Which distro

Discussion in 'Pyra OS (Debian GNU/Linux)' started by aTc, Feb 6, 2014.

  1. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    When i tried Sabayon, i tried not to pick out my eyes with a fondue fork, when i saw their software management system.


    Sabayon is based on Gentoo, but almost nothing is left from Gentoo in there.


    And its really damn buggy. Very much.


    Sabayon doesnt even properly support Portage. They burried it inside the system and forgot bout it

    Ok. You are talking about hardware optimizations, and assume that Pyra team will have time to recompile the entire Debian repo for Pyra.


    Ok, we got one version of hardware (which will be wrong as soon as ED releases different CPU cards).


    Yet, there are 2 more optimizations: USE flags, and just pure ricing flags.


    Some people would prefer to safe memory, battery and etc by removing unneeded features.


    Some people, would prefer to go ricing, and explore "what else they can add to CFLAGS".


    1 night, is for my "i forgot how much" years old PDA, and for the entire desktop environment.


    On a Pyra, the entire DE, from "clean stage3" would be much less. Maybe 1-2 hour. How much does it take on Debian? Much i guess.


    And for a simple emulator, it would be just a matter of few minutes. (Or less)


    Also, i stated that because the XFCE(Or whatever ED plans), FireFox and some other software will be already there, beats the need for all what i mentioned above.


    You will barely notice the difference in speed. After all, we have a serious experience of compiling software from the source.

    Who let the dogs #archlinux out?


    I tried to learn "how", but i failed.


    Gentoo is also light. And no one can argue bout the speed. How small can you Arch get?


    Ok, ArchWiki wins at the points of "Change color of that exact pixel in KDE".


    Arch didnt even let me get past the installation. Me! A experienced Gentoo user!


    Doesnt that defeats you so loved "K.I.S.S"? I am not saying to put plain CLI Gentoo there either, i even want it to be distributed with pre-installed emulators for unexperienced users, and i also want (and will anyway install) pure Gentoo there after getting mine. (With LXDE and hookers)
     
  2. bzar

    bzar A Commando

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    As an arch user, all things considered, I think debian is the way to go. The base system should assume as little as possible about the user regarding skill level and be hard to break with incompetence. Still, the system should allow advanced users do what they please. I think debian strikes a nice balance here. We'll want the base system to be stable to lighten the support load as well.

    EDIT: ZetaNeta, please provide actual benchmarks showing this miraculous gentoo compile speed when compared to another distro with the same software (kernel and compiler version as most important ones)
     
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  3. N3Cr0

    N3Cr0 Member

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    That's the wrong sight on those things. A real Debian user will never compile his whole DE since everything is precompiled. So a simple apt-get install will manage all: resolve dependencies, download all packages and install them. The download will take the most time.

     
    The Problem is that Arch is known for changing basic elements deep inside the system from time to time. That can cause inconsistencies after updating.

    I can't say it's out of question, but to keep this system rock stable we would run into the same problem as with Pandora's °Angström: We would need our own repository which needs to be maintained by someone because we cannot rely on the official source.
     
  4. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    Cant see why Gentoo cant go there. I find it quite friendly.


    If you will to set up the testing enviroment. I got another server to setup right now.
     
  5. Caine

    Caine Hardcore Member

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    I would not like the default OS to be one where you need to compile stuff to install it.

    My fear is that the majority of potential customers will (rightfully) argue that that is poor usability.

    I think that Debian makes the most sense here. It is the root of the majority of the distros these days.

    There are some major benefits in not being the odd-man-out.
     
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  6. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    How much a download will take?


    And again, the installation is not a serious matter for unexperienced users, as most software will come preinstalled. Adding a bunch of emulators is a matter of few minutes.


    Ok, i get it now. You are all about stability? Well, it seems like only Debian/Funtoo can suit you in it.


    There is a difference between "Acceptable stability" and "Lock down all the updates", and a difference between a Embedded system, or a "zero-maintenance-required" server, and a personal workstation, or any other interactive device.
     
  7. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    I agree that Debian maybe better by default.


    But i am really against any situation where a "different" distro would require serious and same time pointless porting efforts (afaik what happened with Slackware on Pandora)
     
  8. Linux-SWAT

    Linux-SWAT Hardcore Member

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    Can you elaborate ?
     
  9. TrashyMG

    TrashyMG Sarcasm Dispenser Staff Member

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    Any distro would require a bit of effort to get working on a custom handheld like the Pandora or Pyra.. Linux-Swat did all the effort on Slackware, On the user end Slackware just requires extracting the image on an SD card.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 9, 2014
  10. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    Yeah, but why?


    If its a set of userspace tools to manage some Pyra-specific devices, why not to release as a universal tarball?


    If its a custom kernel, why not to release it as a patch set?


    If its config customizations (like new udev rules), why not to release them too?


    All i do on AW, is just installing the right U-BOOT, and the distro needs zero porting effort, except being a ARM distro.
     
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  11. TrashyMG

    TrashyMG Sarcasm Dispenser Staff Member

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    Who said it wouldn't.. I just mentioned it will be a bit of work to initially get the work done. Just don't expect to drop in any ARM Distro and expect everything to work..
     
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  12. Linux-SWAT

    Linux-SWAT Hardcore Member

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    I can confirm it's indeed a bit more complicated than that.

    But i have to say i targeted the best possible quality so the amount of work was proportional.

    You may say the same thing about the Open Pandora: grab a pcb, solder components on it, put a screen, et voilà the super device.

    Unfortunately, that's not how projects goes.
     
  13. Ziz

    Ziz Advanced Member

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    Sounds like Craig thought about the pandora project. *hide and run*
     
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  14. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    Well, i expect to drop in any ARM distro, configure uboot, install tools, maybe change a kernel, "and here i go".


    Thats the amount of work which i find suitable.


    As long as the amount of work required can be done by software management (except for u-boot maybe), i find it ok.

    Can you explain?
     
  15. slaeshjag

    slaeshjag ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    Distros usually don't have any installers on ARM. That tends to complicate the process.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 11, 2014
  16. Linux-SWAT

    Linux-SWAT Hardcore Member

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    Well, try to port a distro to Pandora.

    You can also check my build system on the wiki.
     
  17. ZetaNeta

    ZetaNeta Still Fresh

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    "I, as a official Gentoo user, officially declare that i dont give a sh*t."


    Right now, i am comparing it to other ARMs.

    I dont have a pandora.


    Gonna give it a look.
     
  18. TDT

    TDT Member

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    I gotta admit, porting things is incredibly difficult...and even porting over a somewhat 'simple' program is causing a lot of headaches for me at the moment.  I also agree with others regarding Arch.  I *love* arch linux, but yes, they do  have times of breaking random stuff.
     
  19. asdfffdsa

    asdfffdsa Still Fresh

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    I use Arch on my desktop PC and I like it, but I don't really want it on a portable PC.  If you don't stay up to date with the bleeding edge, you will undoubtedly have many problems with Arch.  Stuff breaks all of the time and a lot of the maintenance is left to the user (and this seems to be getting worse over the years).  I also dislike the fact that its package management system doesn't support partial updates (you want to reliably update something?  Have to update everything.  No clue if Debian is the same)
     
  20. Granitehead

    Granitehead Advanced Member

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    Usually you update everything at once in Debian. I don't doubt there is a way to update only a package and it's dependencies (and the dependencies' dependencies, etc.), but that means it will probably update most of the system anyway in quite a lot of cases. Don't know how you could do that in any other way unless you started having multiple versions of the same dependency and I don't know why one would want this.
     

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