What Do You See?

pengo

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What do you see when you close your eyes to imagine an apple?

Take a moment to try to picture an apple in your mind.

(Please do not scroll down until you attempt to visualize an apple in your mind)





























































































































































What number are you?


I'm not sure which number I am. I range 1-5 depending on amount of concentration.

The original topic was found here.
 

pengo

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Hmm, a bit difficult it seems. Is there any kind of picture at all?

Just curious if you have you ever tried drawing freehand from thought, or do you usually use a picture or a reference object?
 

Elw3

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Well i cant draw either.
I think its all a matter of training tho, force your brain to do it long enough and youll eventually learn to see pictures in your head without that much effort/concentration.
In my everyday routine i have no need for picturing something so this ability is lost.
I also ended up getting faceblind. I solely identifie a person based on clothes/accesories and context. So if you change your jacket im like "where has he gone?".
And context goes like: i can meet a neighbour in my neighbourhood. so if i am not in my neighbourhood i cannot meet any neighbours. So if a person doesnt belong to a place i am unable to identifie it.
I think thats a brains way of saving cpu cycles, i always wondered how ppl can walk around and spend so much concentration on tasks like face recognation.
 

ClockworkCoder

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I could only see penguins. ;)

Actually, it was red at the top, green at the bottom, and bruised somewhere on the top-right, with a worm inside.

I like the experiment when drawing a bicycle from memory. Memory of something and reality are often completely different.
 

Autian

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The upper left corner of 1 but without the leaf on my first try. Maybe I did not wait long enough for the rendering to finish. The drawing area gets smaller if higher detail is used.
On paper I can't draw complex forms like faces, trees, grass, etc. but I am pretty good at drawing 3D objects using lines and applying shades or volumentric effects like milk glass using a pencil or a ballpoint pen (yes, you can do gradients with them).

I am a lurker (actually I want to post more often but I often feel like my posts are not going to express my thoughts good enough) but I still wanted to leave this here. :D
 

ClockworkCoder

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actually I want to post more often but I often feel like my posts are not going to express my thoughts good enough
Unfortunately I have almost the opposite experience: I feel like I've expressed myself reasonably well, then when I re-read my post in context, immediately regret my poorly expressed opinion. Or worse, don't re-read it and just see the trainwreck following my inept and/or tactless post.

In other words, don't worry about it, there's always others who will put their foot in it more than you! ;)
 

FBnil

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mine was green, not like granny smith, but more like a green pear; rugged and not shiny. No leaf(s) either. Realisticly depicted. But my though briefly envisioned the white apple logo... just for a second, before settling for something better.

tasks like face recognation
At work I usually keep typing and watching the screen when people talk to me, which sounds rude, but I'm just running a thought process I do not want to interrupt and spawn a new process to talk to a person. This is only for short chitchat, for things that I need more brainpower I stop my work activity and face the person. But now that you mention that it takes CPU cycles to read a face, yeah that feels exactly why I avoid the face. But just being behind a computer takes cycles away, even if I am not doing anything. So to think about an algorithm, I need to move away, walk, bike, or have pen and paper... that allows for more CPU cycles for thought.

As for the imperfect rendering, I have something similar to gauge distance, because I have one lazy eye I can not rely on depth (no natural eye focus), so I need to 'calculate' it. And I map wireframes over the landscape to do that. On the plus side is that this wireframe, when in a building, has all the exit points, which makes me feel save. Drawback is that I want to know what's behind closed doors, or I have to ignore that part in my head (like in a 3D game with halls that are blocked).

A friend has colour blindness and he also has this mental struggle to identify the colour based on best-guess. So if the brown looks like something he knows is red, then his guess is red. He does get it right more often than not, so his heuristic method works.

The supermarket near my house remodeled. And everything is in different places. I am still learning where everything is, but it is hard, because I overlap the old layout in my mind. I went to a new supermarket 3 times, and I remember where things are... but not my nearest supermarket. Strange, that.


@pengo : I got a Pengo, I got an Apple...
 

pengo

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I really appreciate your replies everyone. Every post has been interesting.

Reading the different experiences on the web I see that there are people from the older age group (close to age 70-above) affected but even more intriguing most of posts are from the younger age group (around 20 and below) who claim to have aphantasia or not being able to visualize imagery.

I thought aphantasia might be a rare disorder but surprisingly there are a lot of young people who cannot be able to see any form of image when they attempt to imagine it.

Hmm, could it be the 24/7 connectivity to visuals via internet exposure or likewise?

Makes one wonder if using a pic captureless device like Pyra (or maybe something simple like Gameboy) can improve this condition? :p
 

levi

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Hmm, could it be the 24/7 connectivity to visuals via internet exposure or likewise?

Makes one wonder if using a pic captureless device like Pyra (or maybe something simple like Gameboy) can improve this condition? :p
I've been exposed to pictures from the internet before the web was a thing, when I was about 16 or so. I copied them to my computer using a floppy disk. But I was still able to imagine an apple when I was requested to do so.

I'm not sure a Pyra will help. That'll still be able to display photos from t'internet if that's what you posit the problem is. Or perhaps you mean the problem is more due to a decent camera attached to a way to quickly view photos, so people spend less time imagining something they saw when describing it to someone else, they're more likely to pull out their phone and show them the picture they took. I find it hard to believe that (a) everything the need to talk about fits in a phone picture well and (b) they actually took a picture of it, but maybe that's my imagination at fault this time.
 

pengo

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I'm not entirely sure if this could be part of the reason why there is large number of young people with aphantasia becuase it could be many other things too including the habit of easy netsurfing. Anything's possible, so my imagination is as faulty as yours.:)
 

FBnil

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I remember at school we had to draw different "A" letters. So Of course, because I knew fontasy, pagemaker and Chiwriter and knew the first wingdings and such, I could get over 60 letters (some really wild), while other could only get like 20 or so. Which I thought weird and lacking.
This was pre-internet.

A part about "imagening" is in Harry Potter - Methods of Rationality, where during defense class he tries to invent clever uses of objects in the classroom. It's an interesting read if you are a HP fan.
The link is of that particular chapter, but to really enjoy it, you would need to start from chapter 1, and bite a bit through it as it starts slowly.


On the subject of dreams, they all look so realistic to me. I learned to pinch myself from time to time, so when I pinch myself in my sleep, and it doesnt hurt, I know its a dream.
Another way for me to detect I am in a dream is that a page, when looked at twice, will always have a small difference, sometimes even different wording. That's how I know.
What I mean so say: If you are a 1, dreams are fun (or very scary).



@pengo : I got a Pengo, I got an Apple...
Uhn! Apple-Pengo.

ps: From the 1-5, I miss a wireframe apple, and the apple logo... and an apple drawn XKCD style. (or red in color)
 
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Djoga'Ro

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A part about "imagening" is in Harry Potter - Methods of Rationality, where during defense class he tries to invent clever uses of objects in the classroom. It's an interesting read if you are a HP fan.
Interesting read in any case, I'd say. :)

On the subject of dreams, they all look so realistic to me. I learned to pinch myself from time to time, so when I pinch myself in my sleep, and it doesnt hurt, I know its a dream.
Another way for me to detect I am in a dream is that a page, when looked at twice, will always have a small difference, sometimes even different wording. That's how I know.
I rarely wake during dreams. Interesting, what you say about pages. In the TV show Evil, the lead woman being a psychologist plagued by nightmares uses a written note at the ceiling over her bed to recogniye being in a dream, since "one cannot comprehend written text in dreams". So, you'd say, that's wrong?
 
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