Opt Should Sell Op To Someone With Enough Financial Leverage

[Nova]

You have seen how our customer service is excellent

Yes we have also seen how you sometimes write unprofessional posts telling people you don't want their custom just because they are (understandably) finding the delays really hard to cope with.

I have my Pandora but even I'm still annoyed and worried about the repercussions of all these delays on the future developments of the Pandora and what that will mean for the device I have purchased.

Then if you're not happy sell it or return it, this isn't some communist project where your locked in forever.

When I tell some people to just go away, I'm just being entirely honest with them, this isn't a charity.

But have a real hardware/transaction/delivery/support problem? You will get fantastic service.

Edit: thinking about this, what do you consider 'professional' service? Sony style where they can just whip your console features away from you and tell you you don't really own your machine? Apple service where they can remotely disable or delete your applications and void your warranty for running software they don't like? The general computer industry service where you can't contact or speak to anyone higher than a telemarketer?

I think we should be told.

Noone is doubting you guys have the potential to do it. And if you feel you can do it by yourselves, bloody well good on you guys, because this is a very special project. But please promise the community that if you ever feel like you can't afford to keep it up (and I'm not saying you ever will, but just in case), you'll seek some kind of outside help?

 

[mvickers03]

You have seen how our customer service is excellent

Yes we have also seen how you sometimes write unprofessional posts telling people you don't want their custom just because they are (understandably) finding the delays really hard to cope with.

I have my Pandora but even I'm still annoyed and worried about the repercussions of all these delays on the future developments of the Pandora and what that will mean for the device I have purchased.

Then if you're not happy sell it or return it, this isn't some communist project where your locked in forever.

When I tell some people to just go away, I'm just being entirely honest with them, this isn't a charity.

But have a real hardware/transaction/delivery/support problem? You will get fantastic service.

Edit: thinking about this, what do you consider 'professional' service? Sony style where they can just whip your console features away from you and tell you you don't really own your machine? Apple service where they can remotely disable or delete your applications and void your warranty for running software they don't like? The general computer industry service where you can't contact or speak to anyone higher than a telemarketer?

I think we should be told.

I must agree, I have never seen support as good as OPL before and no I'm not brown nosing, better than any support for any device.. and I'v had lots and lots before this one! even when a company would ignore it's device has a problem rather than trying to improve the product

 

[tds48]

You have seen how our customer service is excellent

Yes we have also seen how you sometimes write unprofessional posts telling people you don't want their custom just because they are (understandably) finding the delays really hard to cope with.

I have my Pandora but even I'm still annoyed and worried about the repercussions of all these delays on the future developments of the Pandora and what that will mean for the device I have purchased.

Then if you're not happy sell it or return it, this isn't some communist project where your locked in forever.

When I tell some people to just go away, I'm just being entirely honest with them, this isn't a charity.

But have a real hardware/transaction/delivery/support problem? You will get fantastic service.

Edit: thinking about this, what do you consider 'professional' service? Sony style where they can just whip your console features away from you and tell you you don't really own your machine? Apple service where they can remotely disable or delete your applications and void your warranty for running software they don't like? The general computer industry service where you can't contact or speak to anyone higher than a telemarketer?

I think we should be told.

I must agree, I have never seen support as good as OPL before and no I'm not brown nosing, better than any support for any device.. and I'v had lots and lots before this one! even when a company would ignore it's device has a problem rather than trying to improve the product

+1

 

[Sphinxter]

I agree. They should, if they can even find somebody who is interested, but they will not. Firstly Craig is waaay too stubborn, and slightly deluded in thinking he's able to take on the world.

I'm not 'deluded', I just think we can set up a successful console/computer manufacturing business as many other people have done many times before. They were not 'magic' people, they were just a group of guys like us that wanted to succeed. I've no doubt at all that we will succeed, this is an amazing community and almost everyone here can see the advantages for the future when we get going at speed.

You have seen how our customer service is excellent, how we work damned hard to fix problems and complaints as soon as they are brought up and how we are always here pushing things forward. Just as the first Pandoras shipped so will the next 7000. As I've said before I'd have to be dead for the Pandora to fail.

Deluded people are always the best judge of how deluded they are.

 

[tdp]

You have seen how our customer service is excellent

Yes we have also seen how you sometimes write unprofessional posts telling people you don't want their custom just because they are (understandably) finding the delays really hard to cope with.

