Progging.

[richiz]

Hi fellow programmers.


As I learn more and more Python and Pygame (predominantly for the Platforming coomp, ill have to do a vid soon) I'm wondering who on here, if any, are professional programmers.


And how do you get into programming when you didn't do a degree in it?


(I'm contemplating going back to school but I was I hoping to move to Prince Edward Island in Canada this June meaning I couldn't enroll to a college until I became a permanent resident which takes a few years)


Or is it impossible without a degree as it seems most employes want graduates (makes sense really


Many thanks

 

[bzar]

I code C++/python/javascript for a living. Before getting any formal education in programming I learnt mostly from online tutorials and books, though I must say I only really started understanding programming in university.

 

[- Theo -]

I do Java/C#/Javascript/anything professionally. I got a master's degree in CS (engineering), but I started programming and following tutorials when I was 9, on my home 8-bits computer, learning BASIC. Since that time (27 years ago), I never stopped.


And I agree, here in London, most companies I've worked in hire only people with a degree... I think you should try to get one as soon as you can, which should be easy if you code on your own before starting.


Also, the most efficient way to learn is not to follow a tutorial page by page. It's by trial and error. You want to code something, try it, and look for help in tutorials/forums as you go along, everytime you're blocked. Then after a while, you can read tutorials/books to consolidate. That's my opinion anyway.

 

[Thorium]

I code in BASIC, ASM and C.


I started on a C64 a long time ago. Never got a degree, i am a pure hobby coder. However i got some chances to become a professional coder. If you are good at coding (which will take some years) you actualy can get a job without having any degree. However, it's much easier if you have one.


For learning you need 2 books. A teaching book, that teaches you the basics and a reference book, that lists all the commands, etc.


Learning from tutorials is not realy working in my experience. Especialy if you are new at coding. You might get fast results, but it's unlikley that you realy understand whats going on. However, later if you have solid basics you can learn by reading tutorials about advanced stuff. It's just a bad way to start learning the basics in my opinion.

 

[cobrajs]

I have coded in C/C++/Python/JavaScript for a long time. I started in about 5th grade with QBASIC, after reading about programming in a book. I diddled around with it and learned all the basics, then moved up to Visual Basic and started making really lame games. A little while after this I was given a Palm Pilot, and I started writing C/C++ code for it using various frameworks. Switching from BASIC to C was a little jarring, but my dad had a ton of programming books so I was well off in that department. I got hired to do web dev in Python/JavaScript/etc. without a degree, and just kinda went with it. I later took some classes at university in CS, but went with Business Admin instead (kinda regret that). In the meantime I've continued programming games in Python with Pygame, and in C++ with SDL, along with script writing for Linux whenever I need it.


So, yeah, it is totally doable without a degree. A book really helps in learning, just pick a language to learn all the semantics of programming, then you can apply that to any language (you'll just need to learn the syntax). Wikipedia has a lot of great articles on algorithms and that kind of thing too, if you need them. And for hiring, you will need a lot of experience if you don't have the degree. Knowing people also helps

 

[Prosthetic_Mind]

http://projecteuler.net/ is a very useful site that will help you build your programming skills by giving you more and more complex mathematical problems designed to be solved by coding algorithms. It's a good way to give yourself goals that will allow you to build your logical programming skills as well as being a good way to prevent getting rusty at languages you don't use as often.

 

[levi]

I learned to code back when computers came with manuals that told you how to program them, and when magazines used to come with listings in the back to type in (though I learned some terrible hacks from those). These days the internet has far more information, and much of it better written - the only difficulty is learning to separate the wheat from the chaff.

 

[myownlittlworld]

If you're interested in learning more on Python, you should check out the awesome DiveIntoPython.org (I think?).


Psychology degree, programming as a hobby since 12... So that's... 13 years of programming stuff? Go figure. Read about what you find interesting! And Wikipedia's usually a good place to start.

 

[WizardStan]

As far as I'm concerned, you're well on your way to becoming a programmer already. It's like music, or art, or sports, or anything else really. If you want to get good at something, do it. Practice, practice, practice.

 

[milkshake]

the only issue is getting a job once you get good without a degree

 

[ceepee]

I've been working for a major international bank as a developer for 11 years now, I started here in java, but as they moved technologies have been writing .net (asp.net anc c#) for the last five years.


I haven't got an IT/CS degree (mine is in Media Studies! I wanted to be a sound engineer and my uni had a pro recording studio), but just kinda lucked into IT really. Moved from understanding systems in a temp job, into system testing, then developing.


I have been involved in recruitment of developers too and I certainly don't feel a CS degree is mandatory (but I suppose I wouldn't), skills/aptitude/attitude are far more important than qualifications.

 

[milkshake]

wow I like the sound of you I want a job in web development my repo website has been my first proper challange but its working out really well

 

[darfgarf]

grew up with a bbc micro, learnt basic at some ridiculously young age


college: a level computing (when it actually involved some programming, albeit visual basic)


uni(first year, electronics engineering general): formal C course, knew most of it from general programming anyway, but it helped a lot


second year had nothing, though i spent most of it programming for the dingoo/etc


this year: placement year at qualcomm, doing low level embedded stuff, with more languages than you'd ever need (asm/c/c++/tcl/python/java/etc/etc )


even though i've done formal courses that involve programming, i've learnt the most through the dingoo/pandora stuff, general programming of whatever is needed at the time, and this placement(9 hours a day coding will get you good pretty fast )

 

[Lazrhog]

Been a Professional Software Engineer for a long time. Mainly safety critical aeroplane systems. No Degree. Write games for fun (having wanted to do that for a living all those years ago, but never getting the chance ....)

 

[milkshake]

how did you come by that job? did they not require a qualification?

 

[ibisum]

Been a Professional Software Engineer for a long time. Mainly safety critical rail systems. No Degree. Write games for fun (having wanted to do that for a living all those years ago, but never getting the chance ....)

 

[Rygiz]

I'm wondering why you couldn't enroll in college without being a permanent resident. Is it just the costs associated with being an international student?

 

[Thorium]

Write games for fun (having wanted to do that for a living all those years ago, but never getting the chance ....)

You need contacts for that. Do some beta testing to get in touch with game developers and write some tools for games.


That way i was asked several times to join a professional team. I did one time but it didnt worked out because of social reasons. It was a startup that failed because of people just didnt do there job.

 

[skeezix]

If you want to get a _first job_, you need a diploma or a dgere, or find the rare guy who judges on merits and has a way to determine your merits.


But after a few years, your true value will outweigh the piece of paper often (but not always.) HR departments that do first-level filtering will almost always filter on easily verifiable things like paper, but good devs can often get in through the side door. But it all depends. Obviously, to get the widest net you need paper+skills (which are very much not the same thing.)


I'm a pro developer; self taught but also got some papers. As in all things-- the paper is to get general training and discipline, but you make of it what you will -- you can get a lot out of school, but the school will oly beat so much into you by default. But the real men do it for passion and claw their way into their topics of choice, for love of the game. People will pick up on that, and that gets you far.


The real defining quality of good coders is -- you see something, you take it apart and figure it out, and you want to learn more more MORE MORE. Everything else is gravy Thousands of grads come out every year, but only a few of them are Real Coder Hearts.


jeff

 

[milkshake]

Well im loving my current project I get a massive high from making things "work" finding solutions on how to accomplish things.