I pre-ordered a OpenPandora in 2010 and still haven't received anything


elw3 said:
How unsettling, how did you know i repair cameras?

This analogy doesnt work cause in our case the boss walked of and an employee felt responsible.
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if the boss walked out and a employee or co business partner vice president or whoever decided to step up to take care of the business then he will feel obligated to take care of the repairs that the boss left behind. Not tell the customers tough luck u should have bought a nikon instead. any respectable company would do that.

all these people saying it cant be done when you stated that you waited and got yours and i assume a lot more waited and got theres. so i waited patiently for 10 years and these same people trying to explain to me that it cant be done?
 
@ponlork,
Except they were not partners, Craigix ran a UK shop, he came up with the idea of the Pandora and ran the development and initial production, and setup the Forum. EvilDragon ran a German handheld website for the GP2X handheld devices and had interest in reselling the Pandora in Germany, EvilDragon bought Pandoras from Craigix and sold them in the German market. That was how things worked until Craigix backed out and EvilDragon had to pick up the pieces...

For one no court would agree EvilDragon has any responsibility in giving you a refund and another thing you're well past the limitation of making a legal claim to get a refund. Court Fees will likely cost you more than what you generously gave Craigix on that pre-order.

You should have taken action long ago, but you sat on it, the last Pandora was manufactured over a half a decade ago as some of the parts are now unobtainium.
 
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whoever running the site and forums now who was also apart of the whole fiasco back then and still continuing to operate the business will still be held accountable. the consumers who at no fault of their own did nothing but place a order from the website that the current owner is operating from and taking orders from back then too and still continuing to operate, has nothing to do with the internal affairs within the site. Anybody from the outside looking in would say the customer is in the right. The court will see that you operating the business? then u responsible whether u gotta go handle it with that craig guy or reimburse the consumer its on u. Same if pizza hut take orders from ubereats, if ubereats go bankrupt then pizza hut will have to take care of the refunds even if they will feel like they arent obligated too. morally and ethically they would

if nikon or canon has a sub contractor who screw up or went out of business, they will take care of the customers that the subcon didnt fulfill. as for taking action a long time ago, i did, and met with the same responses im getting now. one minute u people saying u should have taken care of it years ago then another its i dont know why u keep whining about it when theres nothing that can be done. there was no solution that wiki mention for taking it to small claims court in the US. and obviously thats gonna require more labor and money that a customer shouldnt even be subjected to. cuz what was the other option they suggested? to simply wait. and many waited and got theres and i waited and inquired about it over the years and still havent and now yall blaming me for not spending every day stressing over this shit for years like others do
 
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To clarify i ordered from ED. YET i had to wait years.
UK orders where simply not fulfilled at one point but ED offered a discount for all damaged on his own shop.
 
elw3 said:
To clarify i ordered from ED. YET i had to wait years.
UK orders where simply not fulfilled at one point but ED offered a discount for all damaged on his own shop.
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then your commentary isn't needed if you weren't part of the queue that dude was talking about. thats like someone waiting in line for a PS5 and the announcer says Is everybody still waiting for a PS5 in this queue? and you come and say I got a PS5, then later say Oh but i wasnt waiting in that queue i was in a different line. why did u feel your commentary was needed? just to deceptively try to make it seem like they were respectable people or something? that is dishonest as hell

let me put it to yall like this. let's say Craig was the owner of the site, and lets say it was illegal operations like selling drugs or something. and ED say yo lemme get a section here to sell my shit in my region, put my shop up, u think if they get arrested that ED can still use that same excuse of him not being the main guy that he jus did it partially. he still will have to pay the price. especially if he took over operations later
 
That comment was directly at that line, because the situation was the same. I was asked to wait or pay more.
 
ponlork said:
if Elon takes over twitter he still has to take care of the baggage that came along with it. I purchased from this site, who still handles this site? why is it my responsibility to even know any of these people are. if it was to be taken to court i'll win
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@ponlork : there were risks involved in a project like that, I was interested a lot from the beginning, but took me two years to decide to place an order. The double store situation wasn't even clear for me at the time, I remember a single button for the order and I wasn't aware there was actually another store... anyway I followed the situation going worse with more and more issues delivering, and when Craig offered to jump the line by paying more, I just jumped in, i was completely sure that was an all or nothing situation, and luckily I got one of the last devices from the england store.
The fact that ED decided to keep alive the project was a good thing, even if just for replacements and repairing, but he can't send to people things he didn't sold.
 
