Retro VGS indiegogo campaign. (changed title)


levi said:
And I also wonder what they mean by 16-bit. There are still a few 16-bit address width and accumulator processors you can pick up, but I doubt those would run SNES roms well at all. I suppose if you ran an ARM chip exclusively in Thumb mode you might be able to wangle that as being 16-bit. Or it might be simply describing the graphics as 16-bit-like in their appearance, and I suppose it would be hard for a 68000 to fill a full-HD screen, but i wasn't keen on those borders at that point. A bit of scaling there would have been nice.
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I got on the nD's case for this too. They were using a 32-bit CPU, in an ARM9 SoC/microcontroller to be precise. When I pressed Bob for justification he said it was because he sourced a screen that used 16-bits per pixel. The real reason was obvious though, and it was simply that he was doing and expecting other people to do games that were reminiscent of games from the so-called 16-bit era of consoles.

It's not really worth getting too hung up on though, the consoles themselves used bit ratings very loosely for marketing.
 
It's seeming increasingly plausible that it was a real snes in the prototype that they showed at the toyfair, the cartridge connector is snes, the pads are snes, even the back cabling is reminiscent of the snes- they might have bluffed their prototype just to be able to exhibit at the show, if true, real dumb move.

If this story keeps gaining momentum it may subvert the planned kickstarter.
 
It looks like those SNES and Genesis games are all old Chinese games that Piko Interactive acquired and translated for release on new carts. So most likely the intention is to run these games off of Chameleon cartridges and not actual SNES or Genesis cartridges. But I guess they think that demonstrating them on an actual SNES is sufficient.
 
Jesus, would you give those guys a break? When this thing gets sold someone will open it up and if theres an SNES in there they will be sued out of excistance... Whats with the prototype demands Ive never heard this much upset people taking every detail apart and for what reason? They said they would present the hardware at the Kickstarter at 26th Feb. They also said it will be a ARM plus FPGA design, so I wonder if its lower spec or what they changed to get that much stuff in for such a low price... Only a week till the reveal of the spec anyway so we will see soon.
 
mjohansson said:
Jesus, would you give those guys a break? When this thing gets sold someone will open it up and if theres an SNES in there they will be sued out of excistance... Whats with the prototype demands Ive never heard this much upset people taking every detail apart and for what reason?
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If this bothers you I'd recommend staying far away from Atari Age ;)

I don't think anyone predicts they'll ship with an SNES inside, even if that were legal it's not exactly plausible. And it's one thing if they just don't have much to show still.. But demonstrating "their" hardware with an SNES underneath is kind of more than a minor detail! That's pretty misleading and IMO deserves at least some criticism. You could say that they've promised to run some selection of SNES games they got the rights to so they're really showing a representative demo because the console will be running those particular games anyway. And I'm sure that's the justification they use. But people also want to see that they've done work towards developing their own hardware and this makes it seem like they've done something they haven't.

They've shown a lineup of games and for the Colecovision and Intellivision ones they've clearly labeled the console they came from. Probably because it's a net positive if people are aware these are being emulated and not some kind of very low end new efforts. But the Piko games, those are just being presented as is without the SNES or Genesis labels.. and I'm guessing it's because they want people to think they're new games. They're really obscure old Chinese releases (with a lot of "inspired" assets) that have been recently translated and touched up to be sold to collectors going for the novelty of new SNES or Genesis carts. Trying to pass them off as new games - and I have no doubt that's what they're doing - is again something I'd consider misleading. Maybe to them it makes no difference anyway, who cares where the games came from? But it's going to make people think that there's developer interest in making new things for the system and that this is just the start of many titles.

mjohansson said:
They said they would present the hardware at the Kickstarter at 26th Feb. They also said it will be a ARM plus FPGA design, so I wonder if its lower spec or what they changed to get that much stuff in for such a low price... Only a week till the reveal of the spec anyway so we will see soon.
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I doubt they're going to keep the FPGA given the new much lower price point. They really don't need it to properly support this selection of old games and it's kind of nuts to get Genesis and SNES soft cores just to run these Piko games. That's assuming they could get them in the first place.
 
I see your point Exophase, I just feel people are overly suspicous, but mayby I dont know enough about hardware and how difficult it might be to put together to see the big deal about all this.

