In A Real Quandry....

[7zark7]

I got the email, and will definitely reorder. Bank transfer or otherwise... As soon as I get my refund that is...

I don't get why these minor issues are seemingly so major to some... A few months delay? the reorder "issue" which isn't really an issue....?

For me its more a combination of minor issues that add up... rather than one thing.

I agree with many here that you have to take rough with the smooth being an early adopter and all. For me the previous attitude to communication and the contents of the re-order email show that whilst technically brilliant the pandora team are perhaps not as business savvy as they should / might be. This worrys me slightly given the economic circumstances and the complexities of the project.

Perhaps its because I come from a finance / retail background , and maybe my expectations are to high, but these are the things that have made me stop and think. I have seen multi million pound projects fail that were "unsinkable" so maybe i am far too cynical

7Zark7

 

[lardman]

QUOTE
As far as I'm concerned, you (this is the grand "you", not just the person who started this thread) agreed to purchase the Pandora when you paid for it the first time. You knew that the delivery date may or may not make the November estimate, and obviously it's not. You knew that there are chances you're taking with the first batch over subsequent ones. You knew that when you agreed to purchase it, and you still paid for it.


Of course one weighs up the pros and cons, and the fact it was slated for the end of November was one of the factors. Now the date has slipped and there is no real projection of where it might slip to (based on ironing out the hardware issues, which afaiu are pretty much open-ended in the time required to fix them, not so much on the LCD supply which I presume could be predicted) which is what causes me some concern.

 

[blarney]

QUOTE
I don't think you have to worry about this very much at all. The production train has left the station - it's going to arrive at the destination - the question is when. Maybe there's 1 in a 1000 chance the train will get derailed - but it doesn't seem likely at this point.


Can I take out insurance with you? I'll have 20p at 1000/1. Thanks! :lol:

Seriously, the odds would be much lower than that, in this climate... More like 5/1 :blink:

Blarney

 

[TaG]

Woolworths and MFI both going into administration. Woolworths employ 30,000 in the UK.

Anyway, as someone said elsewhere, there's no real crisis...

If this keeps up you won't get 5/1.

 

[MaxSteiner]

Personally, I really want a Pandora, don't really need the £200, and love the whole feel of this community, reminds me of the classic commodora 64/Amiga days.

BUT, if we get to the CC reorder date and there still hasn't been a picture of a finished Pandora, it turns out it was delayed because you can't use CC's for preorders over a certain date, the release date is still wavering around the sometime early 2009 mark and theres about as many updates being supplied as there are now.... Then Im really going to have to reconsider my position.

Otherwise Im still commited though

 

[gaterooze]

Got 'the email' this morning (in Oz). I'll definitely reorder, the only question now is if I try an international bank transfer or wait for the credit card info.

7zark7, I was in a similar position, the Pandora was to be a gift from my wife for my bday/Xmas, but we're not bothered. She'll give me a little treat instead and I'll have a virtual second Xmas when it does arrive

 

[BeefJerky]

Seems the best nudge in favour of reordering is that people will chuck the 'naive' insult at you if you don't. Nothing like insults to endear you to a community.

I share your concerns. Particularly with regards to points 3 and 4. On 3, if it weren't for the reassurances of the GBAX history and the (quick to hurl insults) community, I would be absolutley convinced that this is a scam. There would be no doubt in my mind. If I had ordered and not spent time on the boards, I would not remotely have considered reordering and would not have waited for the refund before trying to cancel the transaction. But I was checking the sites and boards and point 4 didn't help matters.

But that is clearly improving.

I'll be reordering as soon as the credit card ordering opens (no way in hell I'd go for a bank transfer, even with the reassurances of the community). To put it simply, I'd like to have the Pandora. It sounds great to me and that's the main thing.

I can understand your time concerns, especially if you had a clear date in your mind. Now people can say you were naive to not see delays coming but then I'd say, if that were true, it was naive to set a date for customers. The date being missed is not your mistake. So I guess if that's a big issue for you and the delay would lead to disappointment and lessened enthusiasm, give it a miss and see how things turn out for the second batch.

