Problems with some Apps in store / repo
- Thread starter cp_clegg
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skeezix
Internal Development
Craig -- it'd be pretty easy to add a routine to spew out the repo JSON info, and then pndstore (for instance) could harvest from your site as well.
(And if you're finally getting non-pnds in there, that'll be great; currently only the original ED's archive can host pdfs, themes/zips and random stuff, which is absolutely essential.)
I do not think people need to war around; there is _nothing_ wrong with having a wiki, an archive, the repo, abnd the app-store, and more; competition and rivalry and coverage is good -- and its also called 'backup' in case something happens to one (like seems to be frequent
More to point -- giving people _choice_ is always good .. let peopel use whichever they'd like.
Really, the built in browsers shoudl ust eh 'bookmarks' page as their starting point, so that the user can then pick their frontends of choice, since they all have their merits.
Craig _is_ bullheaded, and sometimes is in the way; but as I've said, its that same bullheadedness that has him get stuff done. I mean, it has been an uphill battle, and everyone invovled has had to be determined as hell. (You dont' know how many hundreds of firmware builds we tested .. I personally reflashed 5 times a night for a year or two before the first units shipped Sometimes folks aren't right, sometimes thwey are; life is not black and white, its gradiant. I'm not overall a fan of app store 1.0, but maybe 2.0 will be great, whose to say until we see it. But Craig is also worried about support and control .. he does have a bit of a control issue perhaps, but he's also got GBAX and is the head of the OPT and worries over continuity. I can see that -- it might be he's just olooking at the other guys like 'thats great, but I dont' have a guarantee they'll be up in 6 mo'. (Maybe after a track record is proven he'll think better of them.. but then again, he's already got his site up, and after all this time.. it is hard to opjust put it down,a nd to real reason why he should.)
So .. theres multiple sites.
Thats good -- use the one you like, and that fits your needs. With multiple you have backups, and choice.. anyone who really wants one site really hasn't paid attention to the shit thats been gong on in mobile industry the last 10 years
Craig -- but you shoudl steal some ideas from repo; we've got PXML and the app-spec pretty tight these days, so on repo you can just upload a pnd, and all the app info is sucked right out of the PXML live; no re-enterign data. And then opndstore can come along and auto-update the apps right on a pandora, without user hitting the repo web UI at all. Pretty hot shit You coudl add the repo bit to yours in a couple hours work, and then you're in the loop again.
jeff
(And if you're finally getting non-pnds in there, that'll be great; currently only the original ED's archive can host pdfs, themes/zips and random stuff, which is absolutely essential.)
I do not think people need to war around; there is _nothing_ wrong with having a wiki, an archive, the repo, abnd the app-store, and more; competition and rivalry and coverage is good -- and its also called 'backup' in case something happens to one (like seems to be frequent
More to point -- giving people _choice_ is always good .. let peopel use whichever they'd like.Really, the built in browsers shoudl ust eh 'bookmarks' page as their starting point, so that the user can then pick their frontends of choice, since they all have their merits.
Craig _is_ bullheaded, and sometimes is in the way; but as I've said, its that same bullheadedness that has him get stuff done. I mean, it has been an uphill battle, and everyone invovled has had to be determined as hell. (You dont' know how many hundreds of firmware builds we tested .. I personally reflashed 5 times a night for a year or two before the first units shipped
Sometimes folks aren't right, sometimes thwey are; life is not black and white, its gradiant. I'm not overall a fan of app store 1.0, but maybe 2.0 will be great, whose to say until we see it. But Craig is also worried about support and control .. he does have a bit of a control issue perhaps, but he's also got GBAX and is the head of the OPT and worries over continuity. I can see that -- it might be he's just olooking at the other guys like 'thats great, but I dont' have a guarantee they'll be up in 6 mo'. (Maybe after a track record is proven he'll think better of them.. but then again, he's already got his site up, and after all this time.. it is hard to opjust put it down,a nd to real reason why he should.)So .. theres multiple sites.
Thats good -- use the one you like, and that fits your needs. With multiple you have backups, and choice.. anyone who really wants one site really hasn't paid attention to the shit thats been gong on in mobile industry the last 10 years
Craig -- but you shoudl steal some ideas from repo; we've got PXML and the app-spec pretty tight these days, so on repo you can just upload a pnd, and all the app info is sucked right out of the PXML live; no re-enterign data. And then opndstore can come along and auto-update the apps right on a pandora, without user hitting the repo web UI at all. Pretty hot shit
You coudl add the repo bit to yours in a couple hours work, and then you're in the loop again.jeff
Caine
Hardcore Member
I have to agree with what Jeff said. Having multiple sites is great and I'm certainly looking forward to what the new app store 2.0 will be capable of.