I have my Pandora but even I'm still annoyed and worried about the repercussions of all these delays on the future developments of the Pandora and what that will mean for the device I have purchased.

Then if you're not happy sell it or return it, this isn't some communist project where your locked in forever.

When I tell some people to just go away, I'm just being entirely honest with them, this isn't a charity.

But have a real hardware/transaction/delivery/support problem? You will get fantastic service.

Edit: thinking about this, what do you consider 'professional' service? Sony style where they can just whip your console features away from you and tell you you don't really own your machine? Apple service where they can remotely disable or delete your applications and void your warranty for running software they don't like? The general computer industry service where you can't contact or speak to anyone higher than a telemarketer?

I think we should be told.

Craigix and openpandora has a very bright future. More and more the hardware you purchase is more of a rental. As Craigix rightly stated, company's can and do remove features, software and content as they feel. This is only going to get worst. I want hardware I control. Openpandora and Linux is the way forward. It's not just consoles and mobile phones that are been used by big corporations like this - imagine how Kindle owners felt when Amazon just removed the e-books from your machine. Ironically, one of the books was 1984!!!!

The PSP and PS3 are hopefully going to be the last closed source gaming hardware I'm going to buy. I will happily support truly opensource consoles, computers, os's and handhelds. No-one is monitoring or controlling how I play games, watch movies, listen music, etc.....

@craigix, I'm waiting for the full games console and mp3 player (just make sure the mp3 player is as small as a ipod classic with a 160gb + drive).

 

[xpansive]

I disagree exponentially.

 

[levi1123]

stay as we are all good things come to those that wait

How long does it take before that rule no longer can be said to apply? I mean, some of us have been waiting for 3 years...

I was a lucky one to get a one nubber that stayed that way, I joined the boards here in oct of '09. I have to say i love the pandora and the community here as a whole. Nowhere else will you speak to the developers of the console the software programmers and fellow users that also have found their own things about the device and everyone sharing together to improve the machine. That is really what drew me to the Pandora and sold the device to me. Not some shiny name or games but the feeling that I'll be owning something i contributed something to. Be it money, or my own tricks ive discovered about the OS/ a program to help someone. You wont find that anywhere else. As long as we're all here still working to make the Pandora as awesome as it can be, the Pandora will go on.

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

Yep,and didnt Craig say that after christmas o.p.t might look into the idea of us all becoming sort of mini investors.
This is an awesome idea.If several thousand of us pay a certain amount for shares/stocks etc then we can all together
make anything happen for the pandora.I love the idea of being part of this project in any capacity.

 

[milkshake]

Then if you're not happy sell it or return it, this isn't some communist project where your locked in forever.

Well only time will tell for this it all depends on what happens in the future, at the moment I'm enjoying the software people are putting out, however the OS still has many issues that need fixing and no-one working on the core issues just small fixes that EvilDragon can do himself.

As you have seen with many other posts people only have so much patience.

When I tell some people to just go away, I'm just being entirely honest with them, this isn't a charity.

But have a real hardware/transaction/delivery/support problem? You will get fantastic service.

Ok I don't think your getting the point; As someone that has worked as a customer service advisor (for telecommunications) I have lots of experience and the term customer service is a broad one, it covers lots of areas.

Customer Service Break Down:
Customer experience - This is probably the main focus of what customer service is all about - were you warm and friendly? did you solve the issue first time round? what are the customers views of the company after the call/support? - you got this all wrong Craig.
Technical Support - Are you knowledgeable? No doubt about this! Excellent in this area of customer service.
Billing - No issues from me (well maybe the whole paypal thing from the preorder but that in the past now). Jacqueline is amazing!!
logistics - No issues again any questions to Jacqueline and she would reply promptly.

What I'm trying to say is that you treat some of your customers like dirt because you don't like what you hear/read but that isn't going to win you any favours or customers!
I mean even if what your saying is what everyone else is thinking and I'm pretty sure most of the time it is... don't say it just remain calm and professional just let the community bash them instead at least then it doesn't paint a horrible picture of you and OPLtd.

Edit: thinking about this, what do you consider 'professional' service? Sony style where they can just whip your console features away from you and tell you you don't really own your machine? Apple service where they can remotely disable or delete your applications and void your warranty for running software they don't like? The general computer industry service where you can't contact or speak to anyone higher than a telemarketer?

I think we should be told.

Now your just going off topic what you describe here isn't even customer service this is terms and conditions and politics.

I don't think your a bad person at all Craig I think what you have created is a wonderful device but sometimes I see you write certain posts which makes my mind boggle.
I hope you see some positive in what I have wrote.

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

stay as we are all good things come to those that wait

How long does it take before that rule no longer can be said to apply? I mean, some of us have been waiting for 3 years...

I was a lucky one to get a one nubber that stayed that way, I joined the boards here in oct of '09. I have to say i love the pandora and the community here as a whole. Nowhere else will you speak to the developers of the console the software programmers and fellow users that also have found their own things about the device and everyone sharing together to improve the machine. That is really what drew me to the Pandora and sold the device to me. Not some shiny name or games but the feeling that I'll be owning something i contributed something to. Be it money, or my own tricks ive discovered about the OS/ a program to help someone. You wont find that anywhere else. As long as we're all here still working to make the Pandora as awesome as it can be, the Pandora will go on.

+10000000000000

 

[TrashyMG]

I see it's attack Craigix over things beyond his control day. And I forgot my flogging shoes.

 

[milkshake]

why who's attacking Craig over things beyond his control?

 

[wardred]

Sigh. I just hope that we get to the point where the production problems are as much in the past as the billing problems. Until we get there I fear the community's going to remain impatient - even those who have their Pandoras. It has been a very long pre-order. Game development is happening for the Pandora, but until the first batch is fully out there I can't help but think that the enthusiasm for doing so is at least a little muted given how few people can actually see the fruits of the developer's labors, assuming said developer is within that first several hundred that've been sent.

And since so many of us are waiting for our Pandoras, that's the largest topic of discussion, even with frequent updates. And there's Craig, living daily with dealing with the manufacturers, quality control issues, and everything else that has caused a delay faced with yet another, inevitable, where's my Panda thread. It's not an unwarranted topic, but I think he's been pretty up front on what's happening in the production queue.

I'm trying not to check back on the forums or Alec's Craig Stalker too religiously as it just makes me more impatient. Craig, you've got my order, and even if I am a little disappointed I don't have it now, I'll wait until I do get it. I just hope the second round goes smoother, and that there's a larger third and fourth rounds. I'd love to see your company get to the point where you're actually getting a return on your investment and have the funds to produce and have Pandoras in stock, ready to sell when people order them, rather than doing pre-orders.

I want the production problems to be in the past so we can all enjoy our Pandoras and move on to fun topics like upcoming game releases, or improvements in Emulator X.

Cheers, and good luck with future dealings with the manufacturers, shippers, and billing - something I think most of us want to see.

Edit: spelling

 

[mosschops]

Ok I don't think your getting the point; As someone that has worked as a customer service advisor (for telecommunications) I have lots of experience and the term customer service is a broad one, it covers lots of areas.

Does a customer become one when the contract is complete and until then are they just potential?

i'm also not sure working as a CSA in the telecoms industry gives you any credence in the area of CS

yer man Craig isnt daft, he has a product which people are still plonking down money for when people who have paid 2 years ago still havent had their units delivered. do you really think letting of steam at some idiots is going to make a difference?

I dont know how old you are MS and i aint comparing Craig with the Ginger Master but do you really think people wouldnt have bought the ZX81 if they new what Sir Clive was really like?

[edit] oh and by the way, i was a day one orderer and recently bought a one nubber while i wait for mine. it IS worth the wait, the day your Pandora turns up all this *waves arms about* will be completely forgotten

 

[levi1123]

stay as we are all good things come to those that wait

How long does it take before that rule no longer can be said to apply? I mean, some of us have been waiting for 3 years...

I was a lucky one to get a one nubber that stayed that way, I joined the boards here in oct of '09. I have to say i love the pandora and the community here as a whole. Nowhere else will you speak to the developers of the console the software programmers and fellow users that also have found their own things about the device and everyone sharing together to improve the machine. That is really what drew me to the Pandora and sold the device to me. Not some shiny name or games but the feeling that I'll be owning something i contributed something to. Be it money, or my own tricks ive discovered about the OS/ a program to help someone. You wont find that anywhere else. As long as we're all here still working to make the Pandora as awesome as it can be, the Pandora will go on.

+10000000000000

lol, Thanks Wrath. =)

 

[mali]

yer man Craig isnt daft, he has a product which people are still plonking down money for when people who have paid 2 years ago still havent had their units delivered. do you really think letting of steam at some idiots is going to make a difference?

It _does_ make a difference, cause they usually are no idiots but members of this community. Milkshake made valid points and I understand what he wanted to get across. Letting off steam at customers is never a good idea.

 

[wardred]

I have to agree with Milkshake's appraisal of the customer support. On most things you're spot on. Keeping us up to date on the manufacturing, tracking down hardware and software issues and DEALING with them, not simply saying "Well, if it cuts off the reception, don't hold your Pandora that way." :-b Heck, I even enjoy the occasional wacky he's on the roof again with a bottle of something or other posts. It's part of what makes this a quirky home brew, awesome device!

But the occasional "If you don't like it, go away" posts don't help you much. Often times somebody is posting one thing they don't like - which can be hard to tell since that one thing is what's bothering them and they may not post things in the most diplomatic fashion. A response like this just further pisses them off, and makes them want to return the device and say other nasty things on the very public forum, maybe with others who are also frustrated chipping in.

To some extent you have to eat the frustration, despite the pressures you, personally, have to be under. They're your customers, and often have legitimate gripes. And that one thing they don't like? It doesn't mean they don't like the whole project, just that they've found one thing that's bothering them and are vocal about it. Maybe some do hate the whole device now after so much time has past and so much drama on the forums. Or that one thing continues to bother them if they haven't received a unit after 2 years.

Unfortunately since it's a post on the forums, you or somebody from OPT have to make some sort of public response to it. If somebody's belligerent after your response(s) to their concern, by all means ask them to stop posting, return their Pandora, or "What's your order number?" But be aware of how that response may seem harsh to the person who really may only have one gripe against your product, especially if it looks like your first response to them - not all of will have seen those other 20 threads where you addressed the point they're making again...and how it may affect other people's perspectives who've hung with you for a couple years and are still waiting for their Pandoras.

It may be better to take some of the conversations off line, and if there is a resolution other than having the person cancel their order or send their Pandora back, post the resolution after its been reached. Heck, post that you couldn't come to a resolution other than that for that matter, but asking somebody to cancel where everybody can see it doesn't help you unless that person is being blatantly belligerent.

 

[centrlink]

the delays are frustrating for all involved, but i have to agree with craig - the customer service is outstanding. i've bought several things over the years from gbax, and have been very happy, and the clear sense i get from the boards is very much that craig's reputation for customer service is right up there (and ED too).

cheers, simon

 

[moxie]

Customary gripes about definitions of what constitutes "customer service" and whether Craig should vent on the forum or not aside (personally, I'm quite fond of the no bullshitting/straight in the face variety, here or elsewhere, but that is just me), I don't think I quite get what the original poster is saying: OPT should sell to someone with more dough, or the project is doomed...How? What does "Doomed" mean here? As far as I gather, so far the only real investors are the team themselves - Re-mortgaging of houses, investments of free capital, whatever, but essentially all the economy is in the hands of OPT, right? That does imply, indeed, that as long as the team themselves are not bored or dead, the Pandora lives on. There is no external interest holder that could pull the plug and "Doom" the project, and as long as the customers don't start cancelling orders en masse, the project is quite stable. IF they had sold out to someone else, THEN shurely, by now, the project would be doomed.

But they haven't, and it isn't.

Now, if the original poster meant "Unless they get more financial muscle in, they wont conquer the world NOW!", then it is probably true. "Unless they get more financial muscle in, they won't achieve the market penetration that they could otherwise" - possibly true. But doomed - No. And precisely because they have no external investors.

 

[wardred]

Moxie, per the original post in this thread, I agree. Despite the problems, I don't see a larger company helping. I seem to recall conversations where they'd looked for investors and the investors wanted to completely change what the Pandora is. I want the original OPT team in charge of this project. Maybe, if after the round 1 production quirks are finally resolved it was opened up to the customers to be investors with no say in the direction of the project that might be something to consider, but I think a company or angel investor would want too much control over the project.

Personally, I don't mind the occasional outburst. It's kinda like the posts from the roof, just another quirky day on the Pandora forums. Unfortunately frustrated or angry posts are often catching, and if they're done on a public forum it may not be just the person Craig's responding to who gets ticked. Other customers, developers, or potential batch 2 or batch 3 folk see it as well. Most probably will take it in stride, but if enough get frustrated it could sully the excellent support OPT has provided fixing issues they've encountered. Sometimes the tone of a message is just as important as the message itself.

Then again, maybe not, just my 2 cents.