Pandora In The Gp2x Form Factor

[Joppu]

Yeah it's too late to ask. I would really like the idea of pandora hardware in the gp2x form factor. It would mean giving up the analogs and the keyboard (onscreen keyboard, anyone?) but it would at pandora more coolness factor. Of course this is an idea for future revision/homebrew mod!

 

[gruso]

Mod idea: Jam the Pandora hardware into a PSP case.

 

[Kings]

Yeah it's too late to ask. I would really like the idea of pandora hardware in the gp2x form factor. It would mean giving up the analogs and the keyboard (onscreen keyboard, anyone?) but it would at pandora more coolness factor. Of course this is an idea for future revision/homebrew mod!

If you read the original Pandora thread you can see what was discussed and why it isn't a Gp2x remake.

 

[realyst]

I'll only agree to that idea if the d-pad has a upper-left diagonal bias....and the headphone jack breaks off easy...and Craig&Co release one bad firmware and leave it as is for over a year. Then I'll buy it

Gotta get it accurate and all, right

 

[craigix]

A GP2X clone just isn't what we were trying to do here, we are trying to push the hand held console world forward a bit with our design.

If we made a GP2X clone I suspect we would receive no press at all, rather like all those blackfin machines.

As soon as we saw the huge reaction to the radical pandora design we suspected we had made the right choice.

 

[Prophet]

Yeah it's too late to ask. I would really like the idea of pandora hardware in the gp2x form factor. It would mean giving up the analogs and the keyboard (onscreen keyboard, anyone?) but it would at pandora more coolness factor. Of course this is an idea for future revision/homebrew mod!

Cool? What's cool about yet another boring Gameboy wannabe design?

In the past we've either had handheld computers that sucked for games (lousy controls) or game handhelds that sucked for anything besides simplistic games (i.e dpad & buttons only). Pandora finally puts it all together in one clever package.

The last thing I'd want personally, is for Pandora to become just another GP32/PSP type device with limited controls and inputs. And onscreen keyboards have ALWAYS sucked - thank God we'll finally have computer emulation without the pain of dealing with clunky onscreen KB interfaces.

 

[chad78]

Cool? What's cool about yet another boring Gameboy wannabe design?
Well, it seems to work for Nintendo, Sony, and in the past for Sega and a few others...
QUOTE
In the past we've either had handheld computers that sucked for games (lousy controls) or game handhelds that sucked for anything besides simplistic games (i.e dpad & buttons only). Pandora finally puts it all together in one clever package.
Simplistic games? WTF? Since when do the number of buttons = the complexity of game play? In that case Intellivision games were far less simple than GTA4 or FF XII or SSBB - because it had a number pad (12 buttons) and a control disc.

There are very complex games on the PSP and the DS - tons of RPGs, the GTA series, heck - Nintendogs is pretty complex when you think about it. Having 43 buttons or 4 buttons has nothing to do with it. Do good controls make a game better? Absolutely - but the effect the number of buttons has on the complexity of the game is next to nothing. Extreme examples like Steel Battalion do exist - but GBA games with 2 face buttons, 2 shoulder buttons, Start, Select, and D-Pad can get pretty complex. (FF VI Advance, anyone?) The fact that it's a remake doesn't make it less complex.
QUOTE
The last thing I'd want personally, is for Pandora to become just another GP32/PSP type device with limited controls and inputs. And onscreen keyboards have ALWAYS sucked - thank God we'll finally have computer emulation without the pain of dealing with clunky onscreen KB interfaces.

I don't want the Pandora to become "just another" anything. But having a PSP/GP2X/GBMicro style layout version would not be a bad idea. You could have all the controls except for the keyboard. 2 Shoulder buttons (although 4 would be better), D-Pad, 2 Analog sticks, 4 action buttons, 3 control buttons, and the touchscreen.

And, touchscreen keyboards don't all suck. The one on the N800 works great for me. And I've heard a few people like the one that Apple did on that little experimental communication device they tried. I'm not sure what it was called... MacCall or TeleApple - something. besides - game systems (and hence their emulated versions) have been working for decades without keyboards. Adding a keyboard will not let you type in "JUSTIN BAILEY JUSTIN BAILEY" to Metroid any more than it will let you type in the telephone numbers to Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure.

How many non-port, non-emulated games do you really expect to come out for the Pandora? How many of *those* do you really expect to take advantage of the keyboard?

The keyboard is not for games. The keyboard is for the UMPC side of things. If someone *just* wants the Pandora for gaming - the keyboard just gets in the way.

I don't want the Pandora just for gaming - I will be using the keyboard. I want the keyboard. But saying that the keyboard will somehow make the games more complex is just silly.

 

[atomicthumbs]

I want the Pandora in a form factor which I can tape to my foot and fit inside my shoe at the same time.

 

[computarman]

I think the pandora team has made wise design descisions. The clamshell design is a great design that minimizes size and protects the screen when folded. Pandora is not much bigger than the DS Lite and the keyboard is sure to be very useful. Pandora team hasn't even fully implemented the current design and someone wants a different design. It was ineveitable that some people would not like the current design but they just have tried to go for what they felt most people would want. It's cool that instead of just complaining about the limitataions and problems of GP2X they decided to actually do something about it.