But if you're still excited about it, reorder. The time will pass quickly and, before you know it, you'll have one. Hopefully.

 

[mazza558]

I think another aspect is how much use you think you'll get out of it.

I know that Ubuntu is being developed for ARM, no matter what. The devs have said that the Pandoras will ship, no matter what. Putting 2 and 2 together, I know that even if the Pandora sinks, there'll still be software to use. All I personally need out of the Pandora is:

-Media player
-Web Browser/IM

And all the extras that the Pandora has will be what makes it even more awesome, IMO.

 

[jdh2550]

QUOTE

QUOTE
2. Real concerns that if too many people pull out then the economics of the situation might force the closure of the whole project.

I don't think you have to worry about this very much at all. The production train has left the station - it's going to arrive at the destination - the question is when. Maybe there's 1 in a 1000 chance the train will get derailed - but it doesn't seem likely at this point.

Can I take out insurance with you? I'll have 20p at 1000/1. Thanks! :lol:

Seriously, the odds would be much lower than that, in this climate... More like 5/1 :blink:

Blarney

Sure, as long as you can help me figure out the other risks I'll have to bring into the pool to make the numbers work (remember the insurance company gets rich by playing lots of different bets at the same time - not one "all or nothing bet" like this).

5/1? You think there's a 20% chance we'll get nothing? I'd definitely get a refund if I thought that. Maybe 1000/1 isn't right - maybe it's worse. But 100/1 is my final offer!

Woolworths and MFI both going into administration. Woolworths employ 30,000 in the UK.
Anyway, as someone said elsewhere, there's no real crisis...
If this keeps up you won't get 5/1.

? You're saying you think it's worse than 5/1 that Pandora will make it in this "economic climate"? Woolworths and MFI both have massive overhead (e.g. real estate & payroll) that they keep spending whether or not folks buy anything in their stores. The pandora team don't have those kinds of costs - "just" the cost of parts and assembly - which are directly recoverable when they sell the Pandora.

They sold 4,000 of these in just a few days. A heck of a lot people will need to cancel for there to be a financial problem.

Nope, I'm sticking to no more than 100/1 chance of financial ruin causing pandora not to be delivered.

 

[TaG]

She'll give me a little treat instead
Nuff said.

Woolworths and MFI both going into administration. Woolworths employ 30,000 in the UK.
Anyway, as someone said elsewhere, there's no real crisis...
If this keeps up you won't get 5/1.

? You're saying you think it's worse than 5/1 that Pandora will make it in this "economic climate"?No, I was (sarcastically) saying that if things get much worse you won't get insurance at 5/1.

 

[blarney]

Seriously, the odds would be much lower than that, in this climate... More like 5/1 :blink:

QUOTE
Sure, as long as you can help me figure out the other risks I'll have to bring into the pool to make the numbers work (remember the insurance company gets rich by playing lots of different bets at the same time - not one "all or nothing bet" like this).



Hows about odds for Pandora arrival :-

4/5 March 2009 or later
3/1 February 2009
5/1 January 2009
5/1 Never
50/1 December 2008
200/1 November 2008


QUOTE

5/1? You think there's a 20% chance we'll get nothing? I'd definitely get a refund if I thought that. Maybe 1000/1 isn't right - maybe it's worse. But 100/1 is my final offer!



I'd willingly give you £2 if you'll provide me with £200 If it doesn't arrive by June 2009.

If 3000 people all did the same you'd be £6000 richer for little risk (In your opinion) if it went tits up you'd be down £600,000 though :unsure:

Except then we'd need someone else to insure against the possibility of you being able to pay out... Those odds may well be in the realm of 600,000/1 :lol:

 

[cosurgi]

Hmm...

Reading this thread I realized, that there might be actually some people who do not reorder. I hope that the dev team will not fall into financial troubles because of that. Perhaps they will just order a bit less in the Fab for mass production, and still break even.

