Nintendo 3DS

[DaMummy]

i say we try it out when at least 2 more people join us. 5 of us seems like a nice match

 

[Prometheus]

Alrighty, I added in the code.


WOW, this game looks like Nintendo put some thought into online funtionallity. I really wish they would put this much effort into all their games.


The WiiU needs to have a dedicated online community, and they need to make sure every game(1st party/3rd party games)has some for of online usage). Leader boards for basic games at least, and multiplayer online for any game that allows for more than one player. Nintendo needs to stop being lazy, and get off their high horse with this "lets all get together in the same room crap"! It is really getting old.


I grew up playing with friends in the same room, and many of those friends still play games on a regular basis. Sadly, many are in differant cities, and others are on the oppisite side of town. We can all play with each other anytime we want with almost any game on PC, 360, and PS3.


Nintendo just hates to not be the original idea creator, and often times just flat out refuse to go with the flow. This is how modern games are now played and experianced. If they want to compete in the next generation, they should follow what Microsoft has done, try to improve on the formula, and make it their own. But this idea they have that it is just not required is just silly.

Actually, games that can be played together is what sells, by far. Only eight games in the all-time best-selling top 50 even have any form of online functionality at all, in fact, and they're nowhere near the top with the big ones that can be played together.


I think it's more that Nintendo knows what actually sells, rather than not wanting to go with some flow that actually doesn't exist.

I can't wait for Vita, because I know every game that hase multiplayer will function online and have some form of leader boards. They will also have trophy/acheivments support. I'm not really that into the trophy thing, but several of my friends are. Nintendo just can't stand that this is something people want(and that some other company created it), and refuse to go along with the idea. I have heard all their reasons for not doing it, but it adds very little to production cost(if anything), and they just flat out refuse to give gamers what they want.

Gamers are a tiny, irrelevant niche. What sells is what people want.


It's a real shame that proper games get ruined with pithy little bits of text meant for giving constant praise for irrelevant, unimportant activities. It really brought down the tone in the otherwise excellent Mega Man 10, for example, to have that nonsense shoehorned into it... (If you ask me, beating a well-designed boss or stage is an achievement, not a bit of text that tells me some irrelevant bit of silliness. )


Again, it's not that they can't stand something or don't want to give people something - it's that most people don't care or don't want it, and they're aware of this fact.

Sorry for my long winded rant, but when I look at MK7, I can see so much potential, and then I put in every other 3DS game I own, and except for Street Fighter(which is awsome by the way), they all suck when it comes to online. Gamers and programmers demanded CD as a format years ago, and they didn't heed the warning and it cost them business. Now consumers demand basic functions, that have been around for years, and we really don't care who thought of the idea, but that they just work and need to be included with every new handheld or console from here on out(dual analog sticks, online functions for every game, Touch screen on handhelds, trophys/acheivements, ect.).


I love Nintendo to death, as there games are some of historys best, but boy can they be clueless somtimes!

They don't look particularly clueless to me - they most often seem to have a better idea of what sells than gamers do. Consumers aren't demanding functions like shoehorning online and "achievements" into everything - a tiny subset of gamers are.


Online functions aren't needed for every game (only games where they're appropriate even need them), most games that sell well don't have any at all, and shoehorning them into games where they don't belong just doesn't work - the same as with those "achievements" (quotes because that's not what they are at all, and I personally find it insulting that anyone should tell me that those things are achievements ).


Dual analogue sticks? I can't even think of many top-selling games that use them... (Again referring to the top 50 best-sellers of all time, only thirteen use dual stick controllers at all, and I'm pretty sure that they're optional in a few of those, and many of them are pretty niche titles with limited appeal due to their high age-ratings.)

 

[Jumpman]

Well, I'm not sure what the top 50 selling games are, but I'm sure ALL generations are included within that list right?


I'm sure many NES games are included when that system was the only major player worldwide at the time they where released. I'm sure Super Mario 3 is somewhere near the top. I can't compare online functionallity, and the beifits it brings to a time when it didn't exist.


