Official Gp32 Vs Other Handheld (zodiac, Etc.)

[Squidge]

Both Z1 and Z2 have 8mb of heap ram (RAM directly available to applications via the standard c calls Malloc/etc).

Z1 has 20mb of storage ram which can be used to store data files, programs, roms etc. Z2 has about 115Mb.

It's incredibly slow to write to storage memory from an application, but it's possible. Reading is just as fast as normal ram, so emulators such as LJZ try and store the rom your playing into this type of ram as it's not modified once loaded into memory. It also means you have more ram to play with for data which needs to be modified.

Both the Z1 and Z2 also have 8mb of ram dedicated to the graphics controller. You can use this ram for data storage by telling the graphcis controller it's graphic data.

The graphics controller supports functions such as talking a small area of screen (say 160x160 or whatever) and stretching it to fullscreen with full smoothing to make it look excellent with no CPU performance hit whatsoever.

 

[pixelator]

Not all emulators are commercial. Theres Castaway, Columbo, LittleJohnZ (public soon), ScummVM and GuineaPig amongst several more.

I didn't say they were all commercial, but it's apparent that a much larger percentage require $$$ than say, the GP32 (or PocketPC). Check ZodiacGamer (although they list some commercial products as freeware, like Xcade).

There are a few homegrown games made specifically for the Zodiac such has TetriAttack, PacMan remake off the top of my head and many many Palm OS games which are Zodiac compatible or enhanced.

If you consider all the PalmOS homebrew stuff, then there's a lot. But specifically for Zodiac (in other words - supporting HVGA and the Imageon features) - there's just a tiny fraction compared to the GP32 or GBA. I don't know if I'd chalk that up to availability. After all, the GP32 isn't even available in the USA, but several contributors to the software scene (and this forum) are American.

Neverwinter nights is expected by the end of this year so its not cancelled. Duke Nukem is ready for release and should be on sale next week. Theres several other Zodiac specific games in the pipeline.

The word on Neverwinter is 2005 -- that's from the emuforums Zodiac board where someone spoke to Tapwave. Duke keeps getting pushed back so I'll believe it when I see it. As for the other games in the pipeline, if these two BIG titles took this long (and longer) to arrive, I hate to think what'll happen to the others. This is a big complaint of existing Zodiac users: There's a sticky for it on the emuforums. Unfortunately, larger publishers are not interested in the Zodiac (or the GP32). The Tapwave presence at E3 (which I attended) was almost nil. That's never good for something that's supposed to be gunning for big-name support in terms of software publishing. As I mentioned elsewhere, I suspect the Zodiac will be the USA version of the GP32: Good home dev scene, lots of cool emus, but less commercial software development.

Price is more expensive, everyone knows that but remember you are getting alot more for your money when compared to a GP32 Blu. Larger screen, more memory, faster CPU, Graphics and Sound chips, Touchscreen, bluetooth, infra red etc. I wrote a comparison chart a few months ago on these forums.

The screen isn't that much bigger, but the other aspects I noted in my previous post. The Zodiac is the clear winner on paper, although I'd disagree that the $399 model is worth the money. $400 is just too much a portable game system - even more than the PSP is likely to be at intro. It'll be interesting to compare some of the more prominent emus on both to see how they perform... As well as some of the better games. I have this feeling that the original commercial games on GP32 probably take better advantage of the hardware.

If you visit the Zodiac Gamer forums you will see hardly no posts about the joystick problem now.

Another concern is the theory behind the analog controller on a handheld device - not necessarily the reliability. I've played with a Zodiac and it felt like I'd have less control if in a moving car or other transit mode with that stick, compared to a simple digital d-pad. Possibly a minor quibble.

Who knows, maybe I'll wind up preferring the Zodiac - but for now the GP32 just seems like a more 'mature' system with more to offer someone like myself, who simply wants a multiplatform handheld emulator with a good screen and a few good original games.

 

[pixelator]

One other note - I owned a CLIE NX70V until recently, which in some ways is rather similar to the Zodiac1 (PalmOS, 200MHz, HVGA display). It only had 16MB of system RAM, and any web browsing was almost useless due to the heap (application) RAM being in such short supply. I'd get heap memory errors if I loaded a page that was too large.

