Our New Machine, Pandora

[three]

I'm liking the EEE PC mainly because we can nick its software and if we want to its interface

Given that the EEE PC can run Windows XP does that mean your upcoming handheld can run Windows XP as well?

`


The EEE uses has a x86 CPU and compatible hardware. Therefore it can run Windows XP natively.

The will only be able to run operating systems natively if they have support for ARM.

Craig said that he can use the EEE PC's 'interface' - I'm assuming he means the Linux operating system that came with it. Does that mean that you can install the same copy of Linux simultaneously on an x86 and ARM machine? (I do not know much about Linux).

`

 

[StealthBagel]

Omars-- these are looking nicer but like in say, Windows Explorer I'd strongly prefer to be able to see a real details view .... vertical text listing, tiny icons (if any at all), size, type perhaps date created/etc. Big icons are just a lot of clutter for me so I'd prefer to be able to turn them off. Maybe some people w/ less stuff on their SD cards will be OK with an icon view but that should be an option, not mandatory, for people like me who pack their cards to the brim.... and with say, an 8gb card I'd be using the device as a game, music and PDA machine so there would be a freaking LOT OF DATA on there so try and see so little of it at any given time....

also I think if you had an app running there like your "Web" screenshot the bars on top and the left side should vanish and be recalled by some user invoked event..... maybe tapping the screen border, there could be a tiny icon there you tap or something.

VERY IMPORANT to remember and I emphasize it so much because it's easy to forget looking at 800x480 images on a big pretty 19" LCD like right now.... 800x600 means everything will be even tinier than it already was on the gp2x display about twice as small actually, so while this all looks big clear and easy to see now it will be tiny and cramped so in a good GUI you must fight for every square millimeter of free space to work or play within... like that web browser you show, even in fullscreen it will be very little raw area to view even without the bars!

But I'm still a vocal advocate of X11 and a default Launcher for simplified use from the factory and more advanced users like me and most others on this forum who are OK with going off the beaten path can just launch whatever apps they wish with an option to disable the launcher running at startup.

 

[StealthBagel]

I'm liking the EEE PC mainly because we can nick its software and if we want to its interface smile.gif

That sounds like a great way to get into legal trouble really, really quickly..... also, x86 software on an ARM platform? That bit makes no sense.... and what happened to the Linux and X11 idea which you mentioned earlier. I liked that idea. The last thing any efficient handheld needs is an interface that's geared toward a PC with entirely different capabilities.

And besides...... what in common would a low-end laptop and a high end gaming/multimedia/communications handheld have in common? The EEE PC doesn't even have a touchscreen last I checked, controls are a keyboard and mouse, not analog and digital pads, shoulder buttons and the like.... using a PC interface for a handheld is probably about the worst thing that could be done GUI-wise.

Craig said that he can use the EEE PC's 'interface' - I'm assuming he means the Linux operating system that came with it. Does that mean that you can install the same copy of Linux simultaneously on an x86 and ARM machine? (I do not know much about Linux).

No, you can't since the kernel needs to be compiled for a particular processor architecture..... also you'd need drivers for all the hardware in the OMAP3430..... and if you were to just try and add modules to a kernel compiled for another platform you'd have loads of unnecessary drivers that are always inactive, wasted RAM, wasted boot time, the list goes on and on..... a handheld should have as streamlined and monolithic a kernel as possible with the smallest possible memory footprint and the least drivers to initialize at startup...

Hell, not that startup time matters that much-- the device should take a lesson from PDAs and only reset when a major software change is made or a fault occurs that requires it.... the rest of the time it should just go into a 'deep sleep' like hiberation with all RAM contents saved to NVRAM, extremely low power RAM, or if write speeds permit, SD card. With such capable hardware there's no reason there can't be instant power-on capability with a little insight. But I guess that's neither here nor there, I just felt like mentioning it for consideration...

 

[danboid]

I've not been on these boards for a while now and so I'm excited to see craiginator dev going full steam and causing two fat threads of excited speculation and suggestion with a possible release early next year! I've seen the wiki ( http://craiginator.bluwiki.com/ ) and I really like the sound of the design as it stands but the wiki doesn't answer two important questions I have

1 - What will be the CPU clock rate?

2 - (This is the REALLY important question, the make-or-break for me) The craiginator is set to feature a keyboard - great! - but is it going to be a clamshell design ala the Zaurus cxxxx / HTC Uni (which is the PERFECT style of design for a device like this) or is it going to yet another annoying slide-out UMPC waste of time? Everything I have heard about the c'nator sounds like a dream so far, but let me assure you that and I most of the other OESF members / Zaurus owners would be incredibly disappointed if you didn't adopt the massively neglected clamshell design, whose advantages include:

* Protects your screen

* Protects your keyboard

* Gives the keyboard and screen max surface area, no squashed up, half-assed keyboards (the Psion 5 keyboard is generally regarded as being the best PDA keyboard ever)

* Allows flexibility is screen positioning

* Makes it much more usable as a PDA / micro laptop

So basically, if you take the design of the Sharp Zaurus cxxxx but maybe increase the keyboard area to allow for a dpad + fire buttons, change the keyboard to one just near-as-damnit like the Psion 5s (maybe a different shape but same key type) whilst making sure it is easy to hold and you are onto a world dominating winner! There have been a whole host of PDA's released since the Zaurus c3000 in 2004, some featuring more powerful hardware but none have yet managed to cause any mass defection/ conversion of OESF members because of one or two recurrent reasons

a] They didn't have the clamshell design

b] didn't run Linux

Heed these words o' hardware devs!