Most of what I brought up is aimed at the current gen of consoles, and handhelds. Nintendo will always sell a ton of software to the masses, for the same reason a Disney/Pixar film wil always out gross a rated R movie.......Because they can be sold to a wider audience. Nintendo will always have million sellers from their repetive stable of games(zelda, mario, pokemon, ect), but I feel to be a true force in this industry, you need the Capcom, Konami, Squares, ect., and have them be able to sell millions as well, and that just doesn't happen due to Nintendo's one track mind. Square does it, but that is only due to the crazy fan base in Japan for their games.


If you look at the top 10 PS3/360 games(and some ios games), I believe almost all have some, if not all of these current options:dual analog, online support, and trophys/achievements, downloadable content, bug fixes, friend contacts, ect(just standard things in my opinion). Now I'm not saying this is right or wrong, I'm just saying this is the standard for Nintendo's major compettition. This is no longer 30 years ago when the only competition was from themselves. These things are not fads, but an industry standard for everyone but Nintendo.


I personally can't stand motion controls being added to games, when it doesn't improve the overall experiance, and the majority of Wii games just don't need them at all. I have stopped playing several games that ONLY allowed for motion controls, where other options would have work as well, or better. I hate that being forced on me, the same way others may not like the Acheivements and such. The same can be said for the 3D on the 3DS. Most people I know turn it off, and find it brings nothing extra to the table. I personally like it, but many don't. That's why it is good that they give you the option to turn it off.


I think it is all about choices. If a small segment of your consumers wants something, where is the harm in including it? Give an option to turn it off, just don't give me lame excuses on why something isn't included. Nintendo thought it was a good idea to release the 3DS at 250, and with no killer apps. Guess what? They where wrong.


Nintendo didn't do great with the N64 or the Gamecube, because they followed their own compass. Which is cool, that is one of the things I like about nintendo. I also liked the Virtual Boy, but that was another idea gone wrong. They are not pefect, and never have been.


In my opinion, the Wii was a curse and a blessing. It should have died from the start, which would have made them take a long hard look at what was being done in the industry, and at least released a system that is HD and online compliant. On the flip side, it was a run away success which gave them the abilty to inovate things like the 3DS and WiiU, which time will tell if these are good or bad long term. The WiiU has dual analog, Why? Because all the companies Nintendo want to makes games for it demand it. The same way they can no longer put off HD, it is a standard.


At the end of the day, I'm just looking for choices. If anyone doesn't personally like something, give differant options. Dual analog, touch screen, motion controls, mouse/keyboard. All of these options can be used for a first person shooter, why make a game that only supports one of these options? It's just bad business. Some like dual analog, while others like motion controls.


The same way Nintendo makes a game like mario Kart, that can be played by someone age 5-95, why not include options in games that appeal to EVERYONE(with the options to pick and choose what you don't want)?


Chris

 

[Prometheus]

If you look at the top 10 PS3/360 games(and some ios games), I believe almost all have some, if not all of these current options:dual analog, online support, and trophys/achievements, downloadable content, bug fixes, friend contacts, ect(just standard things in my opinion). Now I'm not saying this is right or wrong, I'm just saying this is the standard for Nintendo's major compettition. This is no longer 30 years ago when the only competition was from themselves. These things are not fads, but an industry standard for everyone but Nintendo.

I see what you mean, but I find it hard counting something on lesser-selling systems, that have sold less for good reason, as an industry standard, myself. The industry standard isn't set by what sells less, is my understanding.

I personally can't stand motion controls being added to games, when it doesn't improve the overall experiance, and the majority of Wii games just don't need them at all. I have stopped playing several games that ONLY allowed for motion controls, where other options would have work as well, or better. I hate that being forced on me, the same way others may not like the Acheivements and such. The same can be said for the 3D on the 3DS. Most people I know turn it off, and find it brings nothing extra to the table. I personally like it, but many don't. That's why it is good that they give you the option to turn it off.


I think it is all about choices. If a small segment of your consumers wants something, where is the harm in including it? Give an option to turn it off, just don't give me lame excuses on why something isn't included.

