Vektar Boxed Version


Dzz

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scorpio posted on May 1 2006 at 12:24 PM said:
PS. I realise this post may read as being a bit narky, and perhaps it is, but not as much as it looks like. It's just I've been waiting ages for the final release of Vektar and this is somehow a little bit of an anti-climax.
I have promised you guys a 1.0 of the "free" version of Vektar that has the configurable controls and a couple minor bug fixes and I will provide that (soon!); beyond that I will not be adding more content to Vektar -- Craig has taken over the code and creative direction. I'm sure he will do great things with the commercial release!
 
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scorpio

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GP2x = GP32 posted on May 1 2006 at 10:11 PM said:
Even with DRM pirated GP32 games vwere still made. Thats how bad it is. The SD would work in both your gp2x's. Also you could get a download version and ask if you cna somehow have it DRM encrypted for both your 2x's.
Well there's the thing. It's a waste of resources implementing copy protection, as a cracked version will only appear on usenet, and it does nothing to deter the pirates who make a profit from selling copies.

If I buy a copy-protected game I'm implicitly accepting the seller's accusation that I want to pirate it. Then, the sellers try to wrap themselves up in so many layers of EULAs that not only are they taking your money for insulting you, but they are trying to escape any conceivable responsibility for selling you the thing in the first place!

Dzz posted on May 1 2006 at 10:13 PM said:
I have promised you guys a 1.0 of the "free" version of Vektar that has the configurable controls and a couple minor bug fixes and I will provide that (soon!); beyond that I will not be adding more content to Vektar -- Craig has taken over the code and creative direction. I'm sure he will do great things with the commercial release!
I know, and I appreciate that. It would take a lot to mess up the commercial version, given that you've provided such a fantastic base to work from. It's just that from my point of view I would have preferred to be sending you 15-20 euro via PayPal or whatever for all the hard work you put into it, and not have to deal with copy-protection (as it is looking like).

All that said, however, I respect your decision to hand it over to a commercial entity, and I know it was always your code to with as you wish.

Anyway, we'll see how it turns out.
 
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G

GP2x = GP32

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Craig wont wrap stuff up in Eulas hes cool. Just calm down.
 

Sonistar

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If you respect the community or the hard work being done by craigx and gp in general then buy the commercial game and ignore any pirate copies.

Seriously if a pirate copy gets made or the game gets hacked this is going to damage gp2x's chances of more commercial games and frighten away any developers.

I HOPE that any pirate copies gets shunned by this lovely community and we keep on supporting the gp scene.

(i know that some people WILL download the pirate version. but FYI, this is a small company, not a huge orginisation like SONY, who it wouldnt matter much if you pirated some games, this will hurt the gp2x's chances of more commercial games)
 

scorpio

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GP2x = GP32 posted on May 1 2006 at 10:41 PM said:
Craig wont wrap stuff up in Eulas hes cool. Just calm down.
Don't worry, I wasn't targeting him, I was just railing against "The Man" in general. It's something that anooys me.
 
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scorpio

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Sonistar posted on May 1 2006 at 10:57 PM said:
If you respect the community or the hard work being done by craigx and gp in general then buy the commercial game and ignore any pirate copies.

I agree 100%, and I really hope that my comments don't get misconstrued as being supportive of distributing copies of the game. A community will live or die on how the members support each other, and I would include distributors as part of that community. My point is that human nature being what it is, there will be copies made, whether we want it to happen or not.

The problem with copy protection is that a lot people will feel its prescence as a challenge to remove it, and the easiest way to prove it's been cracked is to distribute a copy. As a legitimate owner of software, there have been numerous times that copy-protection has made it inconvenient for me to use the software (there are still times I regret buying Rebirth, since my laptop doesn't have a CD-ROM.)

If there is no copy-protection, then the system works solely on trust, and anybody distributing a copy has no reason to do so other than to reduce another person's income - That's it, no excuses or justifications. Obviously, the morally immature or corrupt will feel no shame, but that's no reason to penalise the rest of us.

It always reminds me of being in school and when someone did something really stupid, the whole class got punished, and this was in some way a "lesson".

Now, back to the snooker to calm down!
 
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GP2x = GP32

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scorpio posted on May 1 2006 at 11:24 PM said:
Sonistar posted on May 1 2006 at 10:57 PM said:
If you respect the community or the hard work being done by craigx and gp in general then buy the commercial game and ignore any pirate copies.

