Pyra as a Phone

[Haraldur]

@lameventanas There are two speakers, to the right and to the left of the keyboard. As @TrashyMG said, "phone mode" could disable the near-microphone speaker and, given that there are plenty of buttons and so no real need for touchscreen phone controls, could also disable the touch screen (simply by being fullscreen and doing nothing with the input). I imagine that the Pyra would have to be pressed rather forcefully into the head for any buttons to be activated.

Plus, there is the "speakerphone" option, with the pyra 30-50 centimetres away from the mouth. There is also the option of using earphones with a built-in microphone (though I am not sure about the compatibility, as there are two standards for this) -- if, like me, you always have earphones around your neck, then the vibrator might be a sufficient alert (the Pandora fits in my pocket, so I expect the Pyra to, too) and it should not take long to insert one in your ear (and some come with buttons that can send some sort of signal back to the -- presumed -- phone).

I you take many calls this may not suffice, but I get very few, as most communications are by SMS. I can live with the inconvenience for the convenience of not carrying around and extra phone.

 

[Letalis Sonus]

though I am not sure about the compatibility, as there are two standards for this

Both are supported, the contacts switch automagically.

 

[TrashyMG]

Both are supported, the contacts switch automagically.

Correct, The Pyra has a chip from Ti that can automatically detect which pin ground is and switch appropriately. I'll see if I can dig up the part number from an older thread.


Edit: Found the reference: https://pyra-handheld.com/boards/threads/decent-connectors.75110/#post-1323750

 

[WizardStan]

Both are supported, the contacts switch automagically.

A feature which may become mostly useless in the not so distant future.

 

[b_o_b]

The Pyra won't make for a convenient phone just because of the clamshell design, but my guess there will be three options. Using the built on Mic on the left side, the left speaker can be disabled in phone mode to prevent feedback, Wired headset and bluetooth headset.

I have been thinking about this and was looking for a bluetooth dialer that could basically replace a phone if you combine it with a Pyra. There seem to be products that are doing exactly that. With something like this you can dial and answer a call like a regular basic phone. You only have to keep a Pyra in close proximity (<10 meters). Not sure how it will work in practice or if there are better solutions.

http://www.alibaba.com/product-deta...029356246.html?spm=a2700.7724857.29.21.6UaXuZ

 

[Luke-Jr]

Size: You're right with that. There are smaller phones. But hey, It's only one device for everything. I had my Pandora and my phone with e for years so it would be one device less for me.

I'll be upgrading from a N900, so Pyra's "everything" is actually a net (function) loss for me since it has no cameras. I'll now need to carry around a second device to take pictures/video.

Still, from the picture I can't imagine how you could use the Pyra as a phone without a headset. Is there a speaker on the right side of the keyboard?

99% of the time, I use my N900 in speakerphone mode.

This thing is not designed to be a phone, there was no single compromise in the design to allow you to use it in that way, so we need a new project for that.

Is anyone actually planning a more phone-friendly "fork" of the hardware?
I'd love to buy an upgraded case that adds a pair of cameras and a speaker on the back on the display... (and ideally, it'd be pretty nice to have the display pivot around to become a tablet like the Zaurus SL-C1000 did...)

 

[Askarus]

I'll be upgrading from a N900, so Pyra's "everything" is actually a net (function) loss for me since it has no cameras. I'll now need to carry around a second device to take pictures/video.

I suppose not having a camera was that one shitty decision that has to be made.

 

[Grench]

A feature which may become mostly useless in the not so distant future.

From a company that has been mostly useless but insanely successful for no apparent reason beyond having stoned hipsters think it's cool.
[doublepost=1452639790,1452638882][/doublepost]

I suppose not having a camera was that one shitty decision that has to be made.

It keeps coming up and I'll keep squashing it. Not having a camera wasn't a shitty decision in the slightest. Camera modules that are available for purchase start at ~8mm cubes and get bigger from there. There simply is not anywhere that makes sense to put a feature that large. The lid from glass screen to the logo carved in the back plastic is simply not thick enough to house a camera. Putting the camera in the base is impractical - there is no 'good angle' for it to function from at that point.

Even if the camera were to somehow be shoehorned into the lid plastics off to the side of the screen where the depth available is even shorter - which way should it face? In for conferencing or out for picture taking? Answer: Include 2 of course... yeah, no, that doesn't work either.