Completely agreed, it absolutely is all about choices.

Nintendo thought it was a good idea to release the 3DS at 250, and with no killer apps. Guess what? They where wrong.

Actually, they were right! I know a lot of gamers don't get why, though, but it seemed pretty obvious to me from the beginning. My understanding, from what I know of this sort of business, is that the pricing and early release may well have had something to do with coaxing Sony into selling the PSP2 at an enormous loss per unit ($40 to $50, I have read, or was it $60?). Business ninjas, or something.

Nintendo didn't do great with the N64 or the Gamecube, because they followed their own compass. Which is cool, that is one of the things I like about nintendo. I also liked the Virtual Boy, but that was another idea gone wrong. They are not pefect, and never have been.

True, though a lot of folks missed that, during the GameCube's time, it was more profitable than its rivals!


EDIT: Sorry for the late edit here, but didn't the GameCube and Xbox sell roughly the same? It's funny how the Xbox never turned a profit, but many who identify as gamers believe it was successful, yet the GameCube was very profitable but many who identify as gamers believe it was a "failure" and other such things. Press manipulation, perhaps? I don't know of any world in which making nothing but enormous losses could possibly be considered a success and being profitable could be considered a failure. (That's not to say that a product that makes these enormous losses can't get some things right in how it's implemented, but success is the wrong word for this.)

In my opinion, the Wii was a curse and a blessing. It should have died from the start, which would have made them take a long hard look at what was being done in the industry, and at least released a system that is HD and online compliant.

It was never going to die from the start, because *it was what people wanted* - I know that gamers really struggle with this fact, but the way it really was, and is, is that *nobody* cares about "power", "HD", "online compliance" or anything else -we want video games that are fun. It really is just that simple.


What was and is being done in the industry was and is an enormous problem that is hastening the medium's demise, and ignoring that was and is a VERY wise decision. There's a brilliant video on at least one aspect of that http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9joAb4XMaUs.


Everyone but gamers saw from the off what a massive success the Wii, and the DS before it, were going to be, because we see things in terms of fun and what that brings to our lives, rather than in terms of "power" and silly bits of text about trivialities. I only wish I could have afforded to buy some shares at the time - it would have made me a great deal of money! :lol:


What *should* have happened was that it made gamers realise "Oops, what we like isn't always what the rest of the world likes, but look at how many people are discovering the medium now - this can only be good for all of us!", but instead the result was the application of mass-shunning, pointless and disgraceful derision, and playground-style labels onto the people and games that didn't match their own tastes, and a quite frightening mass-delusion from this noisy minority that all of these multiple-millions of newcomers to the medium "aren't real" and that the games they enjoy "aren't real".

The WiiU has dual analog, Why? Because all the companies Nintendo want to makes games for it demand it. The same way they can no longer put off HD, it is a standard.

Agreed on HD, though it's had rather less of an impact in the UK because our pre-existing TV resolution doesn't look much different to HD anyway. It still hasn't impressed me, and probably never will, but that's just me.


However, the Wii also had dual-analogue available from day one. It's just one excuse after another from developers too entrenched in the mindset of the video I linked earlier - they'll find more, no doubt, and they're heading for a fall. (Meanwhile, I shall watch with no surprise whatsoever when developers like Capcom go under - the route of "the industry" hasn't done them well at all, with profits down 49% and earnings down 28% this year alone, and I would bank on them being gone within the next couple of years if they can't turn it around by bothering to make and release games that will sell. I only hope that Keiji Inafune's company can regain the rights to the games he created and he's known to still care to see treated well.)

At the end of the day, I'm just looking for choices. If anyone doesn't personally like something, give differant options. Dual analog, touch screen, motion controls, mouse/keyboard. All of these options can be used for a first person shooter, why make a game that only supports one of these options? It's just bad business. Some like dual analog, while others like motion controls.


The same way Nintendo makes a game like mario Kart, that can be played by someone age 5-95, why not include options in games that appeal to EVERYONE(with the options to pick and choose what you don't want)?

