrade, no of course it's not fair. Unfortunately the only way to make it fair would have been to make everyone 'suffer' the same fate. Just like it's not fair that UK second batchers will have a hike of something like £60 (based on a rough calculation I did a week or so ago and might now be more or less) but the US will only go up $9.

I do agree that unless the credit card page gets up soon the exchange rates could seriously affect some. Many may not re-order and it must surely damage the business. I suspect they first need to ensure that all the refunds are cleared in people's accounts otherwise that will cause more headaches, and secondly I suspect that they want to ensure the majority of units will ship within 30 days of the credit card re-orders so that they do not fall foul of any other regulations or nervousness from bankers. Yes the longer it goes on the more valid your point of not a voluntary cancellation, although it will depend on exactly how they deal with it.

Let's all hope it get resolved soon, heh?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
TaG said:
No rotten fruit from me. Yours is one of the best argued cases so far.
/Breathes a sigh of relief.
/Scans the skies for incoming melons. Just in case. ;)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Chip, please ask them again when the credit card reorder page will be available and please post their updated reply to this threads first post.
Thanks.
 
Asmo said:
TaG said:
No rotten fruit from me. Yours is one of the best argued cases so far.
/Breathes a sigh of relief.
/Scans the skies for incoming melons. Just in case. ;)



thats just it for must US customers , depending on the bank, unless currency exchange loss tops out at near 10% its still cheaper for me personaly to wait for a CC page than to trasfer money. not to mention the saftey issues. i feel bad for both the early adopters and the Open Pandora team that this got so borked right outa the gate its caused alot of friction and headache on both ends im sure.


though i could ready up a corpse fruit for you Asmo if it makes you feel justified in ducking.. (i would those things smell god awful hense the name )
 
Last edited by a moderator:
mmalficia said:
i could ready up a corpse fruit for you Asmo if it makes you feel justified in ducking.. (i would those things smell god awful hense the name )
I'm going to wear a wetsuit and Gas mask on the internet from now on. And move the computer into the basement. :D
 
Last edited by a moderator:
rmm21 said:
Chip, please ask them again when the credit card reorder page will be available and please post their updated reply to this threads first post.
Thanks.
Here's my latest correspondence (to save Chip some time) (bolded for emphasis!):

QUOTE
QUOTE
I'd like to order via credit card.

I hope you guys get through this without too many scars! :(
Hi Jacob,

We're trying to :) We'll send you the link to re-order by
credit/debit card as soon as the page is online. Should be in the
next few days.

Thanks

Debs

And just in case you didn't notice, it's a guess, not a promise.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Prometheus: I read that update from Chip. Until we're informed otherwise, it makes sense to assume the banks are not in charge of the GP2X email servers. As such, GP2x (not the bank) sent out refund emails five days after saying they had done them all.
 
I'm pretty sure that there's a already been an update where someone said as much. I just went and had a look for it - it's here, as part of the thread "Dec Update" (obviously, it's best read in conjunction with the most recent update in this thread, given the new information regarding the bank in this one :p).
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Back
Top