Center Click Vs More Travel

[Giskard1708]

As a longtime gamer who had his expectations for handheld gaming severely readjusted with the advent of the comparatively limited PSP nub, I would have to voice my opinion and state that we should be seeking maximum travel for the analog controls.

If 2mm is the maximum we can aspire to, then so be it, but if we are talking FPS gameplay like Quake, we probably want even more travel, either 2.5 or 3mm.

I'd be willing to shell out a hundred bucks right now on top of whatever final cost for my pandora, just to ensure I was getting the pinnacle of handheld quality. I know I'm not the only one. Call it an investment.

Although I voted for 2mm, I was thinking about 3mm the whole time.


Also, I thougt I might point this out: (Nifty Flash Demo)

Analog Capacitance Controller

FAQ for this product

I dont have an electrical or interface engineering degree, but this looks pretty slick. Apparently the actual sensor is separate, so you could design your own module. I'm unaware of how well a control such as this would work with a thumb, but I imagine an evaluation board can't be too expensive when its our games we're talking about.

Hmm after thoroughly reading the faq, it sounds like this type of sensor requires you to design the case around it. Oh well, maybe keep this in mind for Craiginator 2: Judgement Day.

 

[Tinnus]

Oh well. I hope the other buttons on the pandora are sufficiently clicky. There's nothing worse than a button with no tactile feedback!

Gotta love the iPhone for that! I just couldn't imagine me playing Sonic or something without tactile feedback.

 

[jbr]

Oh well. I hope the other buttons on the pandora are sufficiently clicky. There's nothing worse than a button with no tactile feedback!

Gotta love the iPhone for that! I just couldn't imagine me playing Sonic or something without tactile feedback.

iControlpad FTW!
Except for the whole case-gets-twice-as-fat thing...

Speaking of the iPhone, the capacitance-analogue thing reminded me that the pandora already has a touchscreen. If you want a "floaty" as opposed to a "clicky" feel, why not try to map an analogue control onto the touchscreen. Would that work? You could get as many mms of motion as you want that way, if 2 mms isn't enough.

 

[CronoTriggerfan]

I'd be willing to shell out a hundred bucks right now on top of whatever final cost for my pandora, just to ensure I was getting the pinnacle of handheld quality. I know I'm not the only one. Call it an investment.

Mmmhmm. Yeah. $430 for a handheld gaming console is totally a good price.

 

[chad78]

I found a laptop that seems "cool" however it does not seem to have the expandability that The Pandora will have

"Expandability"? What expandability? Can you add more RAM to the Pandora? Can you get a bigger hard drive for it? Can you install a better graphics card? Can you add an internal GPS chip? How about a 3G Card?

The only "Expandiblity" I see on the Pandora is by way of USB. And the Razorbook you pointed to has 3 of those ports. It doesn't seem to have BlueTooth - but you could use one of those 3 USB ports to add a BT module.

--- and for those asking who the click nub people are - *raises hand*

As someone more interested in UMPCing than gaming (and yes, ultra mobile personal computing is a perfectly good verb), the clicks make perfect sense for mouse clicks - you've even got a right and a left.

And if the GUI uses the shoulder buttons for navigation (like the GUI I mocked up - as well as a few of the other proposed GUIs I've seen on here did) - you can't use those for mouse clicks. Sure, you could tap the screen - but that only gives you one "mouse button" and doesn't make it easy to navigate without using the touchscreen.

You all need to stop thinking of the Pandora as a game system. It's not the GP3X. It's a handheld computer that happens to have gaming controls. It's not a PSP - it's a UMPC.

 

[chad78]

Mmmhmm. Yeah. $430 for a handheld gaming console is totally a good price.

360 Laptop? PS3p?

 

[ingrin]

As someone more interested in UMPCing than gaming (and yes, ultra mobile personal computing is a perfectly good verb), the clicks make perfect sense for mouse clicks - you've even got a right and a left.

And if the GUI uses the shoulder buttons for navigation (like the GUI I mocked up - as well as a few of the other proposed GUIs I've seen on here did) - you can't use those for mouse clicks. Sure, you could tap the screen - but that only gives you one "mouse button" and doesn't make it easy to navigate without using the screen.

Wouldn't the gamepad buttons (A&B or whatever is decided on) suffice for mouse clicks? I'm not familiar with your GUI, but I assume Navigation wasn't needing those buttons for anything.
Did you own a GP2x? Trust me, while the 'click' is nifty, it breaks easily. It broke on two Xbox Controllers I had, and unlike in those cases, you can't just replace the faulty controls. Your entire unit will just be damaged.
The more I think about it, this may actually be a godsend. Its far better to have a device with controls that do something simple and elagant than fancy but overly complex ones.

 

[waffles]

Mmmhmm. Yeah. $430 for a handheld gaming console is totally a good price.

360 Laptop? PS3p?

those aren't hand held.
also, i agree that a button press would easily replace stick clicking- its actually kinda a pain after a while.

 

[shmuck]

NOOOO!!!

Zodiac's analog was awful.

Zodiac's analog was inconsistent. I've got two Zodiacs and the analog is quite good on one and pretty bad on the other.

If the reliability could be addressed (it probably can't be) and if the thing could fit in the Pandora's housing (the Zod stick is somewhat tall, so this might be a concern) and if we could actually find the supplier (I did a quick search and came up with less than nothing), then I think that the Zod sticks would make for a good option.

It's at least something worth considering, and they do have stick-click.

 

[JerryG20]

I found a laptop that seems "cool" however it does not seem to have the expandability that The Pandora will have

"Expandability"? What expandability? Can you add more RAM to the Pandora? Can you get a bigger hard drive for it? Can you install a better graphics card? Can you add an internal GPS chip? How about a 3G Card?

The only "Expandiblity" I see on the Pandora is by way of USB. And the Razorbook you pointed to has 3 of those ports. It doesn't seem to have BlueTooth - but you could use one of those 3 USB ports to add a BT module.

--- and for those asking who the click nub people are - *raises hand*

As someone more interested in UMPCing than gaming (and yes, ultra mobile personal computing is a perfectly good verb), the clicks make perfect sense for mouse clicks - you've even got a right and a left.

And if the GUI uses the shoulder buttons for navigation (like the GUI I mocked up - as well as a few of the other proposed GUIs I've seen on here did) - you can't use those for mouse clicks. Sure, you could tap the screen - but that only gives you one "mouse button" and doesn't make it easy to navigate without using the touchscreen.

You all need to stop thinking of the Pandora as a game system. It's not the GP3X. It's a handheld computer that happens to have gaming controls. It's not a PSP - it's a UMPC.

The Pandora is more gaming oriented, though. Yes, we accept it as a UMPC, but it's more like a game system that happens to have capabilities as a handheld computer. As such, gaming applications will take much more weight when it comes to design decisions.

 

[CandidStan]

AFAIK, the only game that even required the analog sticks on PSX was monkey ball. I dont remember a single game that used stick click, and there is no way that they would require stick click when do not not force analogs! If you can find any PSX game that uses stick click, I would definitely rethink my argument.

Ape Escape

 

[crazedover]

I'd rather have it soon with high accuracy - anyone who wants centre click can add a small button into the nub, run tiny wires down into the case and solder to the spare L2/R2 I've seen on the PCB. You can alter the travel, but it would be far more difficult.

If we don't get the center click would we get L3/R3 solder pads so we can do this mod correctly?

 

[sold]

The original choice of analogue pads are flat, so i dont think the center click would be as fiddly as it is on the gp2x or playstation controllers etc. as they aren't raised up like they would be if it were a stick. The center click would be nice to have imo. There aren't going to be any l2/r2 buttons.

There are only 4 buttons on the right, and the keyboard may not be an ideal input for certain emulated games as you would need to move your hand too far away from the right analogue and action buttons.

Plus I dont think most buyers will want to open up the $300+ pandora and start adding ghetto button mods. It looks pretty cramped in there as it is.

Is there an analogue pad with 3mm travel and center click available as a replacement?

EDIT: Spelling.
EDIT2: This rocker button (or something like it) could be a good solution for replacing center click by adding an extra switch on the shoulder button.
http://www.potentiometers.com/j3R.cfm?sess...008061601563717

 

[atomicthumbs]

Do we really need a click? We already have 53 buttons, a D-pad, two analog nubs (type irrelevant for this comment), and a touchscreen.

I just want my Pandora. I don't think that 1mm of travel versus 2mm of travel would affect the controls that much.

 

[Snu]

what, we only get these two options?
what happened to 'lets wait for the best possible solution'?
frankly, this poll doesnt make sense, and both options suck...

i think of playing fps games, or flying games where you use both analog sticks at once... only having two buttons accessable would be horrible. and dont give me that 'the buttons are right under the nubs, just use those!', would take too long, the same as trying to switch between the nub and the abxy buttons.
and as for those who say they accidentally hit the center click, you can just disable the button mapping in the joystick driver.

off topic, i just looked at that razorbook400,
"Fits in the palm of your hand"
"Full size keyboard"
huh? someone must have REALLY big palms.
anyway, looks like more of an eeepc competitor than pandora competitor, its closer to that size, no gaming controls, no mentioned 3d acceleration, less battery, no touch screen.

 

[Esn]

I just want my Pandora. I don't think that 1mm of travel versus 2mm of travel would affect the controls that much.

1mm would be just 1/4th as responsive as 2mm, and 4/25th as responsive as the original 2.5mm.

 

[Kyo]

I want the pandora as gaming device, but I also want it as UMPC, which is one of the factors why I'm buying it. I want to be able to browse the web, watch movies, IM people and check my emails on the pandora. And for that, I need a mouse when I can't be bothered to use the touchscreen (i.e. when I'm somewhere where I can't really use the touchscreen due to enviromental... circumstances)
Therefore, I need a good replacement mouse, _A_ good replacement mouse, not two. Center click seems to be horrible in terms of durability, so I actually consider this (asides from the -0.5mm) a good thing.
Anyway, back to my point, the pandora has two analog nubs, but you certainly don't need more than one for your UMPCing, which means that you can a minimum of 6 other buttons without changing the way you're holding the pandora while doing whatever the hell you want. What was the problem again? because unless you're going to use two analog nubs, this should not affect you.

Addiotionally, I want the higher radius because if I use the analog nub as a mouse, I don't always want it to go fast or slow, I want to be able to choose. If you have a trackball, try only moving it slow or fast for a day (but not either, one of them), it will be hell for you, trust me. You _WANT_ the larger radius.

 

[crazedover]

The original choice of analogue pads are flat, so i dont think the center click would be as fiddly as it is on the gp2x or playstation controllers etc. as they aren't raised up like they would be if it were a stick. The center click would be nice to have imo. There aren't going to be any l2/r2 buttons.

There are only 4 buttons on the right, and the keyboard may not be an ideal input for certain emulated games as you would need to move your hand too far away from the right analogue and action buttons.

Plus I dont think most buyers will want to open up the $300+ pandora and start adding ghetto button mods. It looks pretty cramped in there as it is.

Is there an analogue pad with 3mm travel and center click available as a replacement?

EDIT: Spelling.
EDIT2: This rocker button (or something like it) could be a good solution for replacing center click by adding an extra switch on the shoulder button.
http://www.potentiometers.com/j3R.cfm?sess...008061601563717


There are already L2/R2 solder pads (amongst other solder pads) on the PCB for those who are inclined to mod their pandoras. I'm just wondering if the analog sticks don't have the click, will L3/R3 solder pads be included?

 

[shmuck]

EDIT2: This rocker button (or something like it) could be a good solution for replacing center click by adding an extra switch on the shoulder button.
http://www.potentiometers.com/j3R.cfm?sess...008061601563717


A rocker button is a good idea. Any rocker button, however, would have to sit fairly flush with the case to keep the thing pocketable. I'm picturing the ends of that rocker digging into my leg, and I'm not enjoying it.

If this can be done without adding to the delay, then great. Otherwise, screw it.

 

[Kyo]

indeed, it would be a really nice idea if we drop the two pointy nubs