Totally agreed.

 

[Exophase]

Actually, they were right! I know a lot of gamers don't get why, though, but it seemed pretty obvious to me from the beginning. My understanding, from what I know of this sort of business, is that the pricing and early release may well have had something to do with coaxing Sony into selling the PSP2 at an enormous loss per unit ($40 to $50, I have read, or was it $60?). Business ninjas, or something.

Nintendo benefits less the lower Sony prices their consoles, regardless of what kind of loss they take. That is, unless Nintendo thinks Sony is going to pull a Sega by selling at bigger losses than they can really realistically afford. By releasing 3DS at $250 a lot of people compared it to the Vita and felt 3DS was at a ripoff price. If anything Nintendo probably wasn't prepared for Sony's price announcements, exact opposite of them trying to cause it. And they either reacted slowly or didn't take the threat seriously. The 3DS price drop came much earlier in a console's life than is normal. If this was some business tactic I'm not seeing what it bought them and it makes their apology look awfully disingenuous.

 

[Prometheus]

Like I said, it's just my understanding of what it could've been. (About price-drops, I've seen earlier price drops before, though region-specific.)


It just makes much more sense to me than "The company is lazy and/or stupid.", which is the gist of almost all other comments I've seen on it. They've been around for an incredibly long time, and sloth and/or stupidity just don't strike me as realistic explanations in the face of that and their market-leading position.

 

[Exophase]

Nintendo didn't price 3DS at $250 because they're lazy or stupid. They priced it at that because they thought it would sell at that. They were wrong. Call it a dose of humility.

 

[Prometheus]

Fair point. Humility or no, though, it did sell well over 4 million at that price, and gained momentum faster than the DS did (EDIT: I should clarify, the whole point of mentioning this is because the DS had a slow start itself), in spite of having none of the advantages that the DS had.

 

[Exophase]

DS's success is probably why Nintendo thought it'd be okay. They changed their mind. Just because DS started off poorly and recovered doesn't mean that neither it nor 3DS did nothing wrong.

 

[Prometheus]

Can't argue with that.

 

[Mr_Loon]

Been having loads of fun with the 3DS of late.


MK7 is probably my favourite Mario Kart, when it comes down to multiplayer racing.


The GBA ambassador games seem pretty well chosen, not sure why, but I'm finding Wario Ware strangely enjoyable.


But the biggest plus to me of late is that Nintendo seem to have woken up relating to the competition over price that Apple / Android bring to the handheld market for 'premium' downloadable game content.


I picked up Zen Pinball 3D & Pullblox and still had a bit of change from £10. Both are great games that make excellent use of the 3D, I'd really recommend Zen pinball to any fan of video (or indeed real) pinball, all 4 tables are superb & the online hiscore side of things is all present and correct.

 

[Jumpman]

Wario Ware is excellent, and one of my personal all time Nintendo greats. I have actually played thru it completely on the Pandora, and it never gets old.


If anyone ever gets the chance, I recomend Wario Ware Twisted, as it is motion controls done right, and on the GBA no less. Sadly, you can't play it unless you have the original cart, as there is a gyroscope built in, but I personally find it more enjoyable than the original(and I found the original just about a perfect game).


Chris

 

[Prometheus]

MK7 is probably my favourite Mario Kart, when it comes down to multiplayer racing.

I think it's my favourite of the whole lot!

The GBA ambassador games seem pretty well chosen, not sure why, but I'm finding Wario Ware strangely enjoyable.

Pick! Throw! Post!

I picked up Zen Pinball 3D & Pullblox and still had a bit of change from £10. Both are great games that make excellent use of the 3D, I'd really recommend Zen pinball to any fan of video (or indeed real) pinball, all 4 tables are superb & the online hiscore side of things is all present and correct.

Have you made any stages in Pullblox yet? I've been gathering up some excellent ones from all over the place - check out some of these, for example (there are some Mega Man ones in there - how do you think I found it? ).