To top it off, there is a segment of the population who would only be willing to accept a device with a camera if it had a physical jumper that they could remove to electrically remove the camera.

It was not a 'shitty decision', it was a logical well thought out decision based on simple parts availability, the Pyra audience and 3 dimensional physics.
[doublepost=1452640728][/doublepost]

I'll be upgrading from a N900, so Pyra's "everything" is actually a net (function) loss for me since it has no cameras. I'll now need to carry around a second device to take pictures/video.

Let's take a look at that.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_N900

Funny, I don't see a protected screen (not clam-shell).
No full size SD slots
Seriously cramped keyboard.
No game pad controls
No nubs
No shoulder buttons
800x480 resolution on a 3.5" screen - Pandora had that on a 4.3" - Pyra's 1280x720 is great for a 5" screen.
1320 mAh battery - Pyra has 6000 mAh

The list goes on and on... Sorry, but, "net (function) loss" due to it not having a crappy camera with a tiny lens... Nope, that just doesn't fly.

The physics of gathering light are quite simple. If you want to take good pictures, get a camera with a large diameter fast lens (50mm f1.4 for example.) Then put a large, sensitive, high quality CCD behind it to register that light. Phones that fit in pockets will forever be shoddy cameras - physics is simply not on their side.

 

[Askarus]

It keeps coming up and I'll keep squashing it. Not having a camera wasn't a shitty decision in the slightest. Camera modules that are available for purchase start at ~8mm cubes and get bigger from there. There simply is not anywhere that makes sense to put a feature that large. The lid from glass screen to the logo carved in the back plastic is simply not thick enough to house a camera. Putting the camera in the base is impractical - there is no 'good angle' for it to function from at that point.

Even if the camera were to somehow be shoehorned into the lid plastics off to the side of the screen where the depth available is even shorter - which way should it face? In for conferencing or out for picture taking? Answer: Include 2 of course... yeah, no, that doesn't work either.

To top it off, there is a segment of the population who would only be willing to accept a device with a camera if it had a physical jumper that they could remove to electrically remove the camera.

It was not a 'shitty decision', it was a logical well thought out decision based on simple parts availability, the Pyra audience and 3 dimensional physics.

I was on for not having a camera as well.
Then I realized: I would have liked it for me.

Your arguments are the one that made the Team not to use a camera and that's fine.
I still would have liked one for me, and lots of others, too.

 

[Plume]

Is there any way to treat accelerated video input on the OMAP SoC anyway ?

 

[TrashyMG]

Is there any way to treat accelerated video input on the OMAP SoC anyway ?

From the brief look at the tech documents, yeah I believe it does.

 

[Grench]

I was on for not having a camera as well.
Then I realized: I would have liked it for me.

Your arguments are the one that made the Team not to use a camera and that's fine.
I still would have liked one for me, and lots of others, too.

Frankly, I don't care if it does or does not have a camera from a presence absence basis. But the overriding fact is that the lack of any logical physical place to shove one into makes the whole 'argument' moot. I don't see it as an argument. It's kind of like 'arguing' with someone who wants gravity removed. They can make their statements of how much they want it - and how great it will be, but the fact that it can't be done pretty much ends the 'argument'.

 

[Plume]

As long as people don't want the electromagnetic interaction removed ...


@TrashyMG: Is it like the Raspberry Pi, where the encoding is hardwired or how does it work ?

 

[TrashyMG]

@TrashyMG: Is it like the Raspberry Pi, where the encoding is hardwired or how does it work ?

Not quite sure, I do know the OMAP5 itself has 3 Camera inputs and there is some kind of Video Processing Engine that is mentioned in GLSDK.

http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index...evelopers_Guide#Running_VIP.2FVPE_application

 

[Eight Bit]

Maybe some one will some day design a nice USB camera pyra add-on, some frame that can snap on the body of the case or something. It would have to be a nice camera then though, no cheap 3MP phone front camera one.

I wanted one too to be able to fully replace my phone

 

[RubisDrake]

Yeah, I honestly see no reason to use mobile broadband with this thing. But, all I'd have to do is get another micro-sim, and that seems pretty easy. I always carry my smartphone around with me anyway, so I could even tether it.

What will the GSM drivers and firmware be for the Pyra be like? Are they just going to use straight up NetworkManager/ModemManager for GSM? If so, I would be pretty okay with that. Another option is Connman, although I don't remember if it can do GSM.

I wish somebody could give us a hardware spec for the GSM modem used in the Pyra.