Exophase said:
I doubt they're going to keep the FPGA given the new much lower price point. They really don't need it to properly support this selection of old games and it's kind of nuts to get Genesis and SNES soft cores just to run these Piko games. That's assuming they could get them in the first place.
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Wich reminds me I think they said they had already written a new SNES or Genesis core for their FPGA, wich sounds like their planning on keeping it...
[doublepost=1455813370,1455812845][/doublepost]Im copying some Facebook posts:


den 13 februari kl 22:41 ·
When the time comes to launch the official Kickstarter for the Coleco Chameleon we will be posting pictures showing the actual PCB that will be used in production for the console. The console will be FPGA and ARM based. It will have HDMI video for sure and possibily composite if we can sort PAL issues, which will happen before launching the Kickstarter.
//#########################################################################################################################################
den 13 februari kl 21:54 ·
Eli From Piko Interactive stopped by with one of his boards, plugged in, running both Jim Power and Legend. We are running his games through our custom written SNES FPGA Core. He said they are playing flawlessly.
//#########################################################################################################################################
Kickstarter Reward #1 $135: 1500 Available. Early Bird Standard Retail Coleco Chameleon. Save 10%. Includes black Coleco Chameleon system, one Coleco Chameleon USB controller, HDMI cable, AC Adapter + the pack-in game.

To reiterate, we will be opening up the Chameleon for the Kickstarter campaign. Look for the next Kickstarter Reward tomorrow morning at 8:30 AM ET.
//#########################################################################################################################################
Kickstarter Reward #2 $150: Standard Retail Coleco Chameleon. Includes black Coleco Chameleon system, one Coleco Chameleon USB controller, HDMI cable, AC Adapter + the pack-in game.
//#########################################################################################################################################
Kickstarter Reward #3 $185: RPG LOVERS RETAIL BUNDLE. Includes black Coleco Chameleon video game system, one Coleco Chameleon USB controller, HDMI cable, AC adapter + the pack-in game + Piko Interactive's Battle Brave Saga game. Note, this bundle comes with two games, the pack-in game (yet to reveal) and Battle Brave Saga.

All games purchased as a part of this Kickstarter campaign will come in an exclusive campaign only cartridge color never to be produced again.
//#########################################################################################################################################
Kickstarter Reward #4 $185: PLATFORM LOVERS RETAIL BUNDLE. Includes black Coleco Chameleon video game system, one Coleco Chameleon USB controller, HDMI cable, AC adapter + the pack-in game + your choice of either Piko Interactive's Dorke & Ymp OR Collectorvision's Sydney Hunter and the Caverns of Death. Note, like the RPG Lovers Retail Bundle already mentioned, this comes with both the pack-in game (yet to reveal) AND the additional platforming game of your choice.

All games purchased as a part of this Kickstarter campaign will come in an exclusive campaign only cartridge color never to be produced again.
//#########################################################################################################################################
Kickstarter Reward #5 $210: BEAT-EM UP LOVERS RETAIL BUNDLE. Includes black Coleco Chameleon video game system, one Coleco Chameleon USB controller, HDMI cable, AC adapter + the pack-in game + your choice of either Piko Interactive's Iron Commando or LEGEND + one addition Coleco Chameleon USB controller -- Beat-em ups are best played with a friend.

Note, like the other Retail Bundles already mentioned, this comes with both the pack-in game (yet to reveal) AND the additional beat-em up game of your choice.

All games purchased as a part of this Kickstarter campaign will come in an exclusive campaign only cartridge color never to be produced again.
[doublepost=1455813718][/doublepost]
mjohansson said:
Eli From Piko Interactive stopped by with one of his boards, plugged in, running both Jim Power and Legend.
Click to expand...
Hmmm... with one of HIS boards, and plugged it in (to the Chameleon). If an outside company have boards, do they have a prototype system as well, or is it an SNES board?? Are SNES connectors some standard part you can pick up from somewere? Mayby its the real deal, a specific Chameleon parts, but it sounds strange dosnt it? Or is it me thats getting overly suspicous this time?
 
mjohansson said:
den 13 februari kl 21:54 ·
Eli From Piko Interactive stopped by with one of his boards, plugged in, running both Jim Power and Legend. We are running his games through our custom written SNES FPGA Core. He said they are playing flawlessly.
Click to expand...

If they're saying that this is what they demonstrated at Toy Fair then I don't believe it. There are too many signs that point to it being an SNES Jr inside the shell, not an FPGA with an SNES implementation.
 
The next sentence says they are running the games through an FGPA configured with a SNES simulation of some sort. So, not a real SNES if those statements are strictly true.

But it still seems to me quite a step from developing a SNES core to run on an FPGA and simulate SNES games, to being able to sell that for under 200 dollars. That's the only thing that makes me suspect that the units they sell must be running an emulator on ARM and not including the pricey FPGA part.

