Open Source

[smagellan]

You will be able to recompile the kernel and still keep all existing functionality. Upgrading the kernel to a newer version should be possible too (as all proprietary modules should be independant of the kernel as the parts which compile into the kernel will be open source).

Hmmm... What about list of pandora proprietastal drivers?

 

[bigtruck]

Hmmm... What about list of pandora proprietastal drivers?

The proprietary blobs interface with the kernel through open-source modules, meaning they are independent of kernel version. This is similar to the way nvidia's linux drivers work.

Edit: I just realized I don't think I answered your question, but rather just repeated what Squidge said. Sorry, I just woke up. If you were asking which drivers are proprietary, the SGX driver is a blob and the wi-fi is as well, but I believe the Pandora developers get the source to the wi-fi blob, so if we asked them to make a change they could (I think).

 

[Squidge]

The list isn't definite yet, but the SGX and most likely Wifi/BT drivers will be closed source. Neither prevents you from updating your kernel to a later version.

Changes to the drivers MAY be permitted by request (depends on licensing, type of change, amount of people wanting said change, etc).

 

[_VWV_]

The list isn't definite yet, but the SGX and most likely Wifi/BT drivers will be closed source. Neither prevents you from updating your kernel to a later version.

Changes to the drivers MAY be permitted by request (depends on licensing, type of change, amount of people wanting said change, etc).

So, a 2.6.24 kernel will be available for cryptography freaks on the andora1: ? Great news!

 

[smagellan]

The list isn't definite yet, but the SGX and most likely Wifi/BT drivers will be closed source. Neither prevents you from updating your kernel to a later version.

Changes to the drivers MAY be permitted by request (depends on licensing, type of change, amount of people wanting said change, etc).

Anyway, I can not understand IC vendors(They are harder than whole Soviet Russia). If their's chips are so cool, why not to make it's interface public? Do they afraid of something?
I am not paranoid(just linuxoid), but I thunk if linux kernel have something proprietary inside, then it is not innocent linux kernel. But I am not against firmware(i.e some type of binary code uploadable into chip to make him work properly).

 

[Squidge]

They are usually afraid that if they make there interface public, people will copy there interface and then use there driver code with there own ICs. They would then be able to sell there ICs cheaper as not so much work has gone into the r&d side. Result is less profit for the company that put all the work in.

Linux kernel does not have anything proprietary inside, it is all open source. The closed source is in the libraries.

 

[AireTamStorm]

on linux it does.
It must suck to use an operating system that stops working when the newer version comes out.

Chad, first thing I'm probably going to do when I get mine is try to put a different kernel on it, for extended device driver support. I frequently update my desktop kernels, because the updates are worthwhile. What if I want to read from a filesystem with the support not included in the default kernel? Its not like the old version will "stop working", it will just not work with hardware that comes out later in its life. So we have this fancy 5G modem here... but the usbserial driver limits the speeds to like 900kbps (a known bug right now with current generation Sprint cards). The newer kernel has an updated module. I could build the module... or update the kernel while I'm at it and get the bonus of additional hardware support.

XP isn't a great example, because they really didn't update much, and no hardware is really designed with Vista in mind right now. There really isn't anything you can do with Vista that you cannot do with XP.. You can even see that people want to keep XP around longer due to its speed. Conceptually, XP => Vista isn't even an "update" really, it is a simple change in UI. In the case of Linux, updates usually mean faster, better, stronger. New code gets smaller, has more bugs worked out, and you get more features.

And how nVIDIA does it:

Kernel <=> Open Source Abstraction Layer <=> Binary Blob

This way, nVIDIA doesn't violate GPL and doesn't have to recompile the driver for every kernel version.

This topic is the one thing that really makes me wary... 100% open source is ideal in this scenario. So many things can go wrong with the community relying on a company to fix things.

 

[chad78]

Chad, first thing I'm probably going to do when I get mine is try to put a different kernel on it, for extended device driver support.

That's kinda presumptuous isn't it? Why would you just expect the Pandora to come out with an older kernel? If the thing is brand new - wouldn't you expect it to have the most up-to-date kernel?

It also seems pretty stupid to me that you have to update *THE KERNEL* to do something that should be covered by a driver! If a new device comes out that the Pandora can't run right off the bat - you should only have to install a driver to get it to work - not recompile the entire operating system with a new kernel.

If that's how Linux works - (and, I really don't think it is - I hope it's not) - it will *NEVER* become the most popular operating system.

 

[Squidge]

You can normally download and install a module to get the new device functionality, but sometimes those modules use features that are only available in a newer kernel, so you have to update that at the same time. If your knowledgable with device drivers, you can sometimes rewrite chunks of the driver code to get them to work on earlier versions. This can introduce strange bugs of course, and is certainly not recommended for people without C programming and linux kernel driver knowledge. It's the problem you get wrt open source.

The same thing happens with Windows to a much smaller degree - there are drivers which only work on Vista, meaning you have to upgrade your version of Windows to use the driver. In this case however, a driver for XP (f.ex) isn't far behind (and in some cases, comes before), as it's still the most popular OS.

 

[AireTamStorm]

Chad, first thing I'm probably going to do when I get mine is try to put a different kernel on it, for extended device driver support.

That's kinda presumptuous isn't it? Why would you just expect the Pandora to come out with an older kernel? If the thing is brand new - wouldn't you expect it to have the most up-to-date kernel?

It also seems pretty stupid to me that you have to update *THE KERNEL* to do something that should be covered by a driver! If a new device comes out that the Pandora can't run right off the bat - you should only have to install a driver to get it to work - not recompile the entire operating system with a new kernel.

If that's how Linux works - (and, I really don't think it is - I hope it's not) - it will *NEVER* become the most popular operating system.

I'm assuming at this point that the developers (while will port a very recent kernel) will compile the kernel without support for certain things, in order to increase the performance of the device. This is the norm for embedded devices, really. Like I said- you can simply compile an updated kernel module, but I like hacking things to do exactly what I want. You could most likely get away with installing an individual driver.

Usually in desktop distros, you update the distro, and the kernel is updated, giving you access to a boatload of newly supported hardware. That is what I'm aiming for. For instance, SuSE 10.1 didn't have support for PS3 SIXAXIS / DualShock 3 controllers. 10.3 did. (Kernel 2.6.22+) The way the PS3 controller talks is the same as any old joystick, but there is some extra authentication in the initial handshake. You could update the joydev driver, or alternatively, get a new kernel (that included it). Your choice.

Linux is becoming very popular recently... its faster, more secure, and any company that distributes it can customize it for their hardware.

Besides, while the Pandora will likely come packing the latest and greatest kernel, it doesn't mean that kernel will stay that way. I prefer to update everything, you can go fetch drivers. Neither way is wrong.