Pandora In Education

[Sugar_Kane]

You don't fire the guy who shows you how to work your computer.

Unfortunately I was made redundant from my CAD job in a civil and structural engineers about a year ago, and my knowledge of computers didn't save me. Actually, they had appointed one of the other guys as their 'tech man' and when we had a meeting and it was proposed that the shitty old computer I was using needed more ram, I mentioned that I would check what kind we needed to get and he chimed in with '.. it's just DDR isn't it?', I stated that you still need to be sure of using the right bus speed etc and was met with a blank stare. Sometimes nothing can save you.

I think that although Linux should be paraded around to show off it's creamy thighs as an alternative to the steroid buffed, fake tanned hoofs of windows, there is a massive reason why schools teach everything using microsoft applications, and that is that the majority of employers use those packages. It's all very well teaching the kids about alternative operating systems, but when it comes to job time for most of them they will need to be literate in most microsoft applications or they won't even make an interview.

 

[WizardStan]

Your average 14 year old has the exact same argument as you had. It cant run game X, and sticks to Windows. If it was a valid argument then, it's a valid argument now.

With liveCDs, dual booting, and Wine, that is no longer a valid excuse not to at least try it. 15 years ago, if I had wanted to try Linux, I would have had to backup my hard drive somehow, format and install some build of linux which I would have pretty much had to do myself (or get a friend to help with), and hope I like it or I'd have to format and reinstall DOS again.
Today: download and burn ISO, reboot computer, play around with it. Don't like it, just remove the CD and reboot.

 

[levi1123]

Ah who am I kidding, keep them with Windows.. It keeps my job security safe and sound.

I agree with that statement completely =P

 

[Jourdy288]

I think the Pandora would really shine for F/OSS education, imagine how thrilled students would be- getting a Pandora after taking what was supposed to be the 'nerds' class
IDK, I'm homeschooled and haven't much clue about what kind of nerdy classes they do have. Nonetheless, a Pandora would be a pretty big help to me (as a student). For starters, when I want to bring a laptop for work on the go, I have to pull out this bag, shove it in, and it's always a hassle to pull it out somewhere, get the thing out of the car, recharging, etc. Now imagine a Pandora in that spot. My bag would probably be freer (in a few senses of the word), I'd be able to have my work right there on my Palm palm (I have to stop referring to my Palm Tungsten T|5) and quite importantly, when it's time to go, I can simply get up and go, not having to worry about packing the laptop back in and such.
And that's just for starters. Imagine working on it... *CUE DARK CHEST OF WONDERS*


This should be our theme song, BTW, Dark Chest of Wonders.

 

[gp32rich]

What you're forgetting is that most teachers have to teach to a curriculum and only show interest if the student shows an interest.
Time is limited for going down other avanues unless the teacher has planned in advance (i.e. pestered by a student)

In my local learning establishment Win PCs are used in the ICT/BCS classes & Macs in Music. The school servers are Win

This is because the examining boards expect students to have expertise in these and until there is time built into the curriculum for 'niche' OS & apps they will stay niche.

I'm guessing iStuff may make it onto a future exam but that says more about what standard the exam writers are aiming at.


I don't think there will be anyone on here able to give a non-nerd viewpoint. Go ask your (non-nerd/gender unspecific/relation - aunts are usually good subjects) what they think of Linux.

 

[Aninhumer]

I don't believe the Pandora would be an appropriate device for education.
A Linux based netbook would be a much better choice in that regard, due to having a larger screen and keyboard.

On the subject of Windows vs. Linux in schools, it largely depends what you're trying to do with the computers.
If you're giving them training on how to use office software, while the Open Source competition is reasonably good, the simple fact is that it's not used in most business environments. Teaching kids to use OpenOffice would be much less useful to them than MS Office.

However, if you're just using computers to give them access to the internet, and to allow them to write up essays etc. Linux is perfectly good, and would save a great deal of money.

 

[Shaun]

I don't think there will be anyone on here able to give a non-nerd viewpoint. Go ask your (non-nerd/gender unspecific/relation - aunts are usually good subjects) what they think of Linux.

This. I was trying to get my point across looking at the perspective of the general population. But with this being an "open source entertainment" board, naturally the bias is palpable.

 

[Jeffery Mewtamer]

In general, I feel that technology should enrich education not undermine it. Depending on how it is used, the Pandora is capable of doing either.

I favor Linux and FOSS in general for the primary in school computer labs.

In my experience, Linux systems are easier to "idiot-proof" when it comes to non-technical users, and any distractions bundled with the distro of choice are easily removed. Installing unapproved software is much more difficult in Linux compared to Windows.

Economically, it would free schools from the burden of licensing fees and superficial hardware upgrades in order to run current software.

Also, if students have actually been taught Computer Applications rather than a specific set of software, the change should be no more jarring than going from one version to another. Being forced to use Microsoft Office 2007 on college computers was far more disorienting than the transition from Office XP to OpenOffice.org 1.2.

 

[VRAndy]

I don't think there will be anyone on here able to give a non-nerd viewpoint. Go ask your (non-nerd/gender unspecific/relation - aunts are usually good subjects) what they think of Linux.

This. I was trying to get my point across looking at the perspective of the general population. But with this being an "open source entertainment" board, naturally the bias is palpable.

Then ask them what they think of Trigonometry. Or any other subject taught in school.


Besides, if people don't know about it, that's a point in favor of teaching them. The point is to expose them to things they probably won't learn on their own.

Teaching kids to use OpenOffice would be much less useful to them than MS Office.

If you're just teaching the kids to memorize where the menu options for changing the font size is then you might as well not bother. Microsoft will have changed it by the time they graduate.

Teaching students to use one particular piece of software is almost worthless. I'd much rather students be taught about interacting with computers in general. There's a reason so many people call the "Geek Squad" and hand over surprisingly big bucks for problems so simple they could be solved with the Xkcd Tech Support Flowchart.

 

[Pleng]

Your average 14 year old has the exact same argument as you had. It cant run game X, and sticks to Windows. If it was a valid argument then, it's a valid argument now.

With liveCDs, dual booting, and Wine, that is no longer a valid excuse not to at least try it. 15 years ago, if I had wanted to try Linux, I would have had to backup my hard drive somehow, format and install some build of linux which I would have pretty much had to do myself (or get a friend to help with), and hope I like it or I'd have to format and reinstall DOS again.
Today: download and burn ISO, reboot computer, play around with it. Don't like it, just remove the CD and reboot.

Most people don't try things just for the sake of trying them. There needs to be some need for change. If they're happy with a Windows system there's no need for them to download a live CD and reboot into an alternative OS.

 

[WizardStan]

Most people don't try things just for the sake of trying them. There needs to be some need for change. If they're happy with a Windows system there's no need for them to download a live CD and reboot into an alternative OS.

The point was that I was just briefly introduced to Linux way back in high school and really wanted to investigate it further, but due to the huge startup barrier this was almost impossible (or would have been a lot of trouble).
Now a days, that barrier is non-existent. Anywho who is briefly introduced to Linux can then followup for the low low cost of a CD and an afternoon. High Schools still have computer classes, just take one class every year (not even an entire one, just half an hour) to have a "specialist" in to give an introduction to Unix. Wrap it into a "history of computing" lesson or something. Include early Unixes and why they were important, other systems like Amiga and OS2/Warp, wrap it up with Windows and Linux, and the pros and cons of both open and closed systems. Anyone that is interested (as I was) can then very easily continue their own education on the subject at home.

 

[paulguy]

Yeah, I'm really surprised some people just have no common sense or ability to kinda figure stuff out to the point where just a slight thing being moved makes them completely unable to use an application. I mean, when I was 8 or 9 and we went from AOL to a plain ISP, the change from the AOL browser to plain IE was pretty much unnoticeable, but some people would be rendered unable to use the internet at all with such a change (though in this case, it was a definite improvement! ).

Sometimes it seems like when some people see just a basic interface, all they see is weird shapes and squiggles... but I've pretty much always been able to derive meaning from this stuff. Or they just turn their brain off and don't even try, or even attempt to listen to you, this is what I hate the most because it's pretty much willing ignorance and frustrating when the person asked for your help to begin with.

 

[mindlord]

Yeah, I'm really surprised some people just have no common sense or ability to kinda figure stuff out to the point where just a slight thing being moved makes them completely unable to use an application. I mean, when I was 8 or 9 and we went from AOL to a plain ISP, the change from the AOL browser to plain IE was pretty much unnoticeable, but some people would be rendered unable to use the internet at all with such a change (though in this case, it was a definite improvement! ).

Sometimes it seems like when some people see just a basic interface, all they see is weird shapes and squiggles... but I've pretty much always been able to derive meaning from this stuff. Or they just turn their brain off and don't even try, or even attempt to listen to you, this is what I hate the most because it's pretty much willing ignorance and frustrating when the person asked for your help to begin with.

I hear you... God forbid you ask those same people to look for a specific sequence of words and then click on them. I'm a ISP tech support person, btw.

 

[second exodous]

Nothing is better for school than a windows based laptop, period.