 

[Fergus]

I don't own either a GP (yet) or a Zodiac, but I have been reading these forums for a couple months now, and comparing both the GP and the Zodiacs, and I just don't think that any advantages the Zodiac have warrant a $400 price tag. And like many people, I plan on getting a handheld so I can play classic games in my car, and the GP does all this and still stays a buck fifty under the Zodiac! Sure, the GP is not a portable XBox, but it is not trying to be, either. If somebody wanted to, they could make a handheld Pentium III if they wanted, but I bet you they couldn't keep the cost under 300 bucks!!!

 

[pixelator]

One new wrinkle I hadn't been aware of before is the Tapwave mandated approval process that requires all (even homebrew) programs to be 'signed' before release. What a tremendous load of horse crap. Who do they think they are, Sony and Nintendo?

IMHO, the Zodiacs both need to be dropped a full $100.00 if they expect to sell any decent volume through CompUSA in the few months before the Nintendo DS arrives. If not, it's basically through as a viable game platform with big names producing for it. Which is not to say it can't still assume the role as the 'GP32 of the US' (provided Tapwave relaxes their developer restrictions and more freeware emus make the scene).

Just my two cents as yet another mouthy, opinionated dude who doesn't even have either device in his clutches, yet (thanks to DHL). :blink:

 

[generalnmx]

Alright alright, you guys win. I will sticky this thread and merge all future "Zodiac vs GP32" topics debates into it. I've made it the official "GP32 vs Handheld" thread so you can also talk about GP32 vs Gizmondo vs Gametrac vs Eve, etc.

I don't own a Zodiac so I don't think I can rightfully make any comparison. The only one I feel I can make is that the GP32 is a heck of a lot cheaper.

 

[PinkSpider]

If it wasent for the imminent PSP/ Nintendo DS I would be buying a Zodiac myself... but the GP32 does enough for me

I dont see what people have against it myself... it looks nice and powerful but I dont like the way you have to pay for some stuff :/

Anyways off to Pub to get drunk before I meet people.

 

[generalnmx]

I was originally going to make this the "Official GP32 vs Zodiac" thread, but then I thought it would be better worth it to make it the "Official GP32 vs Everything" thread. Since we've had SO many GP32 vs Zodiac arguments, I didn't think JUST a thread on GP32 vs Zodiac warrents each post being on the front page (and especially because threads like this can get VERY long). But I guess this new thread does deserve to be in Other Consoles now that I have changed it's meaning.

 

[Magellan]

One new wrinkle I hadn't been aware of before is the Tapwave mandated approval process that requires all (even homebrew) programs to be 'signed' before release. What a tremendous load of horse crap. Who do they think they are, Sony and Nintendo?

Unsigned apps work fine. They only need to be signed by Tapwave if the app makes calls to the Z specific API's.

 

[Vimacs]

the zodiac is only "slightly" better than the gp.
but it have absulutly nothing that makes it worse twice the price.
and tapewave should overthink that licencing part its just plain stupid.

 

[Johndifo]

The ATI chip, the YAMAHA audio and more memory, make the Zodiac a better machine, I prefer the SD cards also, and the screen seems to be very good, on the other side the fixed batery seems to compromise portability a little.

I think SONY PSP will be a very closed and protected machine, may take a long time for home coders to break in.

Expect more machines like Zodiac arrive, its very easy to take a Palm or PocketPc and adapt it to horizontal handling with right buttons and a left pad.

In conclusion: Zodiac its a good machine, better than GP32 in hardware specs, but lacks the software, and when better than GP32 software land on Z, either emus or home games, there is a very high possibility that much better machines than Zodiac also appear on the block making Zodiac obsolet, very much like the recent 3d card war.

Meanwhile GP32 its a wonderful piece of tech love. I love it.

 

[khephren]

I think if you want PDA functions, then the zodiac is a very good buy. If you want a pure games machine, then it is very operpriced (I mean, it haqs plenty of ram, but only a slightly larger screen, and only 34 MHZ faster than my GP, just not enough gains in my opinion) especially with the the DS,PSP ans Gizmondo on the horizon.

