Svideo Out?

[emil10001]

S-video is always interlaced as far as I know. Aside from that, no true widescreen resolution can be done with NTSC. There's a possibility we'll see anamorphic widescreen (shrunk and re-stretched)...but...

The reason I ask is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-Video#Overview
QUOTE
S-Video leads to sharp images (approximately 700×486 pixels edge-to-edge when using a clean DVD source)

 

[Chip]

The reason I ask is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-Video#Overview
QUOTE
S-Video leads to sharp images (approximately 700×486 pixels edge-to-edge when using a clean DVD source)

That's more of an approximate maximum. S-video and Composite signals don't actually have a set horizontal resolution. No matter what resolution the video you send over an S-video cable, it is up to the display on the other side to render it in the correct aspect ratio. Most older tube sets will display a 4x3 picture no matter what you send it. Most newer HD sets will allow you to "stretch" video to fill the screen.

I do not know if the TV-out circuitry is converting the 800x480 (5x3 AR) to a letterboxed 4x3 image, or if it's just passing it through as-is. Either way, the image you get on your TV will not be as detailed as what you see on the Pandora's display. It will be fine for movies and older lo-res games, but anything that requires pixel-perfect detail will look a bit blurry. That's just the nature of the beast.

 

[Squidge]

Don't get me wrong, I would love HDMI/DVI, and it is one reason I might get a BeagleBoard next year. But with every handheld you have to set boundaries.

Yes, it HD has been discussed a number of times. It was decided each time to be little used, not practical to implement, and costly (gaming device, remember?).

Basically, you have one digital output from the SOC, you can run this either to a LCD or a HD/DVI port (via appropriate chips). It starts getting complex and costly to add both, and you can't say to people "you can add the module in later" as then you have to cope with things like impedance mismatch.

So the beagle runs the connections to a DVI transmitter, and the Pandora runs them to an LCD.

 

[alterdimension]

Do you think that the wiz will have tv out? If this is already been in the forums, sorry. Also, how do you charge the wiz? I heard it will charge with a usb cord. Does anybody know if it uses if there is another way to charge the wiz because (I) won't be able to charge in the car(unless this has changed) When you get to your destination and have no acces to a comuter, how do you charge up? Is the usb the only way to charge?
Does it still use sd cards? When you are a passenger and the wiz runs out of power before you get to the destination, what can we do? Can you use a seprate power source like a wall plug like the gp2x?

 

[Illuminerdi]

I've got it!

If you want to get full res out of the Pandora you just start a VNC server on it and then...get a beagleboard and run VNC client on it!

 

[ShyGuy]

I've got it!

If you want to get full res out of the Pandora you just start a VNC server on it and then...get a beagleboard and run VNC client on it!

Hah, overkill

Plus no movies or games!

 

[Prometheus]

Do you think that the wiz will have tv out? If this is already been in the forums, sorry. Also, how do you charge the wiz? I heard it will charge with a usb cord. Does anybody know if it uses if there is another way to charge the wiz because (I) won't be able to charge in the car(unless this has changed) When you get to your destination and have no acces to a comuter, how do you charge up? Is the usb the only way to charge?
Does it still use sd cards? When you are a passenger and the wiz runs out of power before you get to the destination, what can we do? Can you use a seprate power source like a wall plug like the gp2x?

Well, this is the Pandora section, but...

The info-sheet for the Wiz is here if you want to have a read of it. I can't see any mention of the machine having TV-out capabilities, but I could be mistaken. It does take SD Cards. The sheet mentions that it can recharge via USB or AC power - I would personally guess that this means you can use one of those USB wall-adapters with it (I don't know if they will supply one or not, however). This would also mean that you could probably use a USB car cigarette lighter adapter to charge whilst in a vehicle.

I hope this helps.

 

[Tom`]

Do you think that the wiz will have tv out? If this is already been in the forums, sorry. Also, how do you charge the wiz? I heard it will charge with a usb cord. Does anybody know if it uses if there is another way to charge the wiz because (I) won't be able to charge in the car(unless this has changed) When you get to your destination and have no acces to a comuter, how do you charge up? Is the usb the only way to charge?
Does it still use sd cards? When you are a passenger and the wiz runs out of power before you get to the destination, what can we do? Can you use a seprate power source like a wall plug like the gp2x?

Well, this is the Pandora section, but...

The info-sheet for the Wiz is here if you want to have a read of it. I can't see any mention of the machine having TV-out capabilities, but I could be mistaken. It does take SD Cards. The sheet mentions that it can recharge via USB or AC power - I would personally guess that this means you can use one of those USB wall-adapters with it (I don't know if they will supply one or not, however). This would also mean that you could probably use a USB car cigarette lighter adapter to charge whilst in a vehicle.

I hope this helps.

The Wiz has pins on the EXT port that could theoretically do TV-out, but GPH was unable to get it working properly in time for launch. This means that it could come in a future firmware update, or it could be done by the community. Of course, there are no guarantees.

 

[Arialia]

I'm happy it is not HDMI / DVI :
i have none except the monitor for my computer ( it was broken and my husband buy it and repair fo few euros )

All my TV are analog not digital ( they works very well and have no money to 'waste' in HDMI/DVI ) and i think i am not alone in this forum ...

I have only money for pandora ( hard , i don't know if i can buy it on pre-order) not for HDMI TV ( maybe in two years .... or when actual will broke)

So i'm happy with S-video ( PAL ? * ) or composite

 

[emil10001]

The reason I ask is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-Video#Overview
QUOTE
S-Video leads to sharp images (approximately 700×486 pixels edge-to-edge when using a clean DVD source)

That's more of an approximate maximum. S-video and Composite signals don't actually have a set horizontal resolution. No matter what resolution the video you send over an S-video cable, it is up to the display on the other side to render it in the correct aspect ratio. Most older tube sets will display a 4x3 picture no matter what you send it. Most newer HD sets will allow you to "stretch" video to fill the screen.

I do not know if the TV-out circuitry is converting the 800x480 (5x3 AR) to a letterboxed 4x3 image, or if it's just passing it through as-is. Either way, the image you get on your TV will not be as detailed as what you see on the Pandora's display. It will be fine for movies and older lo-res games, but anything that requires pixel-perfect detail will look a bit blurry. That's just the nature of the beast.


I'm actually more concerned with having a good aspect ratio. I'd prefer widescreen, as that would allow me to use more of my screen's real estate. And I realize that most emu's and many games aren't widescreen, but I'd like the ability to use all of my screen; let the content drive what gets used. I guess that my question was coming from a guess that this stuff isn't really as standardized as it may seem, and that there seems to be some flexability in what might be sent over these cables, what the pandora can send, and what my tv will display. I guess as long as this is done in a place where I can find it and change (break) it, then that's fine with me (hopefully something like xorg.conf).

 

[abbibi]

What about a device that combines multiple frames of video into a larger screen? Four VGA frames combined makes a 1280x960 screen. This would reduce the frames-per-second to only 7.5 (with a ~133 ms lag), but I think it would be quite usable for office-style applications.

A design like this should produce only a minimal amount of processing overhead in the Pandora. Of course, I have no idea how to do this.

 

[RekTide]

HDMI / DVI out would have made this an entirely different class of device. For working as a computer, USB - video adapters will be fine, but for playing movies and games it'll be a non-starter... no powervr accel and a very limited usb pipe to the video unit. None the less, that usb-video convertor will be going with me everywhere.

Theres a few things I would have done differently on this device, but digital out is #1 on that list.

This isnt really a criticism; pandora does quite a lot of things. But video out has merit and I wanted to chime in with that opinion.

rektide

 

[JayFoxRox]

I know that hardware changes are impossible now, but that might be an cool option for the second revision: Why not make a software switch so users can change the video output from LCD to an port in the back (which is currently the S-Video out)?
There could be external HDMI or DVI chips producing the final signal. That way you could also have a custom plug - supporting both: S-Video and [HDMI or DVI]. This would add minimal production cost from what I can see.

 

[ShyGuy]

As it was explained earlier, I think the problem was that you have one digital output with the TI OMAP, and with the Pandora that's feeding the LCD. So to get a second output (even if you were using a software switch so they couldn't both be on at once - may as well just have them both going?), a lot of work would have to be done...I guess.

 

[tazg]

If you want to get full res out of the Pandora you just start a VNC server on it and then...get a beagleboard and run VNC client on it!

Hah, overkill

Plus no movies or games!




But...

If you've already got a regular desktop PC, you could run an X server on that, and retarget all the pandora apps to display their windows on the PC's monitor.
...why not do this on a beagleboard? You would need a usb or sdio wifi adapter for it, a total cost of about twice that of a usb to vga adapter, but the same size and way more flexibility. Not to mention way more geek points.

 

[Brockway]

If you want to get full res out of the Pandora you just start a VNC server on it and then...get a beagleboard and run VNC client on it!

Hah, overkill

Plus no movies or games!




But...

If you've already got a regular desktop PC, you could run an X server on that, and retarget all the pandora apps to display their windows on the PC's monitor.
...why not do this on a beagleboard? You would need a usb or sdio wifi adapter for it, a total cost of about twice that of a usb to vga adapter, but the same size and way more flexibility. Not to mention way more geek points.

o_o You sir are a GENIUS. Real pocket computer for like $150 + whatever you use for a case, plus it should run all the cool stuff Pandora's gonna get. I may try this anyways, but I'm still gonna buy a Pandora

 

[ShyGuy]

Err...you still wouldn't get video playback or games though. Exposing an X session has about the same speed concerns as using a VNC client.

 

[tazg]

alright, I thought it worked completely different. I find it hard to believe there's no way to stream properly like this these days though... hell I remember reading something about bluetooth monitors once.

 

[Brockway]

Err...you still wouldn't get video playback or games though. Exposing an X session has about the same speed concerns as using a VNC client.

Beagleboard has the hdmi->dvi out though, you wouldn't have to do an x session. Would work great for the guy who wanted to use it for portable presentations, theoretically.

 

[sdedalus83]

alright, I thought it worked completely different. I find it hard to believe there's no way to stream properly like this these days though... hell I remember reading something about bluetooth monitors once.

DVI has nearly 4 Gb/s of bandwidth, roughly 2000 times that of bluetooth, faster than the SATA II interface, and close to that of 60ns EDO RAM. You couldn't stream that out a whale's .... mmm never mind.