How Much Proprietary Software In The Pandora?

[Rekcitok]

How much proprietary software will the Pandora have?

I know there were some old threads about the graphics driver, and it was determined that 3D acceleration would definitely require a closed-source kernel module. If I didn't want 3D acceleration, could I remove that kernel module? Would 2D graphics still work?

Is there any other proprietary software that will come with the Pandora? If so, is it necessary? What effect will there be if I delete it?

I'm just a little paranoid about security. I'd even rip open the processor, and check for hardware backdoors, if I had the resources. But I still want to play games, so I will probably have two operating systems, each on a different SD card. One will be trusted, but without 3D support, and the other will be less trusted, for gaming.

 

[craigix]

You'll only need that proprietary driver for 3D software. I don't see why you would not trust it though.

 

[kloplop321]

paranoid insecurity ...

Uh.. The software being used on the pandora will undoubtedly be tested by multiple members on this forum.. If you are afraid of losing data then why can't ou just back it up on an external device, like a computer. Secondly.. Are you as paranoid with closed source drivers from ATI and nVidia..?

 

[Tom`]

I'm not really sure what security issues there would be - remember, the graphics blob communicates via a free module, so it's not like you don't have control of it. Having a closed driver is bad for a lot of reasons (limited access to GPU features, impossibility of fixing bugs, etc.) but I don't think "security" is one of them...

 

[Elanzer]

I've heard rumors there are backdoors in the ARM processor architecture itself, but if sufficiently wrapped in tinfoil there is no way to access these backdoors.

 

[laurencevde]

A security issue in the 3D-driver WILL allow an app to gain root-access, as X is running as root... (BTW, that's also true for linux-desktops...)
Luckily, there's work going on to get X to run as non-root, but it requires KMS (kernel-mode-setting, X normally handles mode-setting, requiring direct hardware-access, that's moving to a kernel-driver) and stuff.

I'd also like to know exactly what parts of the driver are closed-source. Anything in the 2d-part? kernel-part of 3D? X-driver for 3D? openGL-ES-stack?

 

[Sphinxter]

I've heard rumors there are backdoors in the ARM processor architecture itself, but if sufficiently wrapped in tinfoil there is no way to access these backdoors.

Any references for those?

 

[droneb]

why not cypher you OS and Firmware too?.

maybe also just take apart wifi usb bluetooth kill the serial and any other external output. leaving just the display and the keyboard?.

thats because you will end up with a big brick .

by the way is much more easy to find exploits on an open source systen than on a closed one. because of the full awareness over
the code structure. and usually no need to reverse-engineering

 

[Exophase]

If it's closed you immediately suspect it, but if it's open you implicitly trust it. Because you know someone could be reviewing it, but much of the time I bet no one is. Putting an exploit in an open source program could be a pretty effective way of hiding in plain sight. Open software is also easier to find exploits in, and even though these are fixed once they're discovered it still takes someone to trip over it first (which could very well happen by a real exploit being deployed). Sometimes fixes also don't make it into official distributions right away. Anyway, TI has a lot more to lose by allowing an exploit to persist in their code than random open source devs do.

 

[lulzfish]

Is the wireless driver closed too, or is the new one from Palm open?

 

[atomicthumbs]

nobody is going to hack into your pandora via the 3D driver. chill out.

 

[conso]

Is the wireless driver closed too, or is the new one from Palm open?

iirc, the current one is from android and open. the new one from palm is open, too.

 

[TrashyMG]

How much proprietary software will the Pandora have?

I know there were some old threads about the graphics driver, and it was determined that 3D acceleration would definitely require a closed-source kernel module. If I didn't want 3D acceleration, could I remove that kernel module? Would 2D graphics still work?

Is there any other proprietary software that will come with the Pandora? If so, is it necessary? What effect will there be if I delete it?

I'm just a little paranoid about security. I'd even rip open the processor, and check for hardware backdoors, if I had the resources. But I still want to play games, so I will probably have two operating systems, each on a different SD card. One will be trusted, but without 3D support, and the other will be less trusted, for gaming.

I'm mean seriously, what kind of things are you going to be doing on the Pandora that would warrant such paranoia. 3D Companies only want to protect themselves from there competitors.. it's a tough market.. not that I totally agree with that.. but they are not out to read your emails or send things to the goverment.. even so you can monitor net traffic.

 

[TLJRyan]

Is the concern here that you're worried some big company is going to find out you're playing pirated games? I'm all for being paranoid myself, but I'm not sure what sort of information people would be interested in getting off your Pandora.

Maybe just don't use credit cards on it?

 

[lulzfish]

Part of the concern is that closed drivers are more likely to be eventually abandoned by the company that wrote them, whereas open drivers can always be debugged and extended by the community.

It's not very likely that TI or PowerVR or the WLAN guys would put backdoors in their products, but they might put poor code in them, and it's better if we're allowed to fix it.

 

[Kramy]

Part of the concern is that closed drivers are more likely to be eventually abandoned by the company that wrote them, whereas open drivers can always be debugged and extended by the community.

It's not very likely that TI or PowerVR or the WLAN guys would put backdoors in their products, but they might put poor code in them, and it's better if we're allowed to fix it.

This is true. Today I discovered the Dlink DWL-610 wireless card (Wireless B ) Only works with Linksys routers in Wireless B Only mode - not Mixed B/G mode. Go figure. Works fine with DLink routers, though.

An open driver might fix that - but for Windows there isn't any.

 

[Creature XL]

It's not very likely that TI or PowerVR or the WLAN guys would put backdoors in their products, but they might put poor code in them, and it's better if we're allowed to fix it.

Yeah I know, we are all open source lovers and I might start a nice flame attack, however, I pas my experience over to you all:
I used to try out this UML Modeller (Umbrello). At first it was nice, then I started to use it more and realized it is just dumb. I tried to work around all the bad things and tried to live with it. However, after realising that I need thrice the time for making my diagrams and have to re-edit the generated code I spend 100EURO for Enterprise Architect and have maybe the best UML Modelling tool on my PC which runs PERFECTLY with Wine on my desktop.

And that is just ONE of many experience I had with OpenSource software.

 

[grasshoppir]

by the way is much more easy to find exploits on an open source systen than on a closed one. because of the full awareness over
the code structure. and usually no need to reverse-engineering

so thats why gnu/linux/bsd is popular on servers?

 

[kingoddball]

Does anyone plan on having "sensitive" information on their Pandora?
It just seems unnecessarily paranoid. I can't see TI or PowerVR doing it as stated above.


..................... Maybe Craig & ED

 

[TrashyMG]

It's not very likely that TI or PowerVR or the WLAN guys would put backdoors in their products, but they might put poor code in them, and it's better if we're allowed to fix it.

Yeah I know, we are all open source lovers and I might start a nice flame attack, however, I pas my experience over to you all:
I used to try out this UML Modeller (Umbrello). At first it was nice, then I started to use it more and realized it is just dumb. I tried to work around all the bad things and tried to live with it. However, after realising that I need thrice the time for making my diagrams and have to re-edit the generated code I spend 100EURO for Enterprise Architect and have maybe the best UML Modelling tool on my PC which runs PERFECTLY with Wine on my desktop.

And that is just ONE of many experience I had with OpenSource software.

And yet when I go to my Windows Box it feels like I can't do anything because I don't have what I need already installed.. it all evens out.