I find it sad that this was the second post. All that is important is the student knows how to use what they have to study with, if they can lean to use windows/OSX/Linux/whatever better then so be it. I know a few people that moved from Windows, that they used their entire life, to a Mac and it was just better for them and they got way more from using a Mac for study than a windows PC.

Everyone is different, locking them into one choice is a bad idea. Most people can learn basic computer use from any modern OS and move later. If your school uses windows that doesn't mean you need to go out to buy a windows laptop, just get what will be good for you.

The above people I mentioned never had really used a Mac, they just saw someone using one and asked questions. They still use windows at work but for them they study on Macs. The above quote is incorrect because everyone is different. I've heard some people that started using Linux on their school computers just to get rid of distractions, that makes Linux better than windows for them.

 

[mindlord]

I either have drank the Linux Kool-Aid or my job has jaded me, but I seriously think that if peoples first experience with computing was a well put together Linux distro, like Ubuntu. People would be so much happier with their computers in general. So many first time computer users go through so much growing pains because of Windows' pitfalls. Viruses, Spyware, Internet Explorer, Outlook Express. The Virus scanner scams (Yes, I mean Norton 360 and McAffee Internet Security), and the general Microsoft pay to play model. Old people in particular would benefit from something simple like Ubuntu. Provided this one point all the hardware works out of the box. I really believe that Linux is a great OS for total newbs.

 

[gp32rich]

I don't think there will be anyone on here able to give a non-nerd viewpoint. Go ask your (non-nerd/gender unspecific/relation - aunts are usually good subjects) what they think of Linux.

This. I was trying to get my point across looking at the perspective of the general population. But with this being an "open source entertainment" board, naturally the bias is palpable.

Then ask them what they think of Trigonometry. Or any other subject taught in school.


Besides, if people don't know about it, that's a point in favor of teaching them. The point is to expose them to things they probably won't learn on their own.

Teaching kids to use OpenOffice would be much less useful to them than MS Office.

If you're just teaching the kids to memorize where the menu options for changing the font size is then you might as well not bother. Microsoft will have changed it by the time they graduate.

Teaching students to use one particular piece of software is almost worthless. I'd much rather students be taught about interacting with computers in general. There's a reason so many people call the "Geek Squad" and hand over surprisingly big bucks for problems so simple they could be solved with the Xkcd Tech Support Flowchart.

You live in a utopian world where teachers don't have exams to target, grades to coax from their students, and have time to explore avenues.
School is now more about reaching targets for pass rates than producing good, useful citizens.
Exam boards set papers that have straight unambiguous answers that require a focused set of skills. Computer labs have to be standardised so as not to throw students when sitting the exam.

Students are tools used to enhance a schools reputation by passing exams.

There are rare teachers that a) have the time, 2) have the interest in their subject and lastly) have not had their enthusiasm stifled by a system that produces automatons.
But they are rare and are usually burned out by trying to do too much in their first few years.

 

[andyB911]

Do you believe that the Pandora can be a valuable tool for education, Inside and outside the classroom. Kindergarten through Collage and afterworlds.

I know its special, but can we take it with us, upstairs?

 

[overgauss]

The Pandora needs a docking station setup where a monitor and keyboard/mouse is attached to it. On the busride home you've started a report that needs to be finished. Just plug it into your dock finish the report, maybe edit an image or two, or add finishing touches to the title page and print her out.

While waiting in line for the movies you could hop on local wifi to send your lab partner an updated code snippet, or cruise the nets for backup information for your history report.

Or couple the Pandora with your TI Chronos brand wristwatch so that you can wow people with your gesture controlled robot during lab presentation.

Possibilities are really endless. I'm surprised to see people argue AGAINST the Pandora for education instead of FOR it. It can only increase the level of awesome associated with the device!

 

[VRAndy]

You live in a utopian world where teachers don't have exams to target, grades to coax from their students

I have no serious problem with standardized tests, grading, etc.
I'm just saying that those tests should not be stuck in the 70s and should include computer literacy. I'm also saying that memorizing the layout of Microsoft word would be a poor standard of computer literacy to enshrine in a standardized curriculum.

And finally, where do they give students computers for standardized tests. As far as I know the ones around here are still fill-in-the-circle jobs with short hand-written essay sections.

(The 'Special' students may get to use a computer under strict supervision, depending on how they are special.)

 

[VRAndy]

Do you believe that the Pandora can be a valuable tool for education, Inside and outside the classroom. Kindergarten through Collage and afterworlds.

I know its special, but can we take it with us, upstairs?

With all these delays it'd hardly be fair otherwise.