Do we really need a full sized USB host port and HDMI?

[Grench]

Most Samsung phones these days ship with an MHL port that, in theory, allows the user to output 1080p HDMI video through the otherwise microUSB sized port via an adapter.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_High-definition_Link


Could that eliminate the need for a dedicated HDMI port?


If we had one MHL/microUSB 2.0 port


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_High-definition_Link


and one microUSB 3.0 port (backward compatible to 2.0)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usb_3.0


If we had those, would the need for a full sized USB host port and HDMI port be eliminated?

 

[Exophase]

MHL should be okay so long as it's not the kind that requires a separate power source for the adapter cable.

 

[DaMummy]

what eliminates miniHDMI? and what if you want to play stuff on your external drive? dont combine the two

 

[bismuthdrummer]

The USB port being highly interoperable, I would argue strongly for it to be full-size as most of my peripherals have full-size plugs.


I would argue that, but I won't since it won't make any difference to OPT.

 

[Exophase]

I would argue that, but I won't since it won't make any difference to OPT.

FWIW Craig, MWeston, and afaik ED are all pretty staunchly behind keeping a full sized USB port. I'm guessing Grench is trying to push alternatives in order to recover more space for full size SD slots.

 

[bismuthdrummer]

FWIW Craig, MWeston, and afaik ED are all pretty staunchly behind keeping a full sized USB port. I'm guessing Grench is trying to push alternatives in order to recover more space for full size SD slots.

Ohhhhh. Now that's an interesting bargain, not sure I could give up full-size USB though... both are dealbreakers for me actually. :/

 

[Exophase]

I like both too, but would probably also take SD + microUSB over microSD + USB if that were actually on the table.

 

[ibisum]

We should definitely accomodate the ability to use things like the Motorola Lapdock in the future Pandora revisions - at least, not use non-standard connectors and such.

 

[Binky]

Is this the same grench that was so staunch a supporter of twin fullSD?


microUSB is mechanically flawed


a combination (as suggested) would mean that Everything(!) needed an adapter.


pandora != smartphone


pandora >smartphone


---


Having owned a Pandora for a little while, my current preferences would be for a slightly wider (left to right) unit with one fullSDXC4.0, one fullHDMI, one fullUSB3 one microUSBotg and as much built-in NAND as is available.

 

[FaeMinx]

^ I would buy one of those...


Except instead of NAND I want a microSD slot.

 

[Binky]

My ideal P2 connector/storage setup (not including DVB/gyro/other sensors):

fullSDXC4.0 (one of these, I have found no use for two, but I find one fullSD slot VERY useful)

fullHDMI (video out without adaptor cables)

fullUSB3.0 (USB without adaptors)

microUSB3.0otg (high-current charging and file transfer in mass-storage mode)

microSDXC (used as an extension to NAND)

BT4.0

Fast, long range wlan b/g/n/whatever

(tweaked in light of the below post)

3.5mm headset jackextra space would come from making the unit slightly wider. - making the P2 one cm wider (not an unreasonable size) yields 8.4cm2 of pcb space, which is enough for one extra full-size SD slot


making in 1.5 cm wider --> 12.6cm^2 --> one fullSD and a fullUSB port or microSD slot. Even more if some minor components could be moved to the top surface of the pcb.


Seems like a worthwhile tradeoff to me...

 

[Exophase]

No one's putting NAND in DDR packages anymore, so you can cross off getting it PoP. So instead your options are to solder down something like eMMC or put a microSD slot.

 

[kingoddball]

eMMC worked well in N900. If they can find larger (1GB/2GB) ones, would be great.

 

[FaeMinx]

eMMC worked well in N900. If they can find larger (1GB/2GB) ones, would be great.

Why limit to 1 or 2gb? A microSD is much better.


Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2

 

[Binky]

Cue droll remark about miniSD

 

[_wb_]

For good portability, minimizing the number of adaptors needed is a good thing. So I'm in favor of standard ports like full USB and HDMI, because that keeps things simple.


That said, I could live with an adaptor for video out, as long as 1) it doesn't use extra power, and 2) it is mechanically sturdy enough to allow using the P2 as a controller without having to worry about the cable disconnecting.


I could also live with microUSB only, since that is reasonably standard, adaptor cables are easy to find, and you don't really lose anything since you can still use any USB device at full speed. But it would be nicer not to need an adaptor cable.


I agree with Exophase that full SD + microUSB is better than microSD + full USB. The reason is simple: with either USB port you can use any USB device, but with a microSD slot there is no reasonable way to use SD cards.

 

[Binky]

you don't really lose anything

I disagree strongly on this one!


With my current pandora I leave a wifi dongle in most of the time to supplement the built-in hw


at other times I can just grab any USB stick and plug it into the back. Having adaptor wires everywhere would ruin this functionality


As I posted in a new topic, people like a pocket laptop, not a glorified smartphone

 

[_wb_]

you don't really lose anything

I disagree strongly on this one!


With my current pandora I leave a wifi dongle in most of the time to supplement the built-in hw


at other times I can just grab any USB stick and plug it into the back. Having adaptor wires everywhere would ruin this functionality


As I posted in a new topic, people like a pocket laptop, not a glorified smartphone

Yes, I agree adaptor cables are really annoying, and for this reason full USB is to be preferred. What I meant by not losing anything was purely in terms of specs: it's not the case that a microUSB port is slower than full USB or can carry less power or anything like that. (While for full SD vs microSD you do really lose something: there are SD cards available with capacities and speeds that are simply not available in microSD)


I think we need both a full USB port and at least one and preferably two full SD slots. Since this was possible for the Pandora 1, I really see no reason why it would not be possible for the Pandora 2, especially considering that most of us seem to agree that a small increase in the X and Y dimensions would be fine (as well as a small decrease in the Z dimension, so the total volume would still be smaller than that of the P1, but in this case (available pcb space), it's the area that counts, not the volume).

 

[Grench]

For HDMI: How about skipping the MHL/USB/HDMI port entirely and doing it all in protocol over wifi?


http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-All-Share-Wireless-Display-Adapter/dp/B0089VO7MY


Yes, that is one expensive TV side dongle ($70).

 

[Exophase]

Please tell me you aren't serious. That's even worse than your suggestion to do it all over USB3, given how much extra power this will consume (also, $80, not $70).


No way is TV out such a low priority feature that it's worth reclaiming a little bit of board space at the cost of needing an expensive dongle. It's going to be coming off the SoC and they'd be foolish not to use it.


FWIW, if it's something like microHDMI you don't need an adapter cable, you can use a straight microHDMI to HDMI cable. The thing with USB host is that often if you need any you need more than one (or at least I find myself in these situations), at which point you need a hub and you can already use a hub that takes micro/miniUSB and gives several USB.