 

[jdh2550]

Seriously, the odds would be much lower than that, in this climate... More like 5/1 :blink:

QUOTE
Sure, as long as you can help me figure out the other risks I'll have to bring into the pool to make the numbers work (remember the insurance company gets rich by playing lots of different bets at the same time - not one "all or nothing bet" like this).



Hows about odds for Pandora arrival :-

4/5 March 2009 or later
3/1 February 2009
5/1 January 2009
5/1 Never
50/1 December 2008
200/1 November 2008


QUOTE

5/1? You think there's a 20% chance we'll get nothing? I'd definitely get a refund if I thought that. Maybe 1000/1 isn't right - maybe it's worse. But 100/1 is my final offer!



I'd willingly give you £2 if you'll provide me with £200 If it doesn't arrive by June 2009.

If 3000 people all did the same you'd be £6000 richer for little risk (In your opinion) if it went tits up you'd be down £600,000 though :unsure:

Except then we'd need someone else to insure against the possibility of you being able to pay out... Those odds may well be in the realm of 600,000/1 :lol:

Err, no - I don't need different odds for the delivery date of the pandora I need different odds for other unrelated things and suckers (err, customers) so that I can collect enough money to assure myself of a profit. That's how insurance works.

 

[chiark]

I'll add my story.

I've received the refund. I'm not reordering. Not because of lack of faith, or naive assumptions on my part, but because some better use for the money presented itself.

Plus, being frank, I think there's still a long, long way to go before volumes of this device get manufactured. That's just my feeling, and I hope that the team prove me wrong in the best way possible.

I still would love a Pandora, particularly for the amiga emulation capabilities, but I'll be a keen "second batcher" once the things are stable.

 

[MDave]

Do all these people backing out realize that they have to wait longer and pay more for a second batch pandora, if they are planning on getting one later? Oh well.

 

[mali]

I feel with you, who are disappointed. I had a feeling of disappointment for a short while, when the newest delay was announced. But putting all the info together I'm coming to the conclusion that my engagement hasn't changed a bit. I want this project to be successful, I want to be fed with every little info, I want to be part of it. There will be this one day, when the postman smiles at you and you take this little box gratefully, put it near your heart while walking to the right place to open the box. You will have this childish shimmer in your eyes, you thought you had lost long ago...

 

[Tor]

Hmm...

Reading this thread I realized, that there might be actually some people who do not reorder. I hope that the dev team will not fall into financial troubles because of that. Perhaps they will just order a bit less in the Fab for mass production, and still break even.

Well, if they suddenly have a couple hundred more spares than they planned for, I'm certain they'll go out as hot cakes anyway. At least as soon as the rest of us (hopefully) report that our devices are in good condition and don't fail on us. I know for a certainty that there are some folks over at InternetTabletTalk on the fence, with a strong wish for a Pandora although they didn't preorder (because they're not the preorder types).

As for myself, I almost preordered 2.. but in the end I went for 1. So I could well end up ordering another one when the first one has verified itself. I know someone who would like one.

 

[icurafu]

I'm incredibly dissapointed in the way things have turned out and the misleading awfully worded email didn't help my confidence. But I guess my expectations are higher than the level that the team takes themselves seriously.

Anyway, what kind of self-respecting retro uber geek would I be if I didn't stand by my pre-order in these days of crisis. I'll just keep paying and try not to get my "10 hours of battery life"/"will play doom3" hopes up too much.

 

[Chance1234]

I got the refund through and was in two minds to re-order. The poor communication including the wording on the email were my main two reasons to pull out.

However, they do seem to have listened on the communication front and there has been an improvement.

I am very skeptical about receiving this device any time soon, but what the hell! If it comes through it will be a great device and will have been good to have been in the "first batch"

So I reordered

 

[Arakasi]

There will be this one day, when the postman smiles at you and you take this little box gratefully, put it near your heart while walking to the right place to open the box. You will have this childish shimmer in your eyes, you thought you had lost long ago...

If I were a post-op transsexual woman turned into a man, I would have your babies. :blink: :blink: