Out Of The Box

[basicmark]

I was under the impression that the s-video out was a completely separate video signal, and I'm pretty sure one of the devs (or at least someone with a dev board) mentioned that rendering 3d to TV-out would be problematic, at best, but I can't find the thread, so I may be mis-remembering that. This doesn't necessarily preclude mirroring the display to TV-out, but it would make it a lot more difficult. This thread goes into a little detail:

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http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?showtopic=46557&st=0&p=697598&#entry697598

I hope that actually links to the right thread. If it doesn't work try typing this into a google search:

site:gp32x.de tv-out separate

The fourth result down is the one I'm trying to link. These broken forums have become quite vexing.


Can't say I've tried it, but I see no reason why displaying 3D via TV-out is any different from displaying it on the LCD as in both cases the display controller is simply scanning the image out of RAM. The display controller in the OMAP is very flexible, it has 3 display surfaces which (as far as I can remember) can be wired to any output (i.e. LCD or s-video) and nothing stops you setting up a surface for the LCD and one for S-video that scan the same image from RAM.

 

[God Ginrai]

I'm glad I brought some questions to light about TV out...is it S-video? I don't even know anyone who has S-video inputs...not real big in the US...so I might not even be able to use tv out?

No, you just don't think you know anyone with S-video inputs. Most US televisions nowadays have S-video, it's been like that for a while. You probably never noticed it. I don't know anybody who has a TV that isn't one of those travel TVs that doesn't have S-video.

Also, I think the TV-out cable will have a component video and a S-video plug, so you might be able to use either.

-God Ginrai

 

[gruso]

It's true, s-video is everywhere but it never made it into the consciousness of most consumers for some reason. It's the same here in Australia. People either know about composite ("the yellow one") or (thanks to good marketing) HDMI.

In any case, an s-video to composite adaptor is only a couple of bucks, so nobody needs to worry. And they're both yellow, which should put minds at ease.

 

[WizardStan]

An s-video to composite adapter is a couple pennies if you build it yourself. It's just some wire and a resistor.

 

[DavidBowman]

It's true, s-video is everywhere but it never made it into the consciousness of most consumers for some reason. It's the same here in Australia. People either know about composite ("the yellow one") or (thanks to good marketing) HDMI.

In any case, an s-video to composite adaptor is only a couple of bucks, so nobody needs to worry. And they're both yellow, which should put minds at ease.

Very true. I'm surprised by how many people give me the look of "...quoi?" when I mention S-Video. But you mention the yellow, white, and red plugs on the front of their TV's and everyone knows 'em.

 

[Poem58]

Poem58,

Back to the execution of code. The previous discussion (if it is not completely clear now) is that the vast majority of programs that you are familiar with are x86/x64 compiled and will not work as-is on whichever Linux distribution you plan to use. You have the option for some of them to use the existing system and supplementing it with the software you want through a binary repository of arm-compiled software and/or compiling that software yourself. My understanding is that the Angstrom, Debian, Ubuntu binary repositories are fairly extensive and the Gentoo project is building a binary repo, but also has a stream-lined self-compile option (but it is a bit slow).

If you are not that familiar with Linux (generically speaking) and specifically X.org (graphics display service) then you should know that you can edit the /etc/X11/xorg.conf file (lots of documentation) and set up the video-out to mirror, extend (either left-of, right-of, top-of, or bottom-of) your touchscreen, or act as a completely separate monitor (in which you can have two independent desktops).

except for the X86 not working on arm stuff...the rest was almost completely greek to me...lol
I have nearly NO Linux experience which is what wil make my Panda more fun...the challenge and new experience this OS wil give me...I'm pretty god at Windows and to a small degree DOS (self taught old school-er who's first PC was an SVI-328..ahh the good old days)
Compiling,repositories, etc...all new to me...maybe once I get my Panda..and keep reading all the good things you folks can do..I will be inspired to learn some of this stuff..I've always wanted to get back into the programming side of things...but things progressed so far during the years I had no computer...i was left in the dust...heck even after programming in Basic (nothing complex mind you...those cassette tapes took so long it was hard to put too much effort in...lol) that by the time I saw visual Basic it was in it's 6th version and I was lost!!

Someday I hope to re-read your post and understand it...

But I do want to thank you all...it's nice to actually come into a posting situation where despite being the least knowledgeable...no one has been mean, and you have all been extremely helpful and nice...I plan to learn a lot from my Panda and you all....

