The worries of an early adoptor


Sheltem

Still Fresh
Joined
Oct 3, 2008
Messages
2
Hello there!

Yesterday I ordered one of Your fantastic devices. Now im asking myself if that was a good idea. How big is the chance, we´re seeing a pandora v2.0 in the second batch with better specs, so the early adoptors already have some "outdated" devices?

edit: embarrassing typo in topic title corrected. :)
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

It won't happen. There has been lots of talk (from the community, not the devs) about a hypothetical Pandora 2, but it's just not on the drawing board.

Stop worrying. :)

(Disclaimer: I'm just a punter, not a developer)
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

I'de say it is VERY low... too much money went into the R&D to scrap it and build a 2.0 right away... ie $30,000 just on the nubs
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

Sheltem said:
How big is the chance, we´re seeing a pandora v2.0 in the second batch with better specs, so the early adoptors already have some "outdated" devices?

As told by the devs, there is more or less 0% chance of that happening ;) You can breath freely
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

Sheltem said:
Hello there!

Yesterday I ordered one of Your fantastic devices. Now im asking myself if that was a good idea. How big is the chance, we´re seeing a pandora v2.0 in the second batch with better specs, so the early adoptors already have some "outdated" devices?

Craigx said many time that the second batch will be exactly the same as the first one.
He also said the there won't be a pandora with 256M of memory to not split the community.

Sure (at least I hope) there will be a pandora v2 but in 2 maybe 3 years. As the p&|a hardware will be very outdated compare to the other product around.
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

I've been following the Pandora's progress and I hardly believe any massive changes would be expected. Because of the costs involved, because of the community and also because of the fact that this very same community was asked what should be in the Pandora.

The handheld is already beyond anything on the market, why would you need a revision so early after release? Eventually? It would be expected. But I for sure doubt that an early revision would happen. One of the reasons being that I'm pretty sure the Pandora's potential will stay untapped for at least a year.

On the other side, I'd expect a handheld like "Wiz" to have an early revision. Just my 2 cents.
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

sebt3 said:
Sheltem said:
Sure (at least I hope) there will be a pandora v2 but in 2 maybe 3 years. As the p&|a hardware will be very outdated compare to the other product around.

I wouldn't go quite that far. The Gamepark handhelds are severly outdated after 2-3 years but that's mostly because they are outdated when they come out. Pandora is pretty top of the line at the moment so I think that it will take longer than that. The PSP wouldn't be considered very outdated yet even though it's been out for four plus years. If it weren't for Pandora, it'd still be the most powerful handheld gaming device. I'd be perfectly happy if they didn't put out a new version until 4-5 years from now. It should have a nice long run. :)
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

Frogboy said:
I wouldn't go quite that far. The Gamepark handhelds are severly outdated after 2-3 years but that's mostly because they are outdated when they come out.
Perhaps true for the GP2X, but the GP32 was the most advanced handheld around when it came out in 2001 and it held that position for a few years (at least until the Tapwave Zodiac came out in 2003, but even then it had some advantages).
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

WhyKlef said:
On the other side, I'd expect a handheld like "Wiz" to have an early revision. Just my 2 cents.

Very early. Before it even came out. :)

Yeah, they seem to have a habbit of putting out a new version every year. If you are looking to get one of theirs, you might as well buy it in October or November when the latest version comes out. I finally broke down and bought one when the MK2 came out and was disappointed that I didn't hold out for the F-200. It wasn't worth spending another $180 to buy basically the same thing though and I'm glad that I didn't. I would've bought the Wiz had Pandora not been developed even though I don't like the direction that they went with it. I was one of the few that liked the size of the GP2X because it was very comfortable to hold while playing and the screen was a decent size.
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

Esn said:
Frogboy said:
I wouldn't go quite that far. The Gamepark handhelds are severly outdated after 2-3 years but that's mostly because they are outdated when they come out.
Perhaps true for the GP2X, but the GP32 was the most advanced handheld around when it came out in 2001 and it held that position for a few years (at least until the Tapwave Zodiac came out in 2003, but even then it had some advantages).

That's probably true. Was there any other handhelds out at the time (that wasn't made by Nintendo)?
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

Frogboy said:
sebt3 said:
Sheltem said:
Sure (at least I hope) there will be a pandora v2 but in 2 maybe 3 years. As the p&|a hardware will be very outdated compare to the other product around.

I wouldn't go quite that far. The Gamepark handhelds are severly outdated after 2-3 years but that's mostly because they are outdated when they come out. Pandora is pretty top of the line at the moment so I think that it will take longer than that. The PSP wouldn't be considered very outdated yet even though it's been out for four plus years. If it weren't for Pandora, it'd still be the most powerful handheld gaming device. I'd be perfectly happy if they didn't put out a new version until 4-5 years from now. It should have a nice long run. :)


In fact, I would go so far as to say, depending on how the P performs, I don't expect a major hardware revision for a very long time.