I agree 100%, and I really hope that my comments don't get misconstrued as being supportive of distributing copies of the game. A community will live or die on how the members support each other, and I would include distributors as part of that community. My point is that human nature being what it is, there will be copies made, whether we want it to happen or not.

The problem with copy protection is that a lot people will feel its prescence as a challenge to remove it, and the easiest way to prove it's been cracked is to distribute a copy. As a legitimate owner of software, there have been numerous times that copy-protection has made it inconvenient for me to use the software (there are still times I regret buying Rebirth, since my laptop doesn't have a CD-ROM.)

If there is no copy-protection, then the system works solely on trust, and anybody distributing a copy has no reason to do so other than to reduce another person's income - That's it, no excuses or justifications. Obviously, the morally immature or corrupt will feel no shame, but that's no reason to penalise the rest of us.

It always reminds me of being in school and when someone did something really stupid, the whole class got punished, and this was in some way a "lesson".

Now, back to the snooker to calm down!
Well the files can be copied they just wont play on anything with the incorrect serial to play it.
 
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Deed

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Sonistar posted on May 1 2006 at 10:53 PM said:
Deed posted on May 1 2006 at 09:32 PM said:
Sonistar posted on May 1 2006 at 10:28 PM said:
and sometimes the shield doesnt push away the enemies, they just stick to it until the shield runs out. - happened twice out of 200 times playing it.
A shield ? What shield ? :huh:


hold in "y", it tells you at the start of the game dude
I'm blind, or stupid, or both of them :huh:
It should be more easy to beat the boss now ;) Although I think it will not be so easy to stop to hit the "B" button (that's probably why i didn't notice the shield, i just can't stop myself to shoot those nasty polygons :p )
 
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Deed

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scorpio posted on May 2 2006 at 12:24 AM said:
Sonistar posted on May 1 2006 at 10:57 PM said:
If you respect the community or the hard work being done by craigx and gp in general then buy the commercial game and ignore any pirate copies.

I agree 100%, and I really hope that my comments don't get misconstrued as being supportive of distributing copies of the game. A community will live or die on how the members support each other, and I would include distributors as part of that community. My point is that human nature being what it is, there will be copies made, whether we want it to happen or not.

The problem with copy protection is that a lot people will feel its prescence as a challenge to remove it, and the easiest way to prove it's been cracked is to distribute a copy. As a legitimate owner of software, there have been numerous times that copy-protection has made it inconvenient for me to use the software (there are still times I regret buying Rebirth, since my laptop doesn't have a CD-ROM.)

If there is no copy-protection, then the system works solely on trust, and anybody distributing a copy has no reason to do so other than to reduce another person's income - That's it, no excuses or justifications. Obviously, the morally immature or corrupt will feel no shame, but that's no reason to penalise the rest of us.

It always reminds me of being in school and when someone did something really stupid, the whole class got punished, and this was in some way a "lesson".

Now, back to the snooker to calm down!

You're so true scorpio. I also think that the best way to avoid cracked copies is to not put any protection, so there is
1) no challenge for crackers
2) no reasons for users to get a cracked copy instead of buying an original one (edit : apart from save money/steal somebody of course)

No kidding here. This is exactly the same for CDs : if I buy a CD, and if it is copy protected, I find it easier to get the copy from Emule or whatever to put it into my mp3 player, instead of trying to deal with the copy protection !
 
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rokdcasbah

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i've seen it mentioned a few times that drm provides "bait" for crackers. i disagree completely that crackers are doing anything creative...just cause they put their name on it doesn't mean they deserve any respect, and saying that software gets cracked because it's "challenging" is giving these guys entirely too much credit. most drm is easy to crack. and how many people do you think are downloading cracks just to see if they work, saying, oh that's clever, and then deleting the stolen software?

just venting. drm software (rootkits aside) does more to stop lazy theives (of which there are many) than luring career crackers (who really should just move out of their parents basement and get a job).
 

Alpha2

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DRM might make something a tasty target for hacking but the amount of piracy that would take place without it would make the amount that occurs regularly seem like a drop in the bucket.
 