 

[WizardStan]

I wish somebody could give us a hardware spec for the GSM modem used in the Pyra.

The PLS8
Possibly alternatively the PHS8 which is the 3G version. You'll probably be able to choose between them.
The hardware is really straight forward, it just creates a tty device: AT command to dial, AT command to answer, AT command to connect to the internet, AT command to get GPS coordinates. The hard part is coming up with a nice interface.

 

[lameventanas]

It keeps coming up and I'll keep squashing it. Not having a camera wasn't a shitty decision in the slightest. Camera modules that are available for purchase start at ~8mm cubes and get bigger from there. There simply is not anywhere that makes sense to put a feature that large. The lid from glass screen to the logo carved in the back plastic is simply not thick enough to house a camera. Putting the camera in the base is impractical - there is no 'good angle' for it to function from at that point.

It was not a 'shitty decision', it was a logical well thought out decision based on simple parts availability, the Pyra audience and 3 dimensional physics.

The decision was "shitty" not due to its outcome, but due to the fact that its a hard one to make: either choice turns down potential buyers. At least that is how I understood it.
There might be space for one of those tiny cameras I see in new phones nowadays. Not the best quality, but better than nothing.

Even if the camera were to somehow be shoehorned into the lid plastics off to the side of the screen where the depth available is even shorter - which way should it face? In for conferencing or out for picture taking? Answer: Include 2 of course... yeah, no, that doesn't work either.

Here are all the options, ordered by my personal preference:

1. Include 2: good for both cases.
   
2. Facing in: good for conferencing and selfies, awkward for normal pictures.
3. Facing out: Awkward for conferencing and selfies, good for normal pictures.
4. None: use another device or usb camera which is awkward in all cases.

To top it off, there is a segment of the population who would only be willing to accept a device with a camera if it had a physical jumper that they could remove to electrically remove the camera.

These people can always use black tape to cover the camera.
The "other" people, the ones that are only willing to have a device with camera, they can't do much about it.
Either way, the decision was probably taken based on space, cost, complexity, and other factors.

Let's take a look at that.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_N900

Funny, I don't see a protected screen (not clam-shell).
No full size SD slots
Seriously cramped keyboard.
No game pad controls
No nubs
No shoulder buttons
800x480 resolution on a 3.5" screen - Pandora had that on a 4.3" - Pyra's 1280x720 is great for a 5" screen.
1320 mAh battery - Pyra has 6000 mAh

The list goes on and on... Sorry, but, "net (function) loss" due to it not having a crappy camera with a tiny lens... Nope, that just doesn't fly.

This is irrelevant. You are comparing a device from 2009 with one that hasn't even been released yet, and both have different use cases.
The N900 is a good all-in-one device, but the games you can play on it is very limited.
Pyra will be great for gamers with all those buttons, controls, etc, but not so great if you want an all-in-one device.

The physics of gathering light are quite simple. If you want to take good pictures, get a camera with a large diameter fast lens (50mm f1.4 for example.) Then put a large, sensitive, high quality CCD behind it to register that light. Phones that fit in pockets will forever be shoddy cameras - physics is simply not on their side.

I couldn't agree more.
That is why I always take a dedicated camera whenever I plan to be in a photo-worthy situation, and use my N900's crappy camera whenever I am unprepared for one.

The worst camera is the one you don't have.

 

[levi]

Pyra will be great for gamers with all those buttons, controls, etc, but not so great if you want an all-in-one device.

Define 'all in one'. I found the my Pandora's game buttons made navigating the desktop and working in the shell much easier than it would have been without them; X and Y act as page up and page down, and the way Shift is on left trigger meant typing capital letters is easier, and shift up and down to scroll the terminal is a one-handed operation.

Granted I won't be able to take pictures with my Pyra without plugging in a separate camera, but that keyboard and navigation buttons should make it easier to sort and file my photos once I do plug my camera in to it.

I guess it's the difference between being able to do everything, and being able to do slightly fewer things well. But it's more of a concern if your only planning to take your Pyra with you as your one and only device, admittedly.

 

[Plume]

There might be space for one of those tiny cameras I see in new phones nowadays. Not the best quality, but better than nothing.
[...]
Either way, the decision was probably taken based on space, cost, complexity, and other factors.

Well, find such a camera with Linux (not Android) drivers that can be ordered in batches of thousands.
Somewhere somebody found a module made by ST (?) but it was already too big.