I pity you, Craig.
You say you'd like to offer special painted units, like people have asked for numerous times, and you get called "fucked up" and "sick" for it.
I think special edition units are a great idea. I don't want one, I'm happy with the standard unit; but I know some people are willing to pay a considerable premium for a rarity. Good luck with it.
I really can't believe some of the crazy ideas that crop up on this board.
The team have said: as soon as the cases are picked up, MWeston goes to the UK to start fixing the early boards. As soon as the cases arrive, they start assembling units, and will probably ship the first finished units within a day. On what possible rational grounds do you think Craig would now suddenly decide to halt the assembly process while he gets 100 units specially designed, painted up, tested and sold off? Even if he does this in parallel with preorder assembly, I very much doubt he'll even get the custom designs finished, let alone the cases painted, before the majority of units have gone out.
We have all preordered the standard Pandora, as described in the specifications. We are all entitled to receive that. We are not automatically entitled to anything else!
Some random amount of boards may be capable of additional overclocking. You should not have ordered one with the expectation you would receive one. The team are more than within their rights to test and set aside a subset of boards rated to higher speed, and charge a premium for them. You will still get exactly the item you paid for.
Even if those 100 (and only those 100) special units are capable of running software a little bit faster than the production units, why will anyone (other than those owners for themselves) write any software only usable on 2.5% of an already tiny niche market? If they were instead randomly distributed among the production run, the situation would be the same -- if anything, it would be worse.
Again, you ordered a Pandora. You didn't order a Pandora, with a upgrade option to Super Pandora by paying the difference. If you bought Avatar on DVD, you don't automatically get the option of trading up to the Ultimate Edition for the difference in price. I think the team will probably offer to let you pay the extra and go to the end of the queue to get a Special Edition, but they're not obligated to do even that. You're certainly not entitled to insist they do so, and still keep your place in line.
And finally, how about we treat these guys with a modicum of respect?
If Craig says something with room for interpretation (on Twitter. Twitter, for crissakes), how about you just ask him "could you please clarify that some more?" and not jump straight to "OMG I can't believe this shit!".
With the amount of unpleasantness they all have to deal with on these forums, it wouldn't surprise me if they said "Here's your goddamn finished Pandora, you ungrateful bastards, enjoy. I quit."
And who could blame them?
TBF you cannot say that doesn't go both ways. I myself came here (and registered just to reply) and saw countless requests to clarify that they wouldn't lose their place, for every "OMG, This is Fucked-up" etc, there were MANY logical posts asking for verification that their pre-order would be the priority. And Craig just went into rant mode himself. TBH I am not yet a customer, but have been following this project for a long while, and that kinda put me off purchasing (not enough, but it didn't help). Ranting about the community that helped create and support and FINANCE the whole project and just activating Dick-mode, isn't good for business, and I think Craig should apologise more so than anyone else. He clarified nothing in his post, and just cried how PAYING CUSTOMERS were being selfish for wanting clarification their pre-order was the priority.
I agree with the majority of the rest of the post though. I don't think anyone in the queue should be offered a SE Pandora. If they want one they can easily bid, and sell their Pandora, I am sure there would still be many takers for new(ish) standard ones. That's the point after all. I mean they get that "First Batch" thing (although a bit moot if it's under the battery lid and not on show). They don't have any obligation to hand out SEs to those in the queue, and the bidding could possibly go higher than what they may offer to the queue, and the point is to make a little extra, so may aswell maximise the profit and sell them in some sort of auction format.
Ranting about the community that helped create and support and FINANCE the whole project and just activating Dick-mode, isn't good for business, and I think Craig should apologise more so than anyone else. He clarified nothing in his post, and just cried how PAYING CUSTOMERS were being selfish for wanting clarification their pre-order was the priority.
Exactly. Generally, calling a paying customer and investor a "selfish asshole", just because he complains is unprofessional and rude (at least). If this customer is already waiting for more than 1 year for a product to be finished, this is ... I don't find words which are NOT offending.
IMHO Craigs behavior is even worse, because its his own fault that people complain. He was not able to communicate correctly (again). The idea itself is great, but presenting it without detailed information about how it affects existing preorders HAS to result in complains. Instead of realizing this, he offends complaining customers in the most unprofessional way. Is this the way to say "Thanks for your money and trust for > 1 year" ???
Sorry, but this whole "I'm drunk on the roof" and "Give me your order number"(*) thing is just childish. And I'm really pissed seeing OP customers being treated that way.
Drink less, think more.
(*) Or is it "Give me your order number, selfish asshole !" now?
I pity you, Craig.
You say you'd like to offer special painted units, like people have asked for numerous times, and you get called "fucked up" and "sick" for it.
I quite agree with this. Craig, in 140 characters, says "I've got a great idea that everyone is going to love, details to follow eventually", everyone makes assumptions based on no further information, get angry over those assumptions (many of which turn out to be incorrect, non-issues, or even impossible), EvilDragon comes along and supplies just a little more information, everyone calms down, and Craig has an aneurysm.
