To Go To School Or To Work First?

[A_SN]

I'm facing this dilemna and I need advice. I'm 20, my goal is to be a sys admin and my only diploma is the one you get at the end of high school, I've been in college studying CS but I dropped out. I have never had a job before, absolutely none.

Now I have two options :

1. Go to a school for adults and learn the job of sys admin for 26 weeks
2. Or do first something specific to France, it would consist of working in a company in computer maintenance and spend one week or two a month at school to be thought about noob shit like Word, Excel, HTML and VBA for at least 6 monthes and THEN do number 1

Here are the implications of my choice : if I choose to just do number 1, when I'll be out of school my only real world experience in companies would consist in internships of about 8 weeks, which means I'll have never worked before which might be a strong turn-off for potential employers.

If I choose number 2, although I'd learn some noob shit that I hate and that I'd do a lowly job paid 65% the normal wage, I'd be getting some more experience and also some money, and thanks to that experience I *guess* I'd find a job more easily...

So, should I sacrifice 6 monthes (or more, up to two years but I don't think it would happen) of my life learning stuff that I either already know or don't wanna know in order to gain some money (although I'd surely spend it all on living) and experience or should I go straight to the point and straight learn the job of sys admin despite the supposedly increased difficulty to find a job after I'm done?

Edit : number 1 could start in March, number 2 could only start when I'd find a company to work in, which I haven't found yet (and it's pretty damn hard to find anyways)

 

[Alex.]

I'm not qualified to give a proper answer, but my advice is for you to go with number 1. You're 20 years old, there's no chance in hell you won't be able to find a job especially right after finishing your education in that domain. I hate the very principle of Word courses and all that crap to begin with, that truly is wasting years of your life.

Out of curiosity, what made you drop CS?

- Alex

 

[A_SN]

I'm not qualified to give a proper answer, but my advice is for you to go with number 1. You're 20 years old, there's no chance in hell you won't be able to find a job especially right after finishing your education in that domain. I hate the very principle of Word courses and all that crap to begin with, that truly is wasting years of your life.

Out of curiosity, what made you drop CS?

- Alex

I tought that analyze, java, sql, pascal and all that crap they teached us sucked ass (except x86 ASM, that's the only thing I liked and I was good at). Plus I didn't do good, except in English. Back then I wasn't sure to want to work in IT, didn't really know what I wanted to do. As for programming, I hate the OOP and high level crap and love C and ASM (but that kind of stuff isn't fashionable anymore, and I don't wanna be a code monkey anyways, so sys admin sounds just fine)

Thanks a lot for your input

 

[hackgrid]

lol you have a very funny way to train a job in your country

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_education_system

 

[A_SN]

lol you have a very funny way to train a job in your country

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_education_system

lol what's so funny about it?

 

[hackgrid]

26 weeks to be a sysadm? heh ^^

 

[Mudi]

I'm going through CS classes now. The first semester was the BEST... they let me have some experience in ASM (a stripped down ASM known as LC-3 ASM, but it was still ASM) and low-level C. It was stuff that I was really good at.

The next couple semesters sucked... made me work in Java... I HATE Java.

Now it's getting better again. This semester I'm taking one course where I am required to use C++, and one course where they 'recommend' Java but allow me to use whatever I like, so long as I don't ask the TA's help with the other language (pfft, hahahahahahahah, they probably know less about Java than I do)

 

[A_SN]

lol, thanks everybody (besides Alex) for not answering the question it helps a lot

 

[Mudi]

Hehe, I think I'd choose #1, but I'm no expert at this important life decision stuff.

 

[rememberthe8bit]

but that kind of stuff isn't fashionable anymore

Bah! ASM and C roxxorz my soxxorz.

Anyways, yeah they have gon out of fasion, as companies move to more interpreted languages (as you said). That really sucks. Oh well, everybody but us embedded/home brew gaming/emulation types seems to like bloated crap. <_< :angry:

 

[A_SN]

Oh well, everybody but us embedded/home brew gaming/emulation types seems to like bloated crap. <_< :angry:

I agree. Fortunately it seems that in DSP jobs they're all about C or ASM (like when you program FPGA's and stuff, and even then, you can't afford to do mass (even real-time) treatment of information in Java), so I might look into that later on in my life.

But yeah, it seems that the other guys have decided that computers were now sufficiently powerful so we can allow ourselves bloatedness.

 

[clarky2o2o]

When i was at school my high school grades where very poor (compared to final middle school report). So i finished school at 16 Did governement training (nvq's etc) till i was 18 where I got a descenti ish job working for a newspaper. left that job 17th january this year So i can goto university in another country And get my Computer systems Baccalaureate.

My advice is work then school.

 

[Alex.]

but that kind of stuff isn't fashionable anymore

Bah! ASM and C roxxorz my soxxorz.