Currently the best attribute of the app store is that it is up-to-date. It would be wonderful if we could have automated access to that repository through a reliable manner (i.e. the REPO spec) instead of having to resort to web scraping.
The lack of a decent package manager on the Pandora is annoying me WAY more than I expected it would. I expect that running from SD card and using the regular Angstrom repository is a good way to address this problem, but it also removes the incentive to actually package software as a PND.
So Craig, if you can find a bit of time or the willingness to accept help from the community, then please implement support for the REPO spec in the official app store.
Currently the best attribute of the app store is that it is up-to-date. It would be wonderful if we could have automated access to that repository through a reliable manner (i.e. the REPO spec) instead of having to resort to web scraping.
The lack of a decent package manager on the Pandora is annoying me WAY more than I expected it would. I expect that running from SD card and using the regular Angstrom repository is a good way to address this problem, but it also removes the incentive to actually package software as a PND.
So Craig, if you can find a bit of time or the willingness to accept help from the community, then please implement support for the REPO spec in the official app store.
sebt3
homebrew player (P. & C.)
My reasoning is the following :
If someone take control over your site he basically take over ED webserver.
If he have control over the ED's webserver he could have taken down
- the whole apps.o.o
- the file-archive
- the repo
- the git server (where all the pandora sources are)
- and many other services (pandora related or not)
So why someone with that much power only target a few apps over your website ?
It doesnt make any sense.
If the guy had something against the pandora he would have killed all the pandora related services. But he did not.
If the guy had something against your website, he would have drop anything related to your website. But he did not.
I'm unable to put a motive in front of the crime. When there is no motive, there is no crime, hence I was calling BS.
I would guess it was a bug in your script that flushed some files or an accident.
Yet nice to know you're still reading the fotrum where most of the pandora related devel still occur. One day you'll even join the fun and release your game on your own machine
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craigix
Mega GP Mania
My reasoning is the following :
If someone take control over your site he basically take over ED webserver.
If he have control over the ED's webserver he could have taken down
- the whole apps.o.o
- the file-archive
- the repo
- the git server (where all the pandora sources are)
- and many other services (pandora related or not)
So why someone with that much power only target a few apps over your website ?
It doesnt make any sense.
If the guy had something against the pandora he would have killed all the pandora related services. But he did not.
If the guy had something against your website, he would have drop anything related to your website. But he did not.
I'm unable to put a mobile in front of the crime. When there is no motive, there is no crime, hence I was calling BS.
I would guess it was a bug in your script that flushed some files or an accident.
Yet nice to know you're still reading the fotrum where most of the pandora related devel still occur. One day you'll even join the fun and release your game on your own machine
I'm sure Sony can help me here, I need the Picard face.
You have totally misunderstood what happened on Pandora Apps. No one hacked any servers. Someone spent some time guessing file names and submitted garbage to them, they obviously thought that had killed them but it only killed the user comments.
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skeezix
Internal Development
Witchunts is wasted effort in my books; maybe its cause I got the clock hanging over my head now, but just seems like .. okay, who cares, move on. Hacked or not, its irrelevent. (Hacked at the server level and poisoning the git does concern me, but a specific attack on data in the app store, that was repaired.. who cares, I got no time to worry over such things If someone gets into our git I worry -- we have abckups, but Real Crackers know to poison a system in subtle ways, so that no one notices.. then a year later tyou go nuts, and no one has backups oldeer than a year, so the intrusion is impossibole to remove without major rebuilsding and data loss.. that stuff keeps me up at night
Craig -- add repo spec JSON-report to your site, and peopel will stop bitching so much
Or maybe I shoudl not worry over peace keeping and let everyone have flamnewars
jeff
If someone gets into our git I worry -- we have abckups, but Real Crackers know to poison a system in subtle ways, so that no one notices.. then a year later tyou go nuts, and no one has backups oldeer than a year, so the intrusion is impossibole to remove without major rebuilsding and data loss.. that stuff keeps me up at night Craig -- add repo spec JSON-report to your site, and peopel will stop bitching so much
Or maybe I shoudl not worry over peace keeping and let everyone have flamnewars
jeff
sebt3
homebrew player (P. & C.)