What exactly is there to revise? More ram could help for running linux, but a properly optimized linux distro probably mitigates that need. More speed? Again, just about any app properly compiled and optimized can run.

Emulators? Sure they could aim for smaller stepping stones like Dreamcast and PSP emulation, should they prove impossible on the current generation Pandora (which is still up in the air, looking into the long-term), but a full generation step in emulation capabilities would probably make more sense, as it would establish the next P as a true step up in capabilities.

So I guess that leaves games programmed for the P. While I'm not incredibly knowledgeable on homebrew games, it is my understanding that a well-programmed game will probably require a lot of work in order to hit the ceiling on the Pandora's graphics capabilities in a meaningful way. In other words, it would probably prove difficult to make a game that would require a more powerful system without simply raising the particle numbers, increasing reflection map resolution, and other things that simply require changing variables until the framerate starts to suffer.

The only thing I see that can give reason for better hardware sooner rather than much, much later, would be if commercial games really start to take off on the Pandora. And by take off, I mean, there would have to be enough developers that they are the final say in the direction the P goes, not the community. Not incredibly possible from this perspective, but I'm talking about years down the road, so you never know what might happen.


Of course, hardware revisions that don't involve the guts of the P are still possible. We are talking about a system that is running almost entirely off-the-shelf parts. I don't think it would be too unreasonable to expect, once they have sold a ridiculous amount later on in the future and the money and financial venture seems sound, to make a smaller, lighter Pandora that makes extra space by having custom parts built that combine features that are specially fitted for the new Pandora. All the custom built parts would be expensive as hell, but we're talking about an established company rolling in the money of their first successful business venture.


So all in all, expect little to no change for probably 8+ years. That's my guess.
 
I wouldn't worry about the second batch not looking like the first. If the demand is there (which is seems it is!) and part lead times can be staged properly, one run could lead right into the next one. It's way too expensive to do any major changes and would be a real kick in the face to all our wonderful early adopters.


I just wanted to let you know that......and show off my new avatar :)
 
8 yeahs, eh? That's an awful long time for a handheld gadget these days. My guess is that if 8 years from now if they haven't decided to reprise the Pandora with something newer, then it will mean they have gotten out of the hardware game.

Of course, the community support will outlive official support so in that sense 8 years is not that long.
 
Re: The worries of an early adpotor

Frogboy said:
That's probably true. Was there any other handhelds out at the time (that wasn't made by Nintendo)?

There was the Neo Geo Pocket and Wonderswan. Neither of which were more popular than Nintendo's offerings. Doesn't mean I don't own both of them though :p
 
I heard the wonderswans break if you only look at them wrong. Sorta like the DS Lite hinges (why?! I never abused it in any way, sort or form!)
 
The only hardware revision that is likely to make it into the second batch would be based on our feedback as early adopters.

The control layout may change slightly, the keyboard may become more responsive, or less loud (if it clicks), there may be fixes to common problems (like controls breaking easily, port connectors snapping internally etc).

Although it would be nice indeed if none of this happens, it's the risk you take as an early-adopter and is generally accepted. Remember that these folks haven't had chance to really play on one yet - and they probably won't until just before the first units start shipping.

Realistically, I'm expecting problems and breakages.

But we have to pre-order, for without us there would be no Pandora at all. Without us, Craig, ED and MWeston would not succeed in their venture, and probably more importantly it would be a major blow to free, open hardware development.

So even if the inevitable problems do occur, you should still feel proud that you were there at the start of it all. This is the beginning of something great.

D.
 
rokdcasbah said:
8 yeahs, eh? That's an awful long time for a handheld gadget these days. My guess is that if 8 years from now if they haven't decided to reprise the Pandora with something newer, then it will mean they have gotten out of the hardware game.

Of course, the community support will outlive official support so in that sense 8 years is not that long.

I guess I should have distinguished between a remix of the Pandora (smaller, slimmer, better) and an overhaul of the hardware... I imagine if they are not planning on making new hardware anytime soon, they would probably do a hardware overhaul to keep interest.

But how long do you think it will take before they could get a piece of hardware out the door that costs ~$300 and can emulate PS2? Aside from extreme circumstances (commercial development taking center stage, optimizations not helping the P as much as we thought it would), that's pretty much the next milestone they would need to meet. Of course, 8+ years is a tad bit arbitrary for that kind of milestone, as I have been out of the high-end hardware loop for quite some time now. But my main point has been, it needs to be one heck of a milestone at under $300 before people will bite.
 
Kyosys said:
I heard the wonderswans break if you only look at them wrong. Sorta like the DS Lite hinges (why?! I never abused it in any way, sort or form!)
I got a swanCrystal which was the last iteration of the wonderswan system. I like it, I just wish it was front lit. Maybe I'll get it modded one of these days.
 
Back
Top