ponlork said:
whoever running the site and forums now who was also apart of the whole fiasco back then and still continuing to operate the business will still be held accountable. the consumers who at no fault of their own did nothing but place a order from the website that the current owner is operating from and taking orders from back then too and still continuing to operate, has nothing to do with the internal affairs within the site. Anybody from the outside looking in would say the customer is in the right. The court will see that you operating the business? then u responsible whether u gotta go handle it with that craig guy or reimburse the consumer its on u. Same if pizza hut take orders from ubereats, if ubereats go bankrupt then pizza hut will have to take care of the refunds even if they will feel like they arent obligated too. morally and ethically they would

if nikon or canon has a sub contractor who screw up or went out of business, they will take care of the customers that the subcon didnt fulfill. as for taking action a long time ago, i did, and met with the same responses im getting now. one minute u people saying u should have taken care of it years ago then another its i dont know why u keep whining about it when theres nothing that can be done. there was no solution that wiki mention for taking it to small claims court in the US. and obviously thats gonna require more labor and money that a customer shouldnt even be subjected to. cuz what was the other option they suggested? to simply wait. and many waited and got theres and i waited and inquired about it over the years and still havent and now yall blaming me for not spending every day stressing over this shit for years like others do
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I'm confused there. This website is pyra-handheld.com and the forums were always ED's community forum. You bought your Pandora from openpandora.org which was Graig's, but still you mention it's the same thing.
Is it because they both are about Open-Pandora? Because the Open-Pandora was an open-source-like project, community driven and the development was driven by multiple people. The actual funding for mass production was handled by Graig's shop.
ED also has a shop which was reselling Graig produced Open-Pandora's. ED started production himself after Graig failed to deliver creating his own supply of products.

It's like two shops selling bread from the same factory, but only one has a truck to pick-up the bread. The shop you ordered bread from fails to deliver and ceases to exist and you go the second shop that also sells bread, claim they have to provide you bread as they work with the same delivery truck. You even have a picture that your shop said there were multiple shops that sold bread, including the one that still exists. And you can prove the truck was owned by the same guy that sold you bread.
 
Let’s just say the Pandora was pre kickstarter. You made an investment, it fell through. You waited 10 years and decide to complain now. Kinda dumb that you’re even wasting our time here.

Go after Craig if you want to pursue this as a legal matter, ED has nothing to do with this. Hell even Jacqueline is related to Craig.
 
No matter how elaborate you can string together false analogies to make your case, this entire thing is on you, you had options you could have taken, but that time has passed. You got screwed, much like I did on several kickstarters. Is it fair no, but shit happens, there is nothing productive that will happen complaining here.
 
Craigs location is unknown right? We should hunt him down, ransack his house, take his Pandora's.
 
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PowerGod said:
@ponlork : there were risks involved in a project like that, I was interested a lot from the beginning, but took me two years to decide to place an order. The double store situation wasn't even clear for me at the time, I remember a single button for the order and I wasn't aware there was actually another store... anyway I followed the situation going worse with more and more issues delivering, and when Craig offered to jump the line by paying more, I just jumped in, i was completely sure that was an all or nothing situation, and luckily I got one of the last devices from the england store.
The fact that ED decided to keep alive the project was a good thing, even if just for replacements and repairing, but he can't send to people things he didn't sold.
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yeah the problem was mines was a pre-order, if u click the archive link there was no link to another store, it was a link to a email. they didn't make any clear indication that there were two stores that had nothing to do with each other. let me ask you this, would it be considered a risk if a person purchased it in 2015 when it was readily available on the site in stock and ready to ship? there's different ways u can look at it. in 2010 was kickstarter even really a thing? most consumers were accustomed to purchasing products from sites and expecting it in a reasonable amount of time. even pre-orders were common. people weren't privy to this experimental crowdfunding idea like they are now

it's real easy for someone to deny involvement in something after the fiasco. it'll be like if a group of 5 people went to cabo for vacation and someone ended up dead. everybody will be like.. it wasn't me it was alcohol poisoning. it wasn't me it was the girl who got in the a fight with her. it wasn't the fight it was the girl who came afterward and piledrive her and broke her neck. it wasnt me it was the doctor who performed cpr on her and damaged her spinal cord.

its easy to deny things when you aren't under oath. meanwhile that person has all the pre-orders, the connects to the people constructing the product and continues to operate the business and sell from the site for years after the fact but they gonna pretend like they have no involvement at all
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Wally said:
Let’s just say the Pandora was pre kickstarter. You made an investment, it fell through. You waited 10 years and decide to complain now. Kinda dumb that you’re even wasting our time here.

