A Lot Of Xgp Kids Information

[Orkie]

Who wants to develop software for a machine using such an awful resolution that it can't run any other hardware like the rest of the XGP line without disgusting scaling?

I speak from a developer's standpoint as I considered development for this machine. But it doesn't make sense in that my projects are multiplatform in nature, the resolution is too nonstandard, the CPU is too slow, there isn't enough RAM and there is no graphical acceleration to make up for any of these shortcomings.

Although I do agree that JaqMs is being a bit fanatical about the XGP Mini, I do disagree with some of what you have said.
Actually, I would quite like to have a go at developing for it. It is interesting to try other platforms. Coping with their differences can be a challenge but it isn't that hard if you plan for it. As for your complaints about the hardware not being good enough, I just don't think you have ever tried programming under these kinds of limitations. It isn't as hard as it first seems!

Still, it is probably true that without emulators it will get little use.

 

[JaqMs]

I have heard about emulators not being able to run on the XGP Kids MANY TIMES IN THE PAST. I don't need anyone to refresh my memory. See what happens: every time I post news about the XGP's, someone DaveC comes along and says the routine "aspect ratio, tiny screen, no 2d accelerator, analog joystick, etc, etc, etc".

 

[Epicenter]

You still have no provided no task the XGPKiDS is really well suited for that will actually catch ON. Orkie-- I hate writing code that will never run on anything else, and on a platform few people will buy. That's why I wouldn't code for it. As for the hardware not being powerful enough-- it's pretty beefy, but anything I've coded for the GP2X would run abysmally on it and that ruins any kind of multplatform code to have to tweak the shit out of it just to get it to run on crippled uncompatible devices.

 

[Winterkid]

Maybe lynx too, but no one really plays that

Hey! I like the Lynx! Blockout and Rampart are fun, not to mention Rampage. (I prefer to play as Lizzy, btw. Reminds me of Godzilla's bitch wife)

Aside from the few emulation titles that are possible, I doubt any commercial games can be released that would be THAT mind-blowing for the screen resolution they are releasing.

Also, I would HATE to try to watch a movie on the screen, IF they got the player working. I accidentally encoded a DivX at 200x150, and when I tried to watch it, I couldn't make out anything. The audio was great, but the resolution was horrible. Happens when you set both the width and the file size to 200. (don't drowse and encode!) The resolution might be a BIT more defined with a higher video bitrate, but it'll still get irritating to watch after a bit. Even cartoons/anime, and good luck reading any subtitles, you're likely stuck with dubbing.

So, from what I can tell...

The XGP will be good for...
- MP3 playback
- Commercial games with low resolution graphics
- Homebrew games with low res graphics
- Emulators of Gameboy/ Color Gameboy/ Wonderswan?/ Atari Lynx /NES (Maybe?)
- Low resolution/ small sized animation.
- Kids with small hands

 

[yonibear]

The XGP-KiDS is just a product that shouldn't exist; it'd likely make the XGP Mini and XGP much less expensive in the end.

You know, Gamepark plans to make money with the XGP Kids. As far as i know Gamepark is not a charity and therefore doesn't plan to loose money with is products, so i don't understand how XGP and XGP mini would become cheaper if the XGP Kids didn't exist.

 

[iignotus]

The XGP-KiDS is just a product that shouldn't exist; it'd likely make the XGP Mini and XGP much less expensive in the end.

You know, Gamepark plans to make money with the XGP Kids. As far as i know Gamepark is not a charity and therefore doesn't plan to loose money with is products, so i don't understand how XGP and XGP mini would become cheaper if the XGP Kids didn't exist.

Because they wouldn't be wasting gobs of money on the production line and advertissement of a handheld that appeals to no one.

 

[JaqMs]

Yeah, doesn't appeal to you guys because most of you like emulators and emulators ONLY. It's obvious most of you didn't read who the XGP Kids is targeted to. Is every handheld supposed to fit your needs: emulators, emulators, and emulators? Is$75 not worth something different? How about this: would you rather that Gamepark release a handheld with a 320x240 screen, D-pad, AA batteries, and all of that, which would either make no point in getting it because it is exactly the same as the GP2X or make no point in getting the GP2X since Gamepark's handheld is better?