Exactly. Generally, calling a paying customer and investor a "selfish asshole", just because he complains is unprofessional and rude (at least). If this customer is already waiting for more than 1 year for a product to be finished, this is ... I don't find words which are NOT offending.
IMHO Craigs behavior is even worse, because its his own fault that people complain. He was not able to communicate correctly (again). The idea itself is great, but presenting it without detailed information about how it affects existing preorders HAS to result in complains. Instead of realizing this, he offends complaining customers in the most unprofessional way. Is this the way to say "Thanks for your money and trust for > 1 year" ???
Sorry, but this whole "I'm drunk on the roof" and "Give me your order number"(*) thing is just childish. And I'm really pissed seeing OP customers being treated that way.
Drink less, think more.
(*) Or is it "Give me your order number, selfish asshole !" now?
I don't mind any of that, I've learned to not take things so personally. He's not investigating who's posting what and cutting off their order like he could attempt to do. So it's all just words. You obviously know what he's like. Reading you bitching about him (and other posts like it) is worse in my opinion that having to look past craig's rough edges. It's him, like it or lump it.
---- this isn't directed at you----
[TLDR]; Just leave it alone and roll the dice, or get the guarantee and wait.[/TLDR]
I've been thinking of my chances of getting an 800mhz pandora. While it would be nice, and we are all rolling the same dice, there is by no means foul play here. You ordered what was originally listed at 600mhz. If it is capable of going higher fine. That's the chance you take. Them weeding out the best 100 and selling those at a premium? Well that's fine too. TI is doing it, Intel does it, now why can't OP? They are not just re-sellers, they made it. They're more than entitled to do so. As long as it's capable as what is advertised, then no wrong has been done.
Stop complaining about not getting more than what you paid for. The specs seem to have improved a bunch from when I first ordered, ram proc battery. True most of it is the difference between what it was said it can do on paper and what it can actually do but it's still more. The ram was an actual physical upgrade, so I'm still happy about that, and that was like what, over a year ago?
If you are truly concerned about your chances of getting more than everyone else, buy the limited edition, it's a guarantee. If you can't, then roll the dice with the rest of us, you guessing where in the line of 4000 that they will be plucked from is all speculation. It's like blaming the number picker on the lottery for not choosing your number. If you think it's from the top, then go to the back of the line, if you think it's from the back, be glad you're in the front. They would be stupid to tell us where they're being chosen from. Say it was from the 2000-3000 range, everyone in that group would try to reorder to increase their chances.
If you're worried that your order will be delayed some if you have to cancel and reorder to get a special edition... Shut up, you're getting a better one, and what is another couple months anyway? Anything could happen at this point to delay it that long or longer. So I think I made it pretty clear what you're choices are.
[TLDR]; Just leave it alone and roll the dice, or get the guarantee and wait.[/TLDR]
The only "special" edition of pandora that I want to buy is with (guess what), a different labeling on the keymat, for a different keyboard layout (tada.wav). But I would need to dust-off my old layout files, etc, and I want to avoid a cold crack in my heart so better not to do that.
Apart from that, I would ponder if I would pay extra for having a case painted in dirt-brown.
Wow. This turned out badly. Well, after reading the posts this far, I can say I'm already half pleased with how OPT handles this. The special editions will ship after the existing preorders. Now the second, lesser point I wanted clarification on is: will the binning occur before or after shipping the existing preorders?
I just want clarification, not this shitstorm. I really like the idea of special edition pandoras, and I truly do believe you earn every extra penny you can get. I just want to know how -if- this affects my preorder. This is what I believe most of us here want. The shitstorm is just people panicing in the dark.
Please, OPT. Just clarify on this and people will probably calm down.
If they were cherry picking them right away, and the first 1,000 became the first 900, then yeah I'd be pissed too. But I don't think it's going to happen that way. Realistically they could probably cherry pick the last batch of boards that comes from Texas, so no one has to wait for more boards to arrive because the "chosen ones" have been put aside.
^ That's a very good point. Painted and numbered units are going to be appealing enough. 800mhz units only throw the spotlight onto an issue that was already controversial. Maybe OPT should step back from the whole overclocking thing like they did before, talk only in TI factory ratings (600mhz) and leave the nutty N900-style overclocking to the community.
OK, so we're half half way to having the mob placated again. The 'special' units will not happen before the pre-orders are all fulfilled.
That leaves the question of if or how the speed binning will occur. Nothing official has come out on this yet. Obviously, binning during the build process would somewhat delay a portion of the units going out at any given time. It would also potentially deplete the population of 'superboards' getting randomly sent out. IMHO - Skip the speed tests beyond 600Mhz until after the first batch goes out. You're better off not knowing who is getting a hot rod board.
cosurgi said:
The only "special" edition of pandora that I want to buy is with (guess what), a different labeling on the keymat, for a different keyboard layout (tada.wav). But I would need to dust-off my old layout files, etc, and I want to avoid a cold crack in my heart so better not to do that.
