Vektar Downloadable Version

[TrickyPhillips]

Indeed. A crack would generate a pretty negative response among the community, for sure.

 

[Nighty]

If you pay for the game, you should be able to run it on multiple SD cards and GP2x's that you own - this is only right (and deters piracy).

:blink:

How does that deter piracy? Surely the point is to stop people copying it to multiple SD cards and GP2Xs.

By not creating an incentive for regular folk who happen to have multiple gp2x's to try and crack the game just so they can play it on more than one of them.

Some people will always want to use an illegal copy because they don't want to pay for it; nothing you can do against that. Luckily for the makers of Vektar, our user base is pretty small and loyal, so demand for illegal copies will be small at best. Given that, it's in their best interest not to irk the small userbase they do have by imposing stupid restrictions on the use of the game; quite a few of us have multiple units, and rightfully expect to be able to play a game they paid for on every one of their units. If you start punishing the small loyal user base for generating more revenue for the makers of the platform you deploy on, that's when you'll start seeing negative backlash resulting in piracy and loss of sales.

 

[Parkydr]

I agree, but how do you have a system that knows, when you make copies that you are using it on another card/GP2X that you own rather making a copy for someone else?

 

[baalim]

I agree, but how do you have a system that knows, when you make copies that you are using it on another card/GP2X that you own rather making a copy for someone else?

it may be a stupid idea but what about generating a key based on our own gp2x unit number when buying a game.
the game could check the system informations and start as soon as the gp2x unit is identified as the buyer's.

 

[Nighty]

I agree, but how do you have a system that knows, when you make copies that you are using it on another card/GP2X that you own rather making a copy for someone else?

The community is small and loyal enough for this not to be a problem. Heck, if people can make a living giving music and books away for free on the Net, why do we need copy restrictions on games for a small, relatively obscure handheld platform?

Sure, I know, general consensus is that if you don't try to restrict people's abilities to copy your work, you'll lose a lot of sales to people who want to benefit from your work without paying for it. OK... The guy giving this speech did the experiment; he gives his novels and short stories away for free on his site in electronic form; you can do whatever you want with them: pass them on, print them out, put them on your site for further distribution, anything... You want the paper book, you'll have to pay though. Which, given the fact that it costs money to print an actual physical book, makes perfect sense. Guess what? He sells MORE because of it, not less. For another example of a business thriving by *not* treating their customers like criminals, see Baen Books.

Other than that, what has copy protection ever acomplished? Is there any copy protection scheme in the world that hasn't been cracked yet? Heck, even the toughest copy protection scheme to date (starforce) can be circumvented. The use of copy protection sometimes even has detrimental effects on the system it's installed on; anyone remember the Sony rootkit fiasco? Starforce breaking lots of other applications they deem "dangerous" (and being incompatible with ZoneAlarm, a tool many people around the world use for protecting their computer systems).

As a general rule of thumb, I try to avoid copy protection crap whenever I can. Unfortunately, I can only avoid it by using free and open source software and by carefully choosing which CDs to buy; when it comes to games or DVDs there is no alternative... Vektar doesn't impress me enough for me to pay more than say $10 for it, and it certainly doesn't impress me enough to accept copy protection schemes that limit the way I can use the game I purchased. What if my gp2x breaks, and I need to buy a new one? Will my game suddenly stop working? Or maybe it's tied to the SD card instead of the gp2x, in which case the same logic applies: what if the card breaks?

it may be a stupid idea but what about generating a key based on our own gp2x unit number when buying a game.
the game could check the system informations and start as soon as the gp2x unit is identified as the buyer's.

I know forums are places where people can write stuff, but doesn't anyone bother to read before they hit the reply button? We're not talking about how to tie a game to one particular unit; we're talking about how to allow people with multiple units to use the same copy of the game on each and every unit they own.

Anyway, best approach would be to just use serial keys like most other software uses (if you want to include copy protection in the first place; for a good reason not to, see my reply to the above poster). Yes, they can be cracked, but then again, every copy protection scheme can and will be cracked, so what's the problem anyway?

Edit: Oh, and it's not a stupid idea, btw. I don't know if it's possible with the gp2x; I don't know if every gp2x has a hardcoded unique identifier in its hardware (though I can't imagine it doesn't), but it's been done like that on other platforms, mainly PDAs.

 

[Epicenter]

How does that deter piracy? Surely the point is to stop people copying it to multiple SD cards and GP2Xs.

Anyway, all DRM is crap! The only reason a cracked version is unlikely to turn up is the small user base of the GP2X.

It deters piracy because I can't imagine anyone who'd really want to buy it in such miserable packaging on a bog-standard SD card, and the only difference between just downloading it and putting it on their OWN card is that they are restricted and not allowed to do it-- even though the card that came out of the 'box' ( :lol: ) is just something you could buy on eBay for a pittance.

