Cost. Ouch

[thefunkygibbon]

Hi,  I know this has been asked before, i have just finished looking at a thread talking about it which was a couple of years old.  The argument for the cost of the device was that Phones cost similar sort of price.  

Which, yes, at the time I guess they were.  But now you can get nexus devices and suchlike for 300 and thats for a device with a phone .. other devices without the phone capability are usually a lot cheaper. (ie tablets)

I had been following this project for some time up until probably shortly before its release where real-life took over and forgotten about it until now, where I was looking at buying one. 

Can Pandora really justify the cost of these any more?  

when 

a) a much more powerful device costs less

B) other devices such as the gp2x range which I have previously owned all did similar things (apart from the higher end console emulation/pc emulation/android) and cost a LOT less, even at the time.

I fully expect that people will reply to this moaning about this that and the other but I really just wanted to understand quite why it is so expensive... you can get a lot with £500 these days.

 

[rohezal]

You can get a classic one for 270€. I will get one of these when I can afford it^^.

 

[moxie]

If a Pandora is what you want, then it most certainly is worth it. That is, if you want the keyboard, the connectivity, the dual SDs, the gaming controls, the full linux distro...If that is what you want, then it is most certainly worth it, because there is nothing else that covers all those points. If what you want is something on which you can run some quick games, update facebook and check your calendar, then it isn't - Then you're much better off with a normal android phone. It all depends.

And, as rohezal points out, the entry point cost isn't that big. Particularly if you consider BPs comments that Alerino quoted above - That this is a device that needs to cover its own cost.

 

[Exophase]

It's far past the point of pricing based on what they think they can get away with in the market. This price is necessary to have any hope of even very slowly paying off old orders after OPT incurred lots of extra expenses due to various manufacturing issues, coupled with a general increase in manufacturing price that makes the current Pandoras about as expensive to make as the original preorders cost. For some people the price will still be reasonable, for others it won't be, and if you don't think so there's no point in anyone trying to change your mind. But it really has to cost this.

Make no mistake, it was never OPT's plan to sell Pandoras at cost, that'd be outrageous (one could argue they set margins too low but there were definitely margins). They just underestimated what those actual costs would be and they changed over the course of development.

If a new device is made, after all the original Pandora debt is clearer and all units are sent (optimistic scenario), I think a fair price will be decided based on manufacturing costs and market competition. I don't think they'll charge $700+ just because they had some number of customers willing to pay that for Pandoras at some point. But the price may still need to be higher than you'd like because various factors will still make it more expensive to manufacture than other products.

 

[MrBazil2k]

If somebody would ask me : "Would you buy a Pandora again, now, after 1 year of usage"

I would say "HELL YEAH !"

But I am exactly the type of person Alerino described up there : "retrogamer" and a bit of a "linux geek"

It is so exciting to follow this comunity and its development.

As long as you have some time to work yourself a little into this "Hellmachine" sent from "Heavens" everything is fine.

The native gamepad controls and the keyboard speak for themselves.

Those cannot really be replaced by any virtual touch screen gamepad layer.

The Buttons and the D-Pad give you so much more feedback while pressing compared to other devices.

Thumbs up from my side, I did not regret it !

Just read yourself a little more into this, have a look at the "http://repo.openpandora.org/" what sort of stuff is running on it and then decide for yourself.

 

[Grench]

Apples and Oranges and Bananas.

Cell phones are carrier subsidized - if you're going to compare devices to anything, be sure to use the unsubsidized price.  Even then, this is a device that is missing dual SD, gaming controls, keyboard, desktop software capabilities, audiophile grade sound hardware,  etc...  Adding that as peripherals would easily cross $500 by itself.

Tablets can be made very cheaply in huge volumes.  Still, to get similar capabilities to a Pandora, you're going to need to get a true desktop Linux install on one, add keyboard, game controls, dual SD slots and audiophile sound hardware.  Adding that as peripherals would easily cross $500 by itself.

The nearest neighbors to the Pandora in computing devices are probably the OQO and the Nokia 770 - neither of which has gaming oriented controls.

 

[TrashyMG]

I'm about to own my third one.. First Batch, Rebirth and soon 1Ghz.. Got to collect them all.

 

[vcoleiro1]

I would agree with what Exophase said.  It is expensive at the moment for a reason, to make some additional profit to clear the pre-orders.  Hopefully the price comes down after that.

One of the biggest problems at the moment regarding the Pandora is that it is seen as Emulation gaming device.  It's even marketed heavily as such - via the web site.   The problem with this,  is that as a gaming device it's not worth anywhere near it's price.   The sad thing is that UMPCs which the Pandora is also  , cost heaps.   If we want to try and turn the tide in the publics minds regarding cost , I think the UMPC aspect of the Pandora needs to be promoted much more heavily.  

 

[Mr_Loon]

I fully expect that people will reply to this moaning about this that and the other but I really just wanted to understand quite why it is so expensive... you can get a lot with £500 these days.

Hi & Welcome,

You can buy the Classic Pandora for Approx £240 + Delivery. That is excellent value IMHO.

Also, if you're looking to buy a mini PC with Hardware keyboard & Gaming Controls then buy a Pandora, there is nothing else.

Out of interest, what would you be willing to pay / consider good value?

 

[Link]

I've had people buy a Pandora.  Sell it to eventually learn and reorder because they missed it.  That says something.  But I'm biased because I've got a shop.  True story though. 