 

[Poem58]

You seem to be annoyed with the lack of information you've snapped up, Poet58, but have you really looked through the Pandora Information Index?
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http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?showtopic=44746

Believe me I'm not annoyed...I did go through quite a bit of the links from that thread although some came up dead for me...so I may have missed some things...but since I was putting my order in I thought I'd just ask all of you who have been following this and would probably know for sure before ordering the video cable...

And since there was no mention of an accessory for the audio in...well I asked...

I'm fine about the software thing...i just asked because I wasn't sure if the OS was ported if the software would work under the OS...I just wasn't thinking about the architecture for the program...probably cause the kind of programs I wrote in Basic never made any real calls to hardware etc....

So I'm not angry..actually excited...but my questions were based on lack of information....some I may not have seen, some I don't understand yet, some I just can't find....

This will be fun though...it's always fun to have new things...and though I don't know anything about Linux yet, well, It's always good to have something new to learn....
I downloaded and burned Knoppix 5...while not the same exactly I know, it should at least give me a taste of the OS and how it differs...booted it up once so far...it's cool and I think the Pandora is gonna rock!

 

[God Ginrai]

But I do want to thank you all...it's nice to actually come into a posting situation where despite being the least knowledgeable...no one has been mean, and you have all been extremely helpful and nice...I plan to learn a lot from my Panda and you all....

That's also much due to you. We responded this way because your post was respectful and you recognized where you were or could be ignorant.

-God Ginrai

 

[Poem58]

I'm glad I brought some questions to light about TV out...is it S-video? I don't even know anyone who has S-video inputs...not real big in the US...so I might not even be able to use tv out?

No, you just don't think you know anyone with S-video inputs. Most US televisions nowadays have S-video, it's been like that for a while. You probably never noticed it. I don't know anybody who has a TV that isn't one of those travel TVs that doesn't have S-video.

Also, I think the TV-out cable will have a component video and a S-video plug, so you might be able to use either.

-God Ginrai


I have never had an S-Video port on any AV devices, nor have any of my relatives, nor my friends...until last summer when my parents bought a 720P tv..it has one....Most televisons Right Now (being sold now flat panels) may have them..but up until now, no....sold them for quite awhile...so I'm pretty sure...
I take that back...I did have one myself...part of my ATI video capture card had one..of course I knew of no one with anything to connect it to....when everyone has moved to the new flat panel TV's then it wouldn't be a problem...but most people including myself are a ways off from that....(cause we spend what little money we can come up with on things like the Pandora...lol)

All I really wanted to know what what connectors it had so I'd know if I could get it to plug in composite...I'll just email sales and see if I can get an answer...as long as it's composite I'm golden..if it's S-Video...seriously, there's only one place I can plug it in...i love my parents but I don;t want to be there THAT much...lol

 

[God Ginrai]

I'm glad I brought some questions to light about TV out...is it S-video? I don't even know anyone who has S-video inputs...not real big in the US...so I might not even be able to use tv out?

No, you just don't think you know anyone with S-video inputs. Most US televisions nowadays have S-video, it's been like that for a while. You probably never noticed it. I don't know anybody who has a TV that isn't one of those travel TVs that doesn't have S-video.

Also, I think the TV-out cable will have a component video and a S-video plug, so you might be able to use either.

-God Ginrai


I have never had an S-Video port on any AV devices, nor have any of my relatives, nor my friends...until last summer when my parents bought a 720P tv..it has one....Most televisons Right Now (being sold now flat panels) may have them..but up until now, no....sold them for quite awhile...so I'm pretty sure...
I take that back...I did have one myself...part of my ATI video capture card had one..of course I knew of no one with anything to connect it to....when everyone has moved to the new flat panel TV's then it wouldn't be a problem...but most people including myself are a ways off from that....(cause we spend what little money we can come up with on things like the Pandora...lol)

All I really wanted to know what what connectors it had so I'd know if I could get it to plug in composite...I'll just email sales and see if I can get an answer...as long as it's composite I'm golden..if it's S-Video...seriously, there's only one place I can plug it in...i love my parents but I don;t want to be there THAT much...lol


I still don't have a flat panel television. My TV is a CRT television, and so is my parent's old one (which they have had for over 5 years now) and both have S-video input. It's not most televisions now, but most televisions for the past at least 4 years (probably longer) have had S-video input.