 

[triksR4rabits]

Im really with pixelator on the 100$ price drop- hell, if I could get a 128 Z for 300$ I'd be enjoying the best of both worlds right now. But as it is- I say what Vimacs says; I dont feel, at this point, its worth so much more cash. Damn those blus look crispy... puts my flu to shame <_< (sorry for straying a bit but it does lol)

 

[DarkMetroid]

Can the Zodiac be overclocked higher than 200Mhz? Even tho 200Mhz should be enough power for its emu's but I wouldnt mind owning one but it still costs too much. The Zodiac commercial games seem kinda weak so when Tapwave dies out developers wont have to get thier emu's signed by tapwave anymore right? That must be such a hassle for the coders but I can see the Zodiac succeeding in the homebrew scene after the company dies out then coders wont have to get thier projects signed and hopefully everything would be free

 

[Enslaved]

Doesnt the Zodiac need CPU power for the OS? If yes then if Craigs new experiment to OC to 200mhz on GP32s should make them better CPU wise right?

 

[The Moose]

To me, this all just seems like deja vu of the late 80's- 90's, Except its not a console war, its a handheld war. What truly scares me right now about this is, we all saw sony, and how they crushed everyone in THAT war of the consoles, and as much as I hate to admit it, I think they could do the same again with handhelds. (poor DS)

But I digress In the USA, gamers arent as vast as they use to be. Of course, people have always been playing for graphics and violence, but those people are much more the reason that we are getting hammered by useless and very linear videogames today. And because of the sex, violence and tEh 3d, they are selling like hot cakes. Emulation and Homebrew can sell a good machine, as we've all seen with the GP32. BUT... When people here see the Zodiac on a shelf near a DS or PSp, duh! No one is going to buy a machine that pales in comparison with...

DS and PSp's 3rd party support (aka NO GOOD GAMES ON BOARD!!!

The fact that there buying something with a supeper high price point from a no name company


It just wont work, I dont think. Especially when anyone intrested in Portable Emulation as a cheaper, and equally as viable choice: gp32_console

 

[generalnmx]

I'd rather have a GP32 then a PSP or Zodiac personally. I actually use a tiny (paper) notepad and my mobile phone for all my PDA needs, and the GP32 fills all of my time-wasting needs on-the-go and more for an excellent price. The Zodiac is just too pricey for me. The PSP will be even more expensive, and can't compare to the power of emulation in my mind. But I'm an old-time pixel lover - I can have just as much fun playing Rogue as playing FF7.

I think all children of the SNES, Genesis, and especially NES days would go for a GP32 or perhaps (Zodiac if they're rich), if they knew of the GP32 and Zodiac's existance. I don't list children older then that since they're not really the PSP's main demographic

 

[skeezix]

One new wrinkle I hadn't been aware of before is the Tapwave mandated approval process that requires all (even homebrew) programs to be 'signed' before release. What a tremendous load of horse crap. Who do they think they are, Sony and Nintendo?

IMHO, the Zodiacs both need to be dropped a full $100.00 if they expect to sell any decent volume through CompUSA in the few months before the Nintendo DS arrives. If not, it's basically through as a viable game platform with big names producing for it. Which is not to say it can't still assume the role as the 'GP32 of the US' (provided Tapwave relaxes their developer restrictions and more freeware emus make the scene).

Just my two cents as yet another mouthy, opinionated dude who doesn't even have either device in his clutches, yet (thanks to DHL). :blink:

Just an FYI..

The GP32 also requires signing if you hadn't noticed. That means pretty much *every* ganmign handheld does (The GP32 requires use of the Free Launcher, or a modded ROM like Spivs MFW, etc. A Free Launcher for Zodiac is doable but no ones writteon one yet.)

Signing is fast and easy.. I had CaSTaway signed in about 30 minutes from them. Nice.

Signing is a *requirement* by the *industry* -- if your device doesn't require signing, game devs will NOT come and deliver games.. they fear piracy, and signing is the only way to fight it in industry eyes. This is why TW requires signing Zodiac enhanced apps, but they will sign any app for free, quickly.

(Signing has never help up anything.)

I'll not enter into GP32/Zodiac wars; they are both small guy brothers in arms. People who diss one or the other need slaps.

They are both great devices, with overlap but overall different purposes; you're certainly not going to use a GP32 for PDA work, nor are you going to run linux on your Zodiac. Deal

jeff

 

[Enslaved]

The new GP32 BLUs do not need signing. They will play whatever is on the SMC which will give it a larger audiance because it is hassle free.

 

[diablo2]

i would love to see microsoft get into the fight