We really need an "Official Pullblox Levels Thread", or something...

Wario Ware is excellent, and one of my personal all time Nintendo greats. I have actually played thru it completely on the Pandora, and it never gets old.

I love it. I had it at its original launch, and it's STILL never gotten old.


Worthy of note for anyone who might have been considering grabbing the DSiWare versions of Pyoro and Paper Plane: If you're an Ambassador, don't bother. They're available in WarioWare, along with Dr. Wario, if memory serves. (This doesn't help, or bother, me, as I bought them back when I had a DSi, and have long since transferred them to my 3DS, but for anyone else, take heed. )

If anyone ever gets the chance, I recomend Wario Ware Twisted, as it is motion controls done right, and on the GBA no less. Sadly, you can't play it unless you have the original cart, as there is a gyroscope built in, but I personally find it more enjoyable than the original(and I found the original just about a perfect game).

There's a sad story about this one, in Europe... It either never got released here, or was so heavily delayed that only small numbers ever became available (it's really hard to ascertain exactly what happened, thus its story has passed into legend ) - the same is true of Yoshi's Universal Gravitation (which I think was renamed "Yoshi Topsy Turvy" for North America), as well. It was due to the gyroscope in the cartridge falling foul of EU regulations for mercury...


The best chance for it to actually get released here would be for it to become available on the 3DS and take advantage of the system's gyros.

 

[Jumpman]

Sorry to hear about twisted and topsy in the UK. I don't remember topsy being all that great, but twisted was AWESOME. Technically UK residence can import from US right? All GBA games work worldwide right?


Yeah, it would be nice if they add it to the 3DS downloads at some point. I rebought twisted a few years ago, but have never opened it, since I no longer have a GBA. I do have a DS with a GBA slot, but it has been retired as well.


So putting twisted on the 3DS at some point would insure another purchase for sure. This is another request which I'm sure it will take Nintendo years to bring to market, if ever. I would also like to see some Virtual Boy games released at some point as well, but I'm not holding my breath for any of these. Although Nintendo would just be making free money to release all these games(for the most part), but I'm sure it won't happen, as they are clueless when it comes to what fans really want(Pikman, Mother, Starfox, Punchout). Sadly, these games aren't million sellers, but they are damn fine games that hold up well in any generation.


Chris

 

[Prometheus]

On the Virtual Boy front, that's been under consideration for quite some time, so it might actually stand a chance of happening. They never released the hardware here, so I'd be very interested in this, myself.

 

[Jumpman]

The Virtual Boy was a really nice experiment, and deserved better than it got.


Sadly, at the end of the day, it was doomed from the start. I would recomend it to anyone who enjoys something a little differant, and they can be found very cheap on Ebay.


I've seen that interview with Miyamoto before, and it really wouldn't take much for Nintendo to release those games, but I have heard that song and dance before.


I think it would be nice for no other reason than to show a nice piece of gaming history, and to show how Nintendo likes to inovate.


Chris

 

[Exophase]

A good VB emulator will probably cost at least several tens of thousands of dollars to develop (my guess is over $100k). I'd say Nintendo would only do it if they thought they'd sell enough ROMs to justify the cost, but it might be overall small enough that they don't care that much either way.


I do have to say, emulating that console on the 3DS's hardware is far from a simple feat. Hats off to whoever manages it, if indeed someone manages it. On the other hand, the game library is so small that Nintendo might feel more comfortable porting the games straight. That'd be less technically demanding, but a ton of work in its own right.

 

[DaMummy]

*waits for mighty switch force review

 

[Prometheus]

I can't wait 'til I can buy it. I don't have the funds spare right now, alas.


Did anyone else pick up the Nintendo Letter Box (or, "Swapnote", as it's been renamed for North America) app? I'm amazed by how many reviews it already has, considering that it's been available for much less than a day at the time of writing. :lol:

 

[DaMummy]

I have, the only disappointing thing with swapnote is the lack of colored pencils


also, for anyone in USA, bestbuy.com has pilotwings and steel diver for $5 with free shipping each