Here is an insight, though it is a bit off-topic:

In 2001, Gamepark made the GP32. It was almost as powerful as the GBA, which was also new at the time. The GP32 gained success in the homebrew community. Now in 2006, Gamepark will make the XGP. It is almost as powerful as the PSP, which is still one of the newest handhelds at this time. Now why do you all say that the XGP is doomed to failure because of this?

 

[iignotus]

Yeah but even the GBA has a bigger screen than this, and the small size of the GBA's screen was a decent-sized problem to be overcome by developers. I don't care about emulators on this system, really, because I have a gp2x. But why would anything be particularly great on such a small screen? Do you not realise how small 220x176 is? This is how big that screen size is:

I just don't see how that could be a great thing to play on, no matter what you're playing.

 

[JaqMs]

Ok first all, try making a 320x240 bitmap and compare your GP2X screen to it before posting pointless pictures like that. Second, by "anything" you probably mean Super Mario Bros, Zelda, some random Amiga game, etc, etc. The games that will run well on the XGP Kids are the games that are designed for it. You guys really, really, really have to look at these handhelds beyond how well you think it will be able to run an NES emulator and 5000 games that you want to try.

 

[Dzz]

If they manage somehow to pull a big pile of fun and unique games designed specifically for their console out of thin air in the next couple months and bundle them with the unit, I'll agree it can be successful.

Of course, they have to compete with stuff like this:

http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?Pr...eed.PDP+VG-2500

 

[iignotus]

Ok first all, try making a 320x240 bitmap and compare your GP2X screen to it before posting pointless pictures like that.

It's not pointless. Anyone with a brain can see how small that is compared to images and games they're used to playing. Oh by the way, the pixel density between my LCD monitor and GP2X are almost the same (with my monitor actually having a lower density), so there goes that argument that I think it's too small because my resolution is too high or something. But it's not even about size in mm, it's about the number of pixels there are to display on. The Kid's screen is 50% smaller than the GP2X's and XGP mini's. Here they are side by side:

Second, by "anything" you probably mean Super Mario Bros, Zelda, some random Amiga game, etc, etc.

I love how you resort to assumptions when you're on the losing side of a debate. When I say anything, I mean anything. It's such an incredibly small resolution. People just don't make good games for that size screen, there's not enough room to put anything worthwhile. What games (or series, or genres) can you say have been or could be successful on a screen that small? Other than cell-phone games, I can't think of anything. And certainly nothing 3D. And why would I want to buy a handheld that plays cell-phone-quality games?

The games that will run well on the XGP Kids are the games that are designed for it. You guys really, really, really have to look at these handhelds beyond how well you think it will be able to run an NES emulator and 5000 games that you want to try.

The games that are designed for it by... who? Does gamepark really have the funds to license out any good games/developers/companies to make stuff for this particular handheld? I told you, it's gotten to the point where I can't see this system being useful for any real, enjoyable gaming, and I'm completely disregarding emulation. I would love to be proven wrong.

But a screen that small is just a huge mistake.

 

[JaqMs]

Ok smart ass:

GBA: 240x160
XGP Kids: 220x176

Yup, the XGP Kids screen is TINY compared to the GBA. And you say "it's about the number of pixels there are to display on":

GBA: 240 * 160 = 38400 pixels
XGP Kids: 220 * 176 = 38720 pixels

Oh well it doesn't really matter. No good games were released for the GBA because of its small screen. (And if I'm wrong about the resolutions, please correct me instead of bashing)

 

[iignotus]

Well first

Yup, the XGP Kids screen is TINY compared to the GBA. And you say "it's about the number of pixels there are to display on":

I never said it was tiny compared to the GBA.

I told you that making games with a lot of detail for the GBA was something difficult to overcome. All of the SNES Classics ports had to have a lot of detail lost to be ported. Lots of the games have seperate screens for menus or things that should be on-screen. Not to mention that the GBA had Nintendo and a bunch of real, qualified developers behind it who knew what they were doing.

And now that I've shown you how small this screen is compared to the GP2X's and XGP Mini's, you've chosen to completely disregard that as well. GG.

 

[Winterkid]

That seems to be check and mate for iignotus. *nod*

I'm mostly thinking movies, hi-res photos and even simple games. Unless it's got a top-notch scaler, like Epicenter said (I think it was him), anything you watch or play on there is going to look just awful. Because it's not an EXACT half of a 4:3 standard resolution, some of the pixels will either blend horribly or just get lost in the squish. Using the best video encoding, you COULD resize all your video to 220x176, but it'll still look like crap when you look at it really closely, even cartoons or anime. Also subtitles would be pretty much a loss cause it would take up half the screen for a long line, unless you make it so you can barely read them.

 

[JaqMs]

Yeah but even the GBA has a bigger screen than this, and the small size of the GBA's screen was a decent-sized problem to be overcome by developers.

"Tiny" was an exaggeration, but I don't see how you said the problem was "difficult".

All of the SNES Classics ports had to have a lot of detail lost to be ported.

There you go again with the emulators. [very good GBA game] had a lot of detail lost, too.

Of course the frikkin GBA games had limitations, because they were designed for the frikkin GBA! Might as well say that computer programs should have been designed to fit a screen the size of an entire wall. I've NEVER heard mass complaints about the GBA's small screen.

And yet, iignotus still can't accept that he's wrong. Remember? 38400 vs 38720?

 

[iignotus]

There you go again with the emulators. [very good GBA game] had a lot of detail lost, too.

Okay, so, let me know how a port is an emulator :lol: :lol: :lol: I didn't think so. Actually this point has been brought up specifically because GP is saying that the Kids system is "compatible with GP32 game", even though what they really mean is that it uses the same OS shell as the GP32 did, and all the games would have to be graphically recoded, which would lose a huge amount of detail. This "compatibility" is something that GP is flaunting everywhere, like it's actually true.

Of course the frikkin GBA games had limitations, because they were designed for the frikkin GBA!

Of course that sentence doesn't make sense, because the words that make it are non-sensical!

I've NEVER heard mass complaints about the GBA's small screen.

Because not only was a Nintendo product, and therefore almost destined to succeed (just because they're a large company, don't jump on me ninty-haters ), but also it was released more than half a decade ago, the technical expectations for systems back then was considerably lower, especially for handheld systems. This is a brand new system that could have been full of potential if it weren't for this tiny screen.

And yet, iignotus still can't accept that he's wrong. Remember? 38400 vs 38720?

HOHO! I MUST'VE DIVIDED BY ZERO BY ACCIDENT. 240 is larger than 220, and the horizontal resolution is more important than the vertical resolution. A 320 pixel difference? Is that your point? Is that the killer point I'm supposed to be wrong about, the point that debases my entire argument and proves me a fraud? Oh, well then shit, I guess you got me there.

I'll stop trying to share information here since people don't listen to the requests I make in the first post.

I don't know in what dictatorship you live, but you can't just tell people what to and what not to say ("No more emulator talk or I'll scream!"). And furthermore, I thanked you for your information, but you still try to be a dick at every turn.

Might as well remove the XGP section since I now see that this is a GP2X purist forum.

What a great point you would've had if I hadn't said in almost every post I made in this thread that the XGP mini looks awesome! Do you even know how to read? Or is that skill subdued by your desire to be a complete twat who's unable to hold a conversation with anyone?

 

[JaqMs]

This thread will be removed/cleaned up later so we can start fresh.

 

[iignotus]

This thread will be removed/cleaned up later so we can start fresh.

What are you a mod now? That's a pretty awful way to concede, pretending like you have the authority to close a topic. All my points were completely valid, and you just choose to disregard them because you can't hold a conversation with anyone. You are the worst mouthpeice I've ever seen, GP should ban you from ever talking about their upcoming systems.

 

[JaqMs]

I contacted a mod to close this so I can repost the thread without all this crap. I don't care if your points are valid, this is going nowhere. I'll also admit that I'm mostly the one that started this since I've been in an especially bad mood today.

 

[iignotus]

I contacted a mod to close this so I can repost the thread without all this crap. I don't care if your points are valid, this is going nowhere. I'll also admit that I'm mostly the one that started this since I've been in an especially bad mood today.

Then I will be forced to repost my exact same points in a more polite tone. But just because you're in a bad mood doesn't mean you should take it out on others. I thank you for the apology, though.