As for no need for DRM-- according to Craig there's quite the pirate scene, replete with BT trackers, over in Spain. Spain and Portugal have to be the crack centers of the world, and apparently there was a lot of GP32 commercial program piracy.

it may be a stupid idea but what about generating a key based on our own gp2x unit number when buying a game.
the game could check the system informations and start as soon as the gp2x unit is identified as the buyer's.

You can fake this information easily.

 

[Executer]

I dont like this DRM shit.
It is just against what i want. I pay for it but no guaranty i can play it in some years. What happens if i want to play it in 5 years but my card has become defective? Or my Gp2x when the DRM checks the Gp2x-ID.
I think DRM is just a Time-Licence..

What do i have to tell my childs in 15 years about this?
There was a great handheld u could play so many old games with... here see.. but the games specially written for it i cant show u because the DRM.

This is a bit strange because the Gp2x Community is about RETRO gaming. But how should the Gp2x games with DRM be played in some years?

I think in digtal history our time will become a big black hole...
So many crap.. some gems.. but will have no chance to see either the crap or the gems.

Do u have any plans to make it public domain in some years so your work wont be lost in a decade or more?

 

[craigix]

I dont like this DRM shit.
It is just against what i want. I pay for it but no guaranty i can play it in some years. What happens if i want to play it in 5 years but my card has become defective? Or my Gp2x when the DRM checks the Gp2x-ID.
I think DRM is just a Time-Licence..

What do i have to tell my childs in 15 years about this?
There was a great handheld u could play so many old games with... here see.. but the games specially written for it i cant show u because the DRM.

This is a bit strange because the Gp2x Community is about RETRO gaming. But how should the Gp2x games with DRM be played in some years?

I think in digtal history our time will become a big black hole...
So many crap.. some gems.. but will have no chance to see either the crap or the gems.

Do u have any plans to make it public domain in some years so your work wont be lost in a decade or more?

There is a simple solution to this, and it is called buying the boxed version.

 

[Epicenter]

You misunderstood him. He is saying that purchasing it on a card screws you if it's tied to the card's unique ID to operate, and same goes for the GP2X if it won't run on any other '2x unit. (Even though it's been said time and time again, it's very easy to change or fake your system's ID#.) Buying the game won't do anything to remove the problems posed by DRM.

 

[Alex.]

I entirely agree that DRM treats customers like criminals. Whether you buy the wrapped version or the e-version, you're still unable to make a backup, and that takes away from your freedom, and makes light of your investment.

It's not like mainstream publishers will ever produce anything for the GP2X, so why not lift the chains off the few commercial games available, chains which were laid by mainstream publishers to begin with?

- Alex

 

[bacteria]

Personally, I like Vektar but will only consider buying it if: 1) price becomes £10 or less (downloadable full version, I don't need a box; nor do I need to pay lots for a game), 2) I can play it on any SD card(s) I choose to and on both of my GP2x's (and next one if I replace one in the future). I am not paying for a game which is card or unit specific - if I pay for a game, I expect to be able to play it unconditionally.

 

[shinneri]

The bigtime publishers give you their games on a disc/cart/card, and, if you break that sometime, you're screwed. I don't see why it should be any different for boxed GP2X commercial games...

And it's just simply impossible to distribute digital copies without locking it in some way.

 

[DaveC]

I bought Vektar on the SD. I like being able to use it on any GP2X I want. Registering is a pain.

I think we bitch too much though.

We get a game on SD, we bitch because it is not download.

There will be a DL version, and we bitch because it has protection.

We are lucky to have any game really. As long as there is the choice between the 2 methods we shouldn't bitch too much.

 

[Epicenter]

There's no good REASON to buy it, though. If you could download a GBA game and run it on your system immediately with no restrictions, or you could pay more money to have it thrown into a padded envelope with the game's name crudely scribbled on the outside with marker, and reach you months after you order it, and it was loaded with DRM restrictions, would you feel like you got a better deal by buying it?

 

[shrubberyrobbery]

personally, I agree that DRM is a f*ing nightmare in many ways.

but... I don't see the problem here: you can buy a physical version in a box. You don't HAVE to download it. and, just like any other console game, if you break it, then that's it: bust! if you're THAT paranoid about breaking a physical copy then get two copies!

So, I think the guys are being as flexible as possible, providing a boxed and (soon?) a downloadable version, so actually I applaud their efforts. Can you imagine a mainstream publisher doing this?

The only extra thing with the DRM'd download version, is that maybe it should come with, say, 10 unlock codes instead of just one. To allow it to be transferred around a bit, but without allowing it to be 'pirated' en mass.

The problem for me, is the price. I find it difficult to accept paying more for Vectar than I did for Psyvariar which is an absolutely amazing PS2 shmup for only £10 (about $18). (actually going for £7.47 new on amazon), but then thats a choice for each person.

I can see why the price is as it is, but its difficult because the potential market is tiny, yet at the same time it is sort of going to be compared to the mass-markets of the big boys, in terms of price/quality expected etc.

edit: I still might buy it. haven't decided yet