Knowing that this doesn't make a difference as to anything and that this question is completely irrelevant to the way things will turn out... how many boards have you seen so far that don't go to 800mhz?
Oh yeah, I did order it with those kinds of overclocks in mind, though now I know that it's not guaranteed, I'm not entitled to anything, etc.
Knowing that this doesn't make a difference as to anything and that this question is completely irrelevant to the way things will turn out... how many boards have you seen so far that don't go to 800mhz?
Knowing that this doesn't make a difference as to anything and that this question is completely irrelevant to the way things will turn out... how many boards have you seen so far that don't go to 800mhz?
As long as there isn't a wealth of programs that require a certain overclocking level, I'm fine with it completely and will be happy with anything, really. Thanks for the info.
Something I've wondered was, if the more recent boards clock less overall compared to the previous revisions is because of the types of traces their using on these boards.
Could it affect overclocking like it affected the WIFI? (I'm not saying the boards are faulty, just likely to overclock less than previous revisions)
Can I just say that the GP2X I bought from GBAX, which I paid extra for the ability to overclock to 270mhz (iirc) becomes unstable at 240mhz and shuts down at just above 250mhz - and always has? I'm not terribly confident in this "guaranteed to go to 800mhz" at all. IMO, it would be better to just sell custom paintjobs rather than ropey overclocking ability.
Can I just say that the GP2X I bought from GBAX, which I paid extra for the ability to overclock to 270mhz (iirc) becomes unstable at 240mhz and shuts down at just above 250mhz - and always has? I'm not terribly confident in this "guaranteed to go to 800mhz" at all. IMO, it would be better to just sell custom paintjobs rather than ropey overclocking ability.
Something I've wondered was, if the more recent boards clock less overall compared to the previous revisions is because of the types of traces their using on these boards.
Could it affect overclocking like it affected the WIFI? (I'm not saying the boards are faulty, just likely to overclock less than previous revisions)
Overclocking is internal to the chip and should not affect and not be affected by what is on the board itself. The setting of voltage (VDD1) is dependent on an external chip, but I would be very surprised if the Pandora does not use TI's (or someone else's) reference design in this regard.
From all the titbits of information that the developers have said I think there's a high chance that the vast majority of the chips will be quite overclockable, perhaps to 800Mhz. However, that could just be hope, but the fact TI didn't start speed binning until after the Pandora chips were bought gives me confidence.
If it helps, it was said a little while back that they hadn't yet come across one that wouldn't clock to 800mhz. This was based on a pretty small sample size, not 4,000, so it's still not guaranteed that every Pandora will do it. But I'm going to say something really dangerous here and say eh, they probably will.
Can I just say that the GP2X I bought from GBAX, which I paid extra for the ability to overclock to 270mhz (iirc) becomes unstable at 240mhz and shuts down at just above 250mhz - and always has? I'm not terribly confident in this "guaranteed to go to 800mhz" at all. IMO, it would be better to just sell custom paintjobs rather than ropey overclocking ability.
I did the same thing. I paid an extra £10 for one that was tested to work at a higher clock rate. No idea how those tests work in practice but mines goes to 266MHz with no problems, except it eat batteries.
Can I just say that the GP2X I bought from GBAX, which I paid extra for the ability to overclock to 270mhz (iirc) becomes unstable at 240mhz and shuts down at just above 250mhz - and always has? I'm not terribly confident in this "guaranteed to go to 800mhz" at all. IMO, it would be better to just sell custom paintjobs rather than ropey overclocking ability.
I'm pretty certain the GBAX 2X's were only advertised as 240Mhz, a 40Mhz overclock.
I got one of those units but it would only clock to something like 210Mhz. Craig did offer to exchange it, but I didn't wanna send it back and spend time without it
Can I just say that the GP2X I bought from GBAX, which I paid extra for the ability to overclock to 270mhz (iirc) becomes unstable at 240mhz and shuts down at just above 250mhz - and always has? I'm not terribly confident in this "guaranteed to go to 800mhz" at all. IMO, it would be better to just sell custom paintjobs rather than ropey overclocking ability.
Yeah, hence the (iirc) in my post. Happy to be corrected - it was a long time ago, and I certainly didn't hold any grudge when my GBA games moved at a crawl
FWIW, I support Craig's idea. Anything that helps get OPT back on an even keel financially is all to the good - if there's only 4 or 8 thousand of these things out there before they decide it's too expensive to continue, then the community will suffer (as if we're not suffering enough as it is). The more the merrier, imo.
I'm not usually that bothered about custom designs, but I think I might consider paying extra for a second unit later in the year if it has a design I like. On the other hand, I recall all too vividly the GP2X's problem where the only way to get some emulators to run smoothly was to overclock even when it was logically not necessary, and the lockout that some owners experienced due to their machines not being able to overclock far enough. That needs to be avoided as much as necessary with our new console, so 600mhz being the clock speed to aim at will be more beneficial than dividing the community into basic owners and "elite" owners.
So yes to Craig's artwork idea, but no to the guaranteed 800mhz OC option. But then, it's not my decision to make, is it?
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