(Sorry if these questions have already been covered but I don't have time to read the hundreds of pages in these c'nator threads)

 

[Squidge]

I think what Craig's thinking is that the EEE PC has the same resolution as the Craiginator, so we can let them do all the hard work, and then steal it all

and who knows, there Linux software base could be all GPL... So no processor issues then, just recompile

 

[Javacat]

The EEE desktop would be perfect as the standard user interface for this device. From what I can tell, it has an 'Easy mode' interface, designed for mobile devices and uses IceWM. It also provides the usual desktop interface , although this requires a hack. Lots of info available here.

There's a screenshot of the Easy mode here and an online 'demo' of it available here.

 

[danboid]

I just posted this to the 'Our New Machine' thread but looks like this thread is where all the c'n't'r (heh) action is! So please excuse the repost---

I've not been on these boards for a while now and so I'm excited to see craiginator dev going full steam and causing two fat threads of excited speculation and suggestion with a possible release early next year! I've seen the wiki ( http://craiginator.bluwiki.com/ ) and I really like the sound of the design as it stands but the wiki doesn't answer two important questions I have

1 - What will be the CPU clock rate?

2 - (This is the REALLY important question, the make-or-break for me) The craiginator is set to feature a keyboard - great! - but is it going to be a clamshell design ala the Zaurus cxxxx / HTC Uni (which is the PERFECT style of design for a device like this) or is it going to yet another annoying slide-out UMPC waste of time? Everything I have heard about the c'nator sounds like a dream so far, but let me assure you that and I most of the other OESF members / Zaurus owners would be incredibly disappointed if you didn't adopt the massively neglected clamshell design, whose advantages include:

* Protects your screen

* Protects your keyboard

* Gives the keyboard and screen max surface area, no squashed up, half-assed keyboards (the Psion 5 keyboard is generally regarded as being the best PDA keyboard ever)

* Allows flexibility in screen positioning

* Makes it much more usable as a PDA / micro laptop

So basically, if you take the design of the Sharp Zaurus cxxxx but maybe increase the keyboard area to allow for a dpad + fire buttons, change the keyboard to one just near-as-damnit like the Psion 5s (maybe a different shape but same key type) whilst making sure it is easy to hold and you are onto a world dominating winner! There have been a whole host of PDA's released since the Zaurus c3000 in 2004, some featuring more powerful hardware but none have yet managed to cause any mass defection/ conversion of OESF members because of one or two recurrent reasons

a] They didn't have the clamshell design

b] didn't run Linux

Heed these words o' hardware devs!

(Sorry if these questions have already been covered but I don't have time to read the hundreds of pages in these c'nator threads)

 

[craigix]

The good news is you're probably going to see the design in the next 7 days.

 

[danboid]

Cool - exciting stuff!

I take it you haven't given any firm details on either the clock speed or form factor then?

 

[craigix]

You can look up the CPU, the speeds it can handle are pretty well documented, but as well as cpu speed consider how powerful its other chips are too.

And yes, when I was talking about the EEE and its interface I meant exactly what Squidge said, and the EEE is all open source and at our resolution, we can just nick its stuff

 

[Tobriand]

Oooo.... 7 days . Ok, I'll take that to be a fortnight, but hey.

Just a note on the interface. A good way to get an idea is to zoom out of the page until the height of the image for interface x is the same as that of the GP2x screen, approcimately.

Trying this on the incredibly pretty EEE inteface (and most of the others proposed) produces something that, whilst it definitely works, gives the impression that it might be a little on the small side still. May need to make fonts a touch bigger to be comfortable...

 

[Alex.]

There's a screenshot of the Easy mode here and an online 'demo' of it available here.


That's a great design! Obviously reminds me of Gmenu2x, and that simply works so well on the GP2X!

Good luck with everything, I can't wait to see that design you've got under wraps

 

[kfuse]

Hmmm

I believe this is cassini's source code from their old and discontinued emu.

anyone think they pull this off?

oh and SSF runs full-speed on pc now

http://www.zophar.net/saturn.html

And the whole GUI...damn you really want that on a 3.5 inch screen??
I dunno I'm shuttin up about that gui...



That "source code" is just disassembly of GiriGiri. It's useless.


AH I see thats my fault sorry about that... d'oh X_X

 

[StealthBagel]

I would hope the EEE interface is at least something optimized then. I would really think something more barebones would be appropriate for a handheld, really, rather than something meant for a laptop. Especially a laptop with a much bigger display and no touchscreen functionality.....

 

[Firefox]

The good news is you're probably going to see the design in the next 7 days.

Woo-hoo! Can't wait!

 

[StealthBagel]

posted in the wrong place. Ignore please.

 

[X-Code]

Urgh!.. Mewanna see!... Urgh! :lol:

 

[Squidge]

I would hope the EEE interface is at least something optimized then. I would really think something more barebones would be appropriate for a handheld, really, rather than something meant for a laptop. Especially a laptop with a much bigger display and no touchscreen functionality.....

Ever thought that Craigix may be looking for an interface as a "stopgap" for developer/prototype machines/etc untill the proper one is ready?

 

[Tobriand]

Ever thought that Craigix may be looking for an interface as a "stopgap" for developer/prototype machines/etc untill the proper one is ready?

Didn't cross my mind, actually... thanks for throwing that one into the pool

 

[A_SN]

You can look up the CPU, the speeds it can handle are pretty well documented, but as well as cpu speed consider how powerful its other chips are too.

Actually it's pretty unclear, as we don't know which process will be chosen (but you should know) and actually the CPU speed of the OMAP 3430 is not well documented at all (I know that from extensively googling from it)