Edit: I assume that was a private demo at their offices. If it was a public demo they'd have been inviting people to see it.
 
http://www.retro-video-game-repair.com/products/72-62-pin-snes-connector-repair-item/

Its possible their using some stuff like this temporarily while devving the hardware, to be replaced with massproduced custom or off the shelf parts later on. And so it would just happen to be that an SNES board would fit the prototype machine but not necesarily the finnished design, and if its an FPGA inside capable of running an SNES core it dosnt seem to me like a big deal getting that going.
 
levi said:
The next sentence says they are running the games through an FGPA configured with a SNES simulation of some sort. So, not a real SNES if those statements are strictly true.

But it still seems to me quite a step from developing a SNES core to run on an FPGA and simulate SNES games, to being able to sell that for under 200 dollars. That's the only thing that makes me suspect that the units they sell must be running an emulator on ARM and not including the pricey FPGA part.

Edit: I assume that was a private demo at their offices. If it was a public demo they'd have been inviting people to see it.
Click to expand...

They showed something at Toy Fair, that was open to the public on the 13th and they had early pictures of their booth out on the 12th.

What they showed there a device using an SNES cartridge connector, SNES controllers hard wired to the inside, using a proprietary SNES composite cable. The size and placement of the ports perfectly match an SNES Jr PCB. If this isn't an actual SNES Jr then it's a fairly precise replica of one, which makes absolutely no sense even if they were making an actual SNES clone, which they aren't. It's almost definitely an SNES Jr.

If they gave another private demo with an FPGA board then it was different hardware, but why would they have such a thing ready at the same time? Why would that not be what they show in public where they'd be under scrutiny?

The said things like this on Facebook:

We are using aftermarket SNES controllers because the proto controller many of the options (Analog sticks) aren't working with these games at this time. It's easier to demo at this stage with the SNES controllers. The controller cables are currently hard wired into the prototype.
Click to expand...

Frankly, I think they're just straight up lying.
 

13 min in: OH MY GOD... I dont need to see any more, I will not comment on this anymore, why would they do something like this? When will people learn that lying dont do you no good, not in the long run anyway. This is low, no doubt is it an SNES inside, and they have started deleting comments on their Facebook page again, Im done.
 
From what I heard Mike (the main guy behind this) had to dip into his 401k savings to pay for the Jaguar mold.. so he must have no real other savings and that must have been a really big deal to him to get that mold. Maybe in his mind just having it is a big enough thing to keep showing off and he can basically fake the rest until he gets real money to do something. He's getting older and I guess could be really determined to follow his big dreams while he can.

Then he goes and buys the rights to the Coleco brand, which I'm guessing he had to dig deep to afford too. And a booth at Toy Fair which has got to be a few thousand - maybe worth it if it results in investors but I doubt that would happen, and in the end he just damaged the credibility of the project by deceiving people (in a way that was easy to catch) then lying about it or removing evidence to cover it up.

For a project in their position it seems like they're spending money on all the wrong things.

Frankly I think getting the Jaguar mold wasn't even worth the savings, there are so many downsides to using that... And I doubt having the Coleco branding helps him any tangible amount and I can actually see how it would hurt too. It all seems like an unfortunate situation..
 
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My guess is the pack-in title will be the Atari 2600 E.T. game. It fits with the narrative we have so far.
 
Yeah, mike and the guys will do their best to build the Coleco Chameleon, I believe that much; but now I have no faith that they are actually capable of doing so.
They still need a good pr guy.
 
I do hope those podcasters are wrong, because they suggest they haven't got any decent engineers left. If they've no engineers, that means all they are are bad pr guys :eek:

Our best hope is probably that the Atariage forums decide to sign a peace treaty and help out, if he hasn't completely melted that bridge already.
 
This just takes the price, a new image of the prototype? I dont even know what to say, why do they do this? Are they planning on just taking the money and run? Isnt this illegal, like if its an SNESjr inside their shell at the ToyFair I bet Nintendos laywers would have some things to say about it... CcbqbTMVAAAWGGC.jpg
 
Regardless they will try to produce an actual Chameleon (yes I cannot forget the irony in naming their console Chameleon)
I'm just doubting their reliability.
 
I was willing to believe that when they were showing their SNES fake at that toy fair - that was a prearranged date, and if their prototype wasn't ready then they had to knock something up. It wasn't good that their prototype wasn't ready, but forgivable. Now, off their own back they produce this picture of a Hauppage TV capture card in a jag case. Why, if there's a prototype (albeit an ugly one at this stage, I'd bet) would they lie like this?

It doesn't make any sense to me, unless there's no development going on behind this other than the development of lies. Very suspicious.
 
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