So there is someone that have taken the time to try to bring apps.o.o down for real ????
Sooo stupid !
I cant even imagine who would have done this. The guy realy need to hate you ! But I know nobody that hate you enough for that.
Blue Protoman
Well-Known Member
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Also, the server is pretty much secured. Most stuff runs in safe mode and restricted environment to make sure no one can run any system commands on my server.
So in worst case, he should only be able to wipe out the complete appstore but can't touch the server itself.
And I got backups for that
Cas
Active Member
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2010
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- 613
Esn
(:";
Craig, have you used PNDStore? It's incredibly useful and time-saving! It allows me to see at a glance ALL the PNDs that I have installed on my Pandora, and it also lists all the PNDs that I HAVEN'T installed or that need to be updated, from any website that uses the PND Repository specification. It allows me to uninstall, install or update PNDs all in one location.
The program could be improved with more features (and I'm sure Tempel's working on it), but it's already an incredible time-saver.
Have you tried using it? Please try using it.
If you could get Pandora Apps to support the PND Repository Spec, PNDStore would work with it as well, and it would make things much easier for the users. For THE MAN ON THE STREET, as well as everyone else.
That's my perspective here.
All these conspiracy things are entertaining, but they're besides the point.
The point is that some people here have come up with a great idea that makes things simpler for THE MAN ON THE STREET, so it would be VERY NICE if you could make Pandora Apps 2.0 work with PNDStore as well. Or if there's something you don't like about it, say what it is, so maybe they can fix it.
David Bowman, have you used PNDStore? Please try using it, then come back and say whether you think Craig should consider supporting it. This is what this is about, an idea, not about Craig as a person.
I was perplexed by why Craig seemed to be completely ignoring PNDStore, so perhaps I came to the wrong conclusions. Maybe Craig was just too busy with other things to understand these new developments.
But at least my somewhat provocative post got him to pay attention and respond, so maybe it did do some good.
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thatgui
Advanced Member
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- 3,048
I haven't read all related post, but as far as I did understand the whole discussion: It was not about, that anyone has a problem that craig want's to keep/enhance his own place to store apps (heck, why shouldn't they after all ?). It was about his refusal of the suggestion to implement the possiblity of having a decent way to make automated request. And this was not brought forth by some guys saying that they have an idea that could work out eventually. This was mentioned by someone who had already a working and appreciated system going. Instead he makes a pointless suggestion to parse his pages.
What get's emotions rising is just craigs business as usual. He has plan of how things have to be done, and there is simply no room for variations - as little as they might be.
Esn
(:";
I think Craig just has blinders on, like a horse, in order to stay focused.
And this is really useful for avoiding distractions and getting things done in business, but it also means that you sometimes miss seeing something important and don't even realize it.
I think that's what's happening here. Craig is like the oblivious Pointy Haired Boss in Dilbert who doesn't realize he's oblivious. It seems by his replies (over the past few weeks) that he doesn't understand what PNDStore is or why so many people like it. He's just skimmed over the details because he's too busy, and doesn't get what the big deal is.
If he did understand, he'd realize that this is exactly the thing that the "man on the street" is looking for, and that we're on the same damn side.
(and Craig, sorry for the potentially insulting comparisons, I'm just trying to get you to pay attention because this is a BIG DEAL)
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Esn
(:";
It sounds like you, also, don't understand what this is about. You can have it both ways.
If there are many repo sites with different looks & features, but they all use the PND Repo Specification, then the competition between the different repo sites won't affect ordinary "man on the street" users, who'll be able to use PNDStore (or another program like it) to make sure that they don't miss anything, no matter which site it was uploaded to.
Imagine if certain sites on the internet only worked in certain browsers. It would be very annoying for users. That's why there's a standard language like HTML. This doesn't stop competition between different browsers.
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I also vote for PNDStore-Support for the Appstore.
I'm only using PNDStore to install and update all my PNDs as well...
I'm only using PNDStore to install and update all my PNDs as well...
Blue Protoman
Well-Known Member
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I'm the one man in thirty that has problems with PNDStore.
Bosbeetle
Terminally lost
I also love the PNDstore thingamajig. And i also think there should be choice. And I am also repeating a lot that already has been said.
so here is a picture of a bird
so here is a picture of a bird
Esn
(:";
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