-God Ginrai

 

[Tom`]

I have never had an S-Video port on any AV devices, nor have any of my relatives, nor my friends...until last summer when my parents bought a 720P tv..it has one....Most televisons Right Now (being sold now flat panels) may have them..but up until now, no....sold them for quite awhile...so I'm pretty sure...
I take that back...I did have one myself...part of my ATI video capture card had one..of course I knew of no one with anything to connect it to....when everyone has moved to the new flat panel TV's then it wouldn't be a problem...but most people including myself are a ways off from that....(cause we spend what little money we can come up with on things like the Pandora...lol)

I have a pretty cheap TV from at least ten years ago that has S-Video in. It has been around since the early 1990s at least, and commonplace for a decade now. (Wikipedia says it became the default connector in the late 1990s, and my admittedly non-professional experience confirms this.)

Of course, it may not be that popular outside the US...

 

[valhalla]

Interesting. I was under the impression that it would be legally okay to distribute media players so long as the nonfree codecs themselves aren't included with the distribution.

It's probably more user friendly to let people download their media player after they receive the hardware than ship with a media player that as far as most people are concerned doesn't work because it can't play most formats.

Personally I wouldn't care, but them I'm the kind of user unix is friendly with

As for the apps available for pandora; I believe that building and packaging simple apps that don't require a real porting (no opengl, no x86 code, no high hw requirements, etc.) will be easy enough for people with moderate linux knowdlege that they should start filling the pandora repository quite soon, leaving time for the real experts to work on the hard stuff.

 

[Pleng]

All I really wanted to know what what connectors it had so I'd know if I could get it to plug in composite...I'll just email sales and see if I can get an answer...as long as it's composite I'm golden..if it's S-Video...seriously, there's only one place I can plug it in...i love my parents but I don;t want to be there THAT much...lol

You've already had this answer several times. But just to clarify:

S-Video will be the only TV connector on the TV-Out cable

A S-Video - composite adapter is a very simple piece of hardware that will cost a couple of bucks from any electrical store.

 

[Poem58]

I'm glad I brought some questions to light about TV out...is it S-video? I don't even know anyone who has S-video inputs...not real big in the US...so I might not even be able to use tv out?

No, you just don't think you know anyone with S-video inputs. Most US televisions nowadays have S-video, it's been like that for a while. You probably never noticed it. I don't know anybody who has a TV that isn't one of those travel TVs that doesn't have S-video.

Also, I think the TV-out cable will have a component video and a S-video plug, so you might be able to use either.

-God Ginrai


I have never had an S-Video port on any AV devices, nor have any of my relatives, nor my friends...until last summer when my parents bought a 720P tv..it has one....Most televisons Right Now (being sold now flat panels) may have them..but up until now, no....sold them for quite awhile...so I'm pretty sure...
I take that back...I did have one myself...part of my ATI video capture card had one..of course I knew of no one with anything to connect it to....when everyone has moved to the new flat panel TV's then it wouldn't be a problem...but most people including myself are a ways off from that....(cause we spend what little money we can come up with on things like the Pandora...lol)

All I really wanted to know what what connectors it had so I'd know if I could get it to plug in composite...I'll just email sales and see if I can get an answer...as long as it's composite I'm golden..if it's S-Video...seriously, there's only one place I can plug it in...i love my parents but I don;t want to be there THAT much...lol


I still don't have a flat panel television. My TV is a CRT television, and so is my parent's old one (which they have had for over 5 years now) and both have S-video input. It's not most televisions now, but most televisions for the past at least 4 years (probably longer) have had S-video input.

-God Ginrai

I bought mine 2 years ago..it has component and compsoite...no S-video...I live in Ohio..where are you from it may be something some areas have others don't focus on..cause I'm being honest here as many people's TV setups I've handled...none of them had nor used S-video...even ones I set up in peoples homes...(sure there was probably some that had them..but no one ever used them or needed me to connect them.)

I was going to update my last post then lost my wireless connecton for a moment but I was wondering whether or not it was based more on set quality (more expensive) as everyone I know always bought the cheapest sets...not many people I know invest in better quality...

In any case I have only 1 TV I can access with it...none of my neighbors, friends or family (aside form my parents) have an S-video jack...no matter what the odds...that is how it is...
that would be somewhere around 30 households...

I always just chalked it up to being one of those methods that never really caught on and figured the US was probably the only place that rarely used it....it very well may be that a lot of people have it...but strangely then..no one I know (aside form my parents of course)

Anyway if it's easily solved...then I'm not worried....

Now I'm going to just focus on what to do to get audio line in...I'm sure someone will port an audio editor if that hasn't been done already...so I'll need to figure out the pins and fashion something I guess...that is if the TV out cable doesn't have something for that as I think someone suggested...

Thanks again for your help though.