Anyways, yeah they have gon out of fasion, as companies move to more interpreted languages (as you said). That really sucks. Oh well, everybody but us embedded/home brew gaming/emulation types seems to like bloated crap. <_< :angry:

It seems that Java and Python are all the rage in cubicles these days. Bunch of fads and nothing more; this year I study Java, and while I like its C-like syntax, I can't really see its purpose, especially with C++ already properly developed. Oh well

- Alex

 

[sam fisher]

but that kind of stuff isn't fashionable anymore

Bah! ASM and C roxxorz my soxxorz.

Anyways, yeah they have gon out of fasion, as companies move to more interpreted languages (as you said). That really sucks. Oh well, everybody but us embedded/home brew gaming/emulation types seems to like bloated crap. <_< :angry:

It seems that Java and Python are all the rage in cubicles these days. Bunch of fads and nothing more; this year I study Java, and while I like its C-like syntax, I can't really see its purpose, especially with C++ already properly developed. Oh well

- Alex

I agree with you there.

 

[Blah]

Tough break man, I "learned" that "noob shit" as a sophomore and get credit for it. I guess I'm lucky. Wow, I've never thought of myself as lucky, rather the opposite.

Well, if I were you, I'd go to a real college if possible, otherwise I'd take the job.'

And Java does suck, Javascript even more (the unholy things they do with it).

Python isn't a fad though, its been around since '91 and I find it easier than C. Unfortunately the GP2X port sucks.

 

[telegramguy]

I'm facing this dilemna and I need advice. I'm 20, my goal is to be a sys admin and my only diploma is the one you get at the end of high school, I've been in college studying CS but I dropped out. I have never had a job before, absolutely none.

Edit : number 1 could start in March, number 2 could only start when I'd find a company to work in, which I haven't found yet (and it's pretty damn hard to find anyways)

I'm not sure what's available to you financially or geographically, but in the US/Canada many traditional universities have IS/MIS degrees that might suit you. It's like an option 3.

You don't have to go hardcore on the CS stuff that you wrote about that you don't like and get to study and play with infrastructure / sys admin type topics.

At 20 years old with some university credit already, you should seriously consider finishing with at least some sort of B.A. or B.S. degree. It's a small investment of time that will pay well in your 20's and on to your 30's. by the time you're in your 40's your work history will weigh substantially and few would care about your degree.

Until then, pick anything just so you can finish school. In the U.S. anyway, there are so many good sys admin jobs that you'll have no problems getting something good when you get out. You'll have opportunities that would simply not have presented itself. The worse part is that you'll never know it.

If I haven't sold you yet, having a degree will even make immigration into lots of countries (most Western and Eastern industrialized nations) much easier.

I haven't read this entire thread yet but I'm sure you'll read something about how so and so earns this and that and never had a college degree. ...you'll also read about how Bill Gates dropped out of school, etc. But the reality (again in N.America at least) is that the deck is stacked against you already. Get a degree and even the odds a little. Then when you get your sys admin job, the company will send you to $10's of thousands of dollars worth of training anyways.

 

[refractor]

I'm a manager in a software company. I've only ever hired one person who did not have a degree (or better), and that's because we were desperate for somebody who knew a particular language. My recommendation would be to get a degree.

Bunch of fads and nothing more; this year I study Java, and while I like its C-like syntax, I can't really see its purpose, especially with C++ already properly developed

Two words: garbage collection. Try writing a large, multi-coder, project in C++ without memory leaks, etc. It's hard. Now try it in a language with garbage collection (Java, C#, etc). It's easier, faster. and thus cheaper.

 

[Mudi]

Garbage collection is for wusses :lol:

Yeah there is that, but those languages will never be usable for certain things. C/C++ will still be important for the foreseeable future because you can write nearly anything with them.

 

[A_SN]

I'm a manager in a software company. I've only ever hired one person who did not have a degree (or better), and that's because we were desperate for somebody who knew a particular language. My recommendation would be to get a degree.

Well I'm getting the necessary degree no matter what, but to you does it really matter whether or not the candidate has had a professional experience? I'm just trying to determine whether or not I really need that prior experience.

 

[refractor]

Well I'm getting the necessary degree no matter what, but to you does it really matter whether or not the candidate has had a professional experience? I'm just trying to determine whether or not I really need that prior experience.

I have hired people straight out of Uni. about 80% of the time. They're cheaper, usually more pro-active, and easier to beat into shape than people who have been coding a long time. If they survive the interview then they're fine. Bear in mind that I'm a techie hiring techies, though, a standard HR department probably would want experience (because HR are idiots).

Right now the market is good for the employees. It's hard to find "good" people, so lots of places don't mind taking people fresh from Uni. Of course the market changes, but I suspect it will be good for a little while yet.