 

[indrema]

I always have to resist being "sarcastically-unhelpful", but here's my stab at a serious answer. No, on-screen keybords don't suck. I'm writing this on my iPhone right now, but they do limit screen "real estate" while you're using them. If the keyboard is to be included at all, it's for emulating computer systems such as Amiga, Atari ST, etc. This would not be ideal in a game where you are doing a lot of typing.

...but I do understand you wanting to return to a form factor that was originated on the Atari Lynx..THE coolest console EVER!! We could even go so far as to emulate Atari's brilliance in requiring all programs be, fully, loaded into system RAM to operate!

On crap, there I go again.

 

[chad78]

...but I do understand you wanting to return to a form factor that was originated on the Atari Lynx..THE coolest console EVER!! We could even go so far as to emulate Atari's brilliance in requiring all programs be, fully, loaded into system RAM to operate!
First of all - the form of screen in the middle - buttons on either side - landscape style - did not originate with the Atari Lynx. Nintendo Game & Watch games had that style as far back as 1981.
Secondly, while not successful in and of itself - copying certain aspects of the Lynx is not a bad idea. It was, after all, the first color hand held gaming system. Maybe we should avoid color screens. Don’t want people to think we’re like that crudy outdated system, huh?

 

[indrema]

Avoid 16-color interlaced screens.....done.

 

[gaterooze]

How many non-port, non-emulated games do you really expect to come out for the Pandora? How many of *those* do you really expect to take advantage of the keyboard?

http://ifdb.tads.org/ for a start.

 

[JakeK]

I know what games I will be using the keyboard for, Police Quest FTW!!

 

[chad78]

How many non-port, non-emulated games do you really expect to come out for the Pandora? How many of *those* do you really expect to take advantage of the keyboard?

http://ifdb.tads.org/ for a start.

Those are not "non-port, non-emulated games". They would fall under one or the other - either a port, or a emulator. The "Zoom Interpretor" would have to be ported, or you would have to run it under an emulated system. Secondly, that proves nothing. Those games, (if you can call it a game), existed before the Pandora. It proves nothing about what Prophet was saying. He said, "In the past we've either had handheld computers that sucked for games (lousy controls) or game handhelds that sucked for anything besides simplistic games (i.e dpad & buttons only). Pandora finally puts it all together in one clever package."

These choose-your-own-adventure "games" could have been played on those handheld computers. (In fact, there are ports of the zoom thing for Windows Mobile and Palm.)

There are no games that will likely run on the Pandora where both the keyboard and the game controls will be used in any significant way, (IE other than typing in your name for the save state, or the high score, or whatever). For people who want a game system only, (which is what the OP was describing), the keyboard just gets in the way. Name another game system that uses a keyboard for games. Name any game that uses a keyboard and a game pad. There are PC games that can use either a keyboard *or* a game pad - but not both at the same time.

 

[gaterooze]

Name another game system that uses a keyboard for games. Name any game that uses a keyboard and a game pad. There are PC games that can use either a keyboard *or* a game pad - but not both at the same time.

Dude, have you ever played a c64, CPC, ZX, Amiga, ST, MSX? Ever played a proper a flight sim? Sierra adventure games?

And who knows what will be made specifically for the Pandora? That's the beauty of it! There could well be games that take advantage of the keyboard in crucial ways.

 

[Yrx]

chad78, you kind of like to argue...

I don't get why you wouldn't want the keyboard if it's already there. I could live without it, and I probably won't use it much, but it will be nice to have if I ever decide to use the vast potential for something else. I don't really see how it gets in the way, that's all. The only benefit to taking it away would be that you could squeeze everything into a non-clamshell design, but it would still be very thick (although I guess I still don't see the benefit of this...). The analogs wouldn't really have anywhere to go, either.

Oh, and if anyone ever puts an online game on here, then a keyboard would be very nice for chat.

 

[indrema]

The N64 comes to mind. The were games that used the D-pad, & games that used the analog stick, but not at the same time. Since both were used at different times, however, the N64 had to include both.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't you still run into problems using an "on-screen" keyboard playing games like Police Quest, that was mentioned earlier? You type every command. You could just keep the keyboard up all the time. You may think these games are lame, so do I, but I think the physical keyboard is there to play these types of games.

 

[Chip]

There are no games that will likely run on the Pandora where both the keyboard and the game controls will be used in any significant way, (IE other than typing in your name for the save state, or the high score, or whatever). For people who want a game system only, (which is what the OP was describing), the keyboard just gets in the way.

And if Pandora were "just" a game system, that would be a valid argument. If the Pandora were "just" another followup to the GP32 / GP2x, then a full keyboard wouldn't be necessary.

As we all know, the Pandora is not just a game system. The people designing it have enough vision to see that by adding a keyboard and wifi and as much general purpose processing power as a full desktop system from a few years ago, they can make a system that is great for games and a heck of a lot more.

True, you could make due with an on-screen keyboard. You could also make due with only two face buttons (the GP32 did), or a lower resolution screen, or no wireless connectivity. But if given the option between less functionality and more functionality, it's really no choice at all. Four face buttons are always better than two. Wireless is always more convenient than wired. A physical keyboard is always better than an on-screen one.

Luckily, this whole thread is meaningless. The designers have already made the right decision and we're going to get the best handheld possible. If you would prefer something that is just a game system, then Sony and Nintendo would be more than happy to sell you one.

 

[atomicthumbs]

The Pandora ought to be like this, so that everybody can afford one: