Pandora's Next Competitor - The Iphone!

[PoisonedV]

iPretension, iHipster, iFanboy, iShit.
This discussion was already long over. Fact is, it's still not relevant.
I don't know who I hate more, Steve Ballmer or Steve Jobs. Steves suck.

 

[waffles]

Actually i think its more relevant than ever, now that the iphone is only 200.
personally, its a fairly simple comparison.
the pandora is not a smartphone.
the iphone doesn't have any buttons.
/thread

 

[craigix]

The iPhone is not even close to the Pandora in terms of power/resolution etc. It is probably more of a danger to the GP2X when you plug it in to an iControlpad

 

[Chip]

Speaking of not being a fan of the iphone, I'd like to point out again that this whole discussion is based on an article with a ridiculously flawed main premise. There is exactly zero evidence that Apple is even working on an iphone 2 yet, let alone any word of what hardware it might use.

Well... There is now.

And there are games.

And there will soon be game controls.

And the iPhone is only $199 now, (or it will be on July 11, when the 3G model ships.)


Hey, that's my quote.

I stand by it too. The 3G iphone is just that - an original iphone with a 3G/GPS radio. It's no "Iphone 2". The Samsung S5L8900 SoC used by both the 2G and 3G versions is a step or two behind the Pandora in both general processing power and video acceleration.

While the 3rd party games demoed at WWDC look nice, none of them will be able to utilize the icontrol pad.
Remember, Big Steve still has final say over what can and cannot be sold on the app store. Do you really think he's going to allow programs that use unsanctioned 3rd party addons? The icontrol pad is great for emulators and other jailbreak-only games, but it will never work with official apps.

The only really interesting news to come out of WWDC is the new price. For $200 I'd might actually consider an iphone when my contract runs out with Verizon in a few months. I swore I'd never own another phone that didn't have a real qwerty keypad, but the possibility of cutting out one device that I have to carry everywhere (ipod) is appealing. Plus, the basic AT&T plan is actually cheaper than what I'm paying Verizon now. It's just too bad that their 3G coverage is abysmal compared to EVDO.

 

[PoisonedV]

On the page it said you have to buy a 2 year subscription with it. I for one, will pass.

 

[chad78]

Hey, that's my quote.


Fixed.
QUOTE
While the 3rd party games demoed at WWDC look nice, none of them will be able to utilize the icontrol pad.
Remember, Big Steve still has final say over what can and cannot be sold on the app store. Do you really think he's going to allow programs that use unsanctioned 3rd party addons? The icontrol pad is great for emulators and other jailbreak-only games, but it will never work with official apps.

I'm not a iFanboy - and I'm not promoting the iPhone - merely stating that is a competitor now. And, just like the PSP and DS Lite - un-official software *does* play a role in people's decisions to buy things. Pandora's own Craig is literally *banking on that fact* with the iControlPad.

And just like the PSP and DS, the new and improved iPhone presents the problem of offering emulators (officially supported or not) *and* brand new commercial level games. Yes, the Pandora's power is vastly greater than the iPhone, or the PSP, or the DS, or - in some areas - the GameCube and the Xbox... But how many games can get to that power? None of the emulated games can. You can't play GC or Xbox games on it. You can't play Windows games on it. You can't get to that power - except through games specifically written for the Pandora.

I don't have any experience in this. This is *not* a smartass question. I am trying to learn...

How many games were actually made natively for the GP2X? How many for the GP32? Just ballpark it - I'm not asking for a Wikipedia listing of the titles. 12? 25? 50? 300?

Saying the Pandora is "more powerful" is fine and good - and accurate - but if the iPhone (or other device with native games) has native games that run at that device's full potential, but the Pandora has to emulate everything - the *GAMES* will be less powerful on the Pandora. (And that means resolution, frame rate, 3D effects, etc. etc.). When I emulate an Atari on my Xbox - the Xbox's power doesn't mean anything. It doesn't improve the quality of the game. It will never be more powerful than it was on the device for which it was first written.

The iPhone is even more of a competitor than a DS or a PSP, since both the iPhone and the Pandora are far more than gaming systems. They are multi-use devices - or close-to-all-in-ones. Each having features the other lacks - a QWERTY keyboard / multitouch - GPS / game controls - a cell phone / card readers - a high res screen / accelorometer - camera / video-out... (no, those features are not meant to match up in any way, just the order I thought of them in...)

QUOTE
The only really interesting news to come out of WWDC is the new price. For $200 I'd might actually consider an iphone...
And you are not alone in that. I never thought I'd consider an iPhone. I don't want an iPod - the "bang-for-your-buck" ratio is just not there. Also, until the iPod Touch, the iPods were completely devoid of any features! Now the iPhone is cheaper than an iPod Touch - and is a phone. I have to carry a phone. I just got rid of my N800. The iPhone might fill the void and be my always-with-me device. But the contract is what's holding me back, since I'm not on a contract now.

That doesn't mean I won't get a Pandora. I see the value of each device. (Same as I do for both the Eee PC and the Pandora.) I just think the comparison is valid, and the addition of native gaming makes it much more so.

 

[PoisonedV]

Well see, theres the thing- it's about as valid as calling the eee pc a pandora competitor. YES, they may have a range of overlap on their abilities, but each one succeeds the most where it is meant for.

 

[craigix]

Ported PC games such as Quake3 can access all the power of the Pandora.

 

[imec]

There's a very nice iPhone review that, among other things, proves why it's sub-par for games.



Best website, EVAr.

 

[Adventus]

QUOTE
You can't get to that power - except through games specifically written for the Pandora.
Ignoring ofcourse: Quake 1-3 and their derivatives, Warzone 2100, Cube 1 & 2, Nexuiz, Tremulous. Although some of these games will probably require a major rendering restructure (unless you use DOGGLES or what ever its called).

EDIT: Geez i must be a slow writer.

 

[chad78]

QUOTE
specifically written for the Pandora.

these games will probably require a major rendering restructure

How are these two statements different?

 

[sindbad]

Those statements aren't too different, but he isn't too right either. They won't need any major changes. Transition from OpenGL to OpenGL ES, but not major. We might even be very very lucky (don't count on this) and have the driver support full OpenGL.

The iPhone is still too expensive since it doesn't really do that much and there are no proper gaming controls. 200$ without a contract and I would probably get it. But then I'll go through all the trouble of not being able to customize much on it. Maybe if Openmoko would work on it.

 

[Adventus]

QUOTE
How are these two statements different?
You said it in the context of writing a whole game specifically for Pandora, its much easier porting from GL to GL ES. Alternatively you could use the DOGGLES library at a small performance cost which dynamically translates OpenGL 1.5 calls to OpenGL ES 2.0 calls.

QUOTE
They won't need any major changes. Transition from OpenGL to OpenGL ES, but not major. We might even be very very lucky (don't count on this) and have the driver support full OpenGL.
Depends. If the games uses immediate mode or something exotic, it might require some restructuring. I was stating it as a worst case scenario (tends to be right in my experience ).

 

[gaterooze]

How many games were actually made natively for the GP2X? How many for the GP32? Just ballpark it - I'm not asking for a Wikipedia listing of the titles. 12? 25? 50? 300?

400-500 on each. Many were optimized ports, but that's hardly relevant when talking about taking advantage of the hardware's power.

http://www.gp32x.de/cgi-bin/cfiles.cgi?0,0,0,0,9

http://www.gp2x.de/cgi-bin/cfiles.cgi?0,0,0,0,9

There are some truly fantastic homebrew games there, and the Pandora should take it another step forward.

 

[icurafu]

omg. It's the same phone only cheaper. no iphone2.

It's still as completly flawed for gaming except now it has games. Does not make it a good platform.

I'd prefer to play mobile boulder dash via midp on my 128x128 samsung.

 

[chad78]

QUOTE
How are these two statements different?
You said it in the context of writing a whole game specifically for Pandora,You are right, of course. That was a dumb question. I have no idea how hard porting something is - but I know it would have to be easier than coming up with a totally new game. Sorry about that.

omg. It's the same phone only cheaper. no iphone2.
I'm sorry, but you are wrong. They added 3G and GPS. It's not the same phone. Plus the software has been updated - and third party apps (including native games) are available without jailbreaking. (No, not the same apps that are available through jailbreaking - but apps that were not available before.) All of this - and it's half the price.

The software is called iPhone 2.0. The hardware is called iPhone 3G.

 

[gruso]

$200 + 24 month contract means you're probably paying close to a grand for the handset. I'm not really interested in doing that. It's a great time to buy an original iPhone though! The arse should be falling out of that market over the next few months. If I find one at the right price I might finally get one. The iControl makes it a more attractive phone upgrade than ever.

Pandora has first dibs on my funds of course. Once that lands, maybe I'll sell my '2X to help fund an iControl'd iPhone.

 

[Falcon Delta]

The Pandora isn't meant to compete with mainstream devices, so what is the point of these threads? What are we trying to do, convert the entire world to the religion of Pandora and prepare for the open source rapture?

 

[icurafu]

Yay, you're right. 3G + GPS makes a completely new phone and worthy of a name iPhone2. Which is exactly why Steve is calling it the iPhone2.

Gruso, you forgot the 50% penalty for living in a country with low demand for gadgets. That'll be about $300 for that 24 month contract.

 

[PoisonedV]

chad, just stop stirring up shit- its easy to come to the conclusion that it's not relevant to this forum and doesn't matter.
it should be moved, if not locked.