Deed

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rokdcasbah posted on May 2 2006 at 02:34 AM said:
just venting. drm software (rootkits aside) does more to stop lazy theives (of which there are many) than luring career crackers (who really should just move out of their parents basement and get a job).
The problem in your reasoning (and the reasoning of too many other people) is the following : you assume that if a software is too difficult to get cracked, "lazy thieves" will get away. Fine. But does this implies that these "lazy thieves" will actually BUY the soft they can't get cracked ? Of course not, at least in 99,99% of the cases. So are DRM useful ? Yes, in 0,01% of the cases. So is it really worth the pain to use DRM to protect software ? I don't think so.

This said, there is always particular cases where DRM could be useful, for example for professional market (as professionals who get a cracked copy of something would have buy the original copy anyway, contrary to particulars)
 
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bacteria

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Vektar is a great game, without doubt. Question is what "extras" have been built in to the game to warrant buying it (when it was a free download, and already excellent)?

It would be useful if a list was posted with all the enhancements against the free version, to perswade people to buy it (free, vs £19.99).

If people are going to pirate the game, they will anyway. As always, if the price is cheap, there is little reason to pirate anything. The reaction to many posts on the Forum, when someone has made something (breakout box, D-pad, joystick cap, etc) is "oh, give me the layout/diagram so I can copy your idea and make it myself". If the game is sold as a no-frills version, people will buy, if not people will say "oh, give me the link so I can download the game for free" (same logic).

By my guesswork, out of £19.99, about £8 will be the cost of a 128Mb SD card, probably £2-£3 for the box, instructions, etc.

Craigx - How about copying a unique serial code into the program itself (unique) and e-mailing the game (£8.99 for no-frills, no postage required version) with game instructions to people who buy it from you. If anyone then distributed your game, you would know who did it (by the embedded code) and act accordingly (with proof of who distributed the game). This would maintain your profits, and give us a cheaper game = more sales for you = more profit (and less pirating as £8.99 as opposed to £19.99).
 

FluffyPanda

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I don't personally believe that copy protection / drm does anything to restrict piracy. Actually the only people it tends to hurt are the legitimate consumers and in this way drives people to piracy.

I've bought CDs and games in the past where the copy protection has been so restrictive that it's made my purchased product unusable. The solution every time has been to turn to bittorrent and get a much more convenient pirated copy. I haven't returned any of these for a refund, though I probably should have just to prove a point.

DRM hurts legitimate users but is merely a minor nuisance to the earliest of early-adopter pirates. Plus, as people have already pointed out, most piracy is not carried out by people who would go and buy the game if it were not available illegally for free.

I'm really not sure if I want to buy any commercial game for my gp2x if each one will require me to carry another SD card around with me, so that's one sale already lost to DRM. With the low numbers of games likely to be sold for the 2x I wonder if DRM will cause more or less copies to be sold? I'm willing to bet it will be less.
 

Redeeman

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DRM is worthless, it neither stops lazy theives, non-lazy theives, or crackers.

it only services to further annoy the legitimate customers. and i believe also, in many cases it hurts the creators.

lets take common PC games. i know first hand that alot of people REALLY REALLY hate games that wants their cd's to be in, for some games its not because they want to check that you have it, but because theres stuff on it, but some games just want to know the cd is there, which is downright completely annoying, and for me, enough to simply not get the game. but i know that MANY hear of this, and simply download the game instead, since then a cracked version is bundled, instead of buying the game, cause then they get to deal with crap, its simply EASIER for them to steal the game, isntead of buying, even though they may have been perfectly willing to pay what the game costs.

and the "drm stops lazy-theives" argument doesent hold any bit, the lazy thieves go to their local pirate, and trust me, there are a local pirate anywhere. be it games, music, console games or anything, they simply place an order, and pays $2, which includes a cd/dvd, and the fee the pirate takes. this is no different with lazy gp2x-commercial-games thieves.


basically, i cant see what good DRM can do, without doing the bad things, which makes the legitimate customers go away.

for example, i couldnt care if there was DRM, if it didnt stop me from doing what i want.. well.. lets see, what do i want..
1: be able to copy game to my computer
2: be able to copy game to other SD cards
3: be able to play games in many gp2x's (if i have two for example)
and at this point, if i can do this, what can DRM restrict me from doing? if all i mentioned was possible with the DRM system, i fail to see what it protects.

when i first heard that there would be a commercial vektar game i decided i wanted it, but if theres going to be DRM, preventing me from doing these 3 things, i just wont be getting this game.

apply DRM or not, those who want to steal will be able to anyway, you only serve to scare away legitimate customers
 

Vimacs

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vectarboxcopy1mm.png

:)
 
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