Go after Craig if you want to pursue this as a legal matter, ED has nothing to do with this. Hell even Jacqueline is related to Craig.
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yeah get in line with the hundred other people from his other failed kickstarter campaign who are demanding refunds. im sure i can just cut in line and get top priority. this the dude ED chose to do business with but he gonna pretend like he has no hand in it. really i shouldnt even have to know who any of these people are, i ordered from this site that im posting on right now. whatever excuse is just deflecting to shift the blame to someone else
 
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Read again what you wrote in slow: Youve ordered something over EMAIL.
Like how professional do you expect that to be?
Did you go like: "Yea this guy is collecting money over email, i am 100% confident its a great business where nothing can go wrong"
Yea duh shit went wrong, deal with it.
 
elw3 said:
Read again what you wrote in slow: Youve ordered something over EMAIL.
Like how professional do you expect that to be?
Did you go like: "Yea this guy is collecting money over email, i am 100% confident its a great business where nothing can go wrong"
Yea duh shit went wrong, deal with it.
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everything is a risk if you put it like that. then will u say this site is dishonest and untrustworthy or have any responsibility in the deceptive practices of having a email that people can contact to inquire about placing a pre-order? Even when we seen the first batch being shipped out and it's already being produced and showcased on youtube by various users so it's the consumers fault for building trust in a company. yeah way to blame the victim, it's your fault for trusting us. btw why dont you tell pyra to remove the email from their site since u consider it deceptive and risky. how does that make the consumers on this site feel knowing that this is how this site operate and how their staff members think.

what people dont anticipate is if something goes wrong they usually assume that they'll be at least reimbursed. people dont usually assume that everybody in small grassroots companies are despicable human beings with no morality especially when there were no signs at the time to indicate that these were piece of shit people
 
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No one was a piece of shit here. No one was trying to steal your moneyz, it just happened to be spend and the person who did the failed planning left, the money is gone. There is nothing to be done here.
And there where enough signs that this can happen, most who ordered where aware of that. The order being done by email should made that clear.
 
elw3 said:
No one was a piece of shit here. No one was trying to steal your moneyz, it just happened to be spend and the person who did the failed planning left, the money is gone. There is nothing to be done here.
And there where enough signs that this can happen, most who ordered where aware of that. The order being done by email should made that clear.
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from the outset email was used for all orders and is still being used today. to be specific, google checkout was used as the payment processor on my end. before one try to blame the consumer they gotta admit the site was at fault for their incompetence. to say ED had no fault at all when he was the main one on the forums assuring consumers for years that everything is still going as planned even if there were little bumps and snags along the way, then when things fell apart try to claim that he had no responsibility and point the finger at anyone or anything but himself is ridiculous it shows how these people are pieces of shit.

you yourself agree that if your boss at your camera repair company was to abruptly quit that you would feel morally and ethically obligated to take care of the customers that the owner left behind. you would be a piece of shit not to correct?
 
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ED was a spokesman sure, but even he thought Craigix was going eventually going to straighten things out and not flake out and ditch this project. Forcing people to yes turn to him to fix the issue, it still doesn't make him responsible for Craig's customers.

So you lost money, big deal it happens it's only a few hundred dollars, I've wasted more on Kickstarters that evaporated, or on ebay purchases that ended up being a mistake.
 
oh and selling pandoras on the site having them in stock while those who paid early still waiting for theirs isn't unethical at all right? imagine someone paying years earlier and they seeing the unit in stock that someone can just come in and pay for at the same price while those who paid years earlier still waiting to receive theirs. i guess he can blame Craig for that too right

nowhere on the site it indicated that there were two separate entitles with no relation to each other when placing a pre-order. if they made that distinction clearly then maybe he get a pass but consumers see a site named after the product they assume they purchasing a product from the company of the official site that's making the product. Trying to drag the consumers into the internal affairs of the company is ridiculous
 
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