 

[2bit]

A big thing for me ( may not be so for you ) is that the Pandora is not made in sweatshops in Shanghai .

 

[thatgui]

A big thing for me ( may not be so for you ) is that the Pandora is not made in sweatshops in Shanghai .

This is also a nice bonus for me, but it is not entirely true: the basic building blocks of the Pandora (pcb, case, eletronic parts) are still all manufactured in China (and/or adjacent countries). Only electronic part placement on the pcb and assembly is done in Germany

 

[elwing]

that's true, but I doubt you can now buy any electronic manufactured product that is not partly done in china...

 

[ledow]

I've always wondered what it has cost, on average, to make a single Pandora.  I don't mean design, parts, assembly, etc. but what number you get if you take all the donations, investors, sales, etc. and divide it by the number of Pandoras that were produced by it.

I'm pretty sure it'd be quite an expensive device if you did that, but currently subsidised by donations, pre-orderers and investors so that it comes down to just - what I consider to be still - a big price.

And I had a GP2X too - probably a lot of people here did.  I bought a second for £50 for my family.  Though I would expect to pay more for something like a GP2X than, say, an equivalent mainstream console, when it first comes out, I don't see the Pandora price as at all competitive.  I think it's in a strangely fragile position that - if they wanted - any cheap Andriod tablet manufacturer could take over in a matter of months.  The fact that nobody has tried to copy it - even poorly - in four years (i.e. just make a tablet or small Android handheld, with a real keyboard and nubs) tells you that the market is small.

You can get an Android tablet with a much larger touchscreen for literally £50.  Add in design and manufacturing to use a smaller screen, put it in some kind of enclosure, and stick a keyboard/stick control on it and you could charge a fortune in profit and still beat the OP.


It's quite telling that some small Chinese manufacturer hasn't already done this in the intervening time.  Maybe at first they'd have barely beat the initial project's intended release date with some cheap hardware, but as time went on they could have beaten it to mass market with a superior product quite easily.

OP is a niche product and they charge a niche premium.  It's not going to be for everybody until the price really comes down and the production really ramps up.

 

[Kumaki]

Hi,  I know this has been asked before, i have just finished looking at a thread talking about it which was a couple of years old.  The argument for the cost of the device was that Phones cost similar sort of price.  

Which, yes, at the time I guess they were.  But now you can get nexus devices and suchlike for 300 and thats for a device with a phone .. other devices without the phone capability are usually a lot cheaper. (ie tablets)

I had been following this project for some time up until probably shortly before its release where real-life took over and forgotten about it until now, where I was looking at buying one. 

Can Pandora really justify the cost of these any more?  

when 

a) a much more powerful device costs less

B) other devices such as the gp2x range which I have previously owned all did similar things (apart from the higher end console emulation/pc emulation/android) and cost a LOT less, even at the time.

I fully expect that people will reply to this moaning about this that and the other but I really just wanted to understand quite why it is so expensive... you can get a lot with £500 these days.

This is a niche device, it is not mass produced cheaply by child slave labor.

You need any other reasons?

 

[padoro]

B) other devices such as the gp2x range which I have previously owned all did similar things (apart from the higher end console emulation/pc emulation/android) and cost a LOT less, even at the time.

At least to this question, you are giving yourself an answer about the higher price :rolleyes:

 

[Rockthesmurf]

@thefunkygibbon: If you specifically want a Pandora, then the cost of the Pandora has no comparison, it is one of the kind. Sure you can compare it to other devices that share similar technology inside, but bottom line is if these devices with similar components satisfy your needs and cost less than you should absolutely get one of them. But for a lot of people feel the Pandora offers various elements that you can't get elsewhere, so the Pandora is the only choice. Horses for courses as the say goes. I am a Pandora owner and very happy with it. I hope you join us, but if not I hope you find a nice alternative device that suits your needs!

 

[elwing]

Horses for courses as the say goes.

horses for main course you meant?

 

[Rockthesmurf]

horses for main course you meant?

Only if you can find-us one.

......I'll get my coat

 

[thefunkygibbon]

Hi,  I know this has been asked before, i have just finished looking at a thread talking about it which was a couple of years old.  The argument for the cost of the device was that Phones cost similar sort of price.  

Which, yes, at the time I guess they were.  But now you can get nexus devices and suchlike for 300 and thats for a device with a phone .. other devices without the phone capability are usually a lot cheaper. (ie tablets)

I had been following this project for some time up until probably shortly before its release where real-life took over and forgotten about it until now, where I was looking at buying one. 

Can Pandora really justify the cost of these any more?  

when 

a) a much more powerful device costs less

B) other devices such as the gp2x range which I have previously owned all did similar things (apart from the higher end console emulation/pc emulation/android) and cost a LOT less, even at the time.

I fully expect that people will reply to this moaning about this that and the other but I really just wanted to understand quite why it is so expensive... you can get a lot with £500 these days.

This is a niche device, it is not mass produced cheaply by child slave labor.

You need any other reasons?

Its not put together using child labour, but the parts may well have been so that kind of negates your reasoning.

thanks for all the replies.  yes i know its niche,  i love linux and love retrogaming.  but i'm struggling to justify such an expensive purchase.  I've had ubuntu running on my phone and tablet, had all number of emulators running on it.  I've ordered a bluetooth controller which clips onto the phone which hopefully will make gaming on my mobile much more agreeable. (touch screen is crap for non-touch designed games,  as we all know)