All I really wanted to know what what connectors it had so I'd know if I could get it to plug in composite...I'll just email sales and see if I can get an answer...as long as it's composite I'm golden..if it's S-Video...seriously, there's only one place I can plug it in...i love my parents but I don;t want to be there THAT much...lol

You've already had this answer several times. But just to clarify:

S-Video will be the only TV connector on the TV-Out cable

A S-Video - composite adapter is a very simple piece of hardware that will cost a couple of bucks from any electrical store.


I didn't even know til this thread that you could do that with an adaptor (figured there would be a signal difference which necessitated the extra pins) then it should be no problem then...thanks!

I have never had an S-Video port on any AV devices, nor have any of my relatives, nor my friends...until last summer when my parents bought a 720P tv..it has one....Most televisons Right Now (being sold now flat panels) may have them..but up until now, no....sold them for quite awhile...so I'm pretty sure...
I take that back...I did have one myself...part of my ATI video capture card had one..of course I knew of no one with anything to connect it to....when everyone has moved to the new flat panel TV's then it wouldn't be a problem...but most people including myself are a ways off from that....(cause we spend what little money we can come up with on things like the Pandora...lol)

I have a pretty cheap TV from at least ten years ago that has S-Video in. It has been around since the early 1990s at least, and commonplace for a decade now. (Wikipedia says it became the default connector in the late 1990s, and my admittedly non-professional experience confirms this.)

Of course, it may not be that popular outside the US...


That's the funny thing...I knew S-video existed...but dealing with them I never had any use for them...when I would instal a TV if it had one...no one had any devices with S-video..which is why I always assumed it was something that just didn't catch on...I know you guys don't believe me on this..but I'm 36 now..and have NEVER seen anything connected to a TV with S-video...
like I said Maybe it just timed up that I never personally met up with someone using the connector nor did I ever have a TV with one and just assumed it was rarer...I'm just glad it is convertible. Problem solved...

 

[WizardStan]

A S-Video - composite adapter is a very simple piece of hardware that will cost a couple of bucks from any electrical store.

I'm almost positive now that we were told it would include both: the OMAP only outputs s-video, but an adapter is just a resistor and some wire, and a resistor fits very easily inside the cable so it would be almost trivial for them to just build one right in. I can't remember where I read that though, so it may have been someone else's speculation, but it makes sense to me.
And like you say, if not, adapters are cheap. If all else fails, you can at least just get a single wire off the s-video and get a black and white signal until you can get an adapter to add the colour back in.

 

[Bronek]

I have recent flat plasma TV and it does not have S-Video input. It does have 2 SCART sockets though, which is enough, because I also have S-Video <=> SCART adapter I think Pandora is going to look gorgeous on this TV

 

[RavenX]

That's the funny thing...I knew S-video existed...but dealing with them I never had any use for them...when I would instal a TV if it had one...no one had any devices with S-video..which is why I always assumed it was something that just didn't catch on...I know you guys don't believe me on this..but I'm 36 now..and have NEVER seen anything connected to a TV with S-video...

Although I do not doubt you, I just thought I would share my experiences on this topic as I have found myself frequently advocating S-Video over the last 10 years as I found it to be greatly underutilized and have "rewired" many an entertainment setup to improve quality. I personally have never seen a VCR with S-Video (although I know there were a few towards the end as DVD started coming on). But, I have also never seen a DVD player that did not have S-Video out, nor a Satellite or Digital Cable receiver. Nor have I ever seen a 19" or bigger TV made since the 2000s that did not have an S-Video jack. S-Video provides much better quality than composite with much less "noise" introduced by crosstalk particularly where extreme color/luminance difference exist in high-contrast pictures. This is why S-Video output is much better for computer graphics output than composite. Anywhere where you have high-contrast lines on a screen will be far sharper with S-Video. This is why I have "rewired" many a setup to use S-Video because unfortunately many people just do not know it can be any better than the plain old composite which looks good enough to them. And, this is why I think S-Video out is perfect for the Pandora short of a digital output that would have increased cost and possibly size.

 

[God Ginrai]

I have recent flat plasma TV and it does not have S-Video input. It does have 2 SCART sockets though, which is enough, because I also have S-Video <=> SCART adapter I think Pandora is going to look gorgeous on this TV

Well, I can't vouch for S-Video's status outside the US. I was speaking strictly about US.

-God Ginrai

 

[Bronek]

Well, I can"t vouch for S-Video"s status outside the US. I was speaking strictly about US.

right, I live in UK and I know they sell different models in US. Still, even if a TV has only HDMI and SCART, one may still connect S-Video via simple (and cheap) SCART adapter. Wait, mine also has component (i.e. three jacks) input, I think this will work even better. Will see...

 

[Tom`]

...I live in Ohio...

So do I.