Planet Computers Gemini review thread

[rygD]

Less talk, more pics.

 

[ArchiMark]

Less talk, more pics.

You got it.....

Here's a few pics after installing Debian yesterday....dual booting with Android...

I selected KWin as WM....

If you look at pics, you'll see that you can auto-hide the bottom task bar to get some more vertical display height for windows...very helpful...

Still have to get keyboard mapping setup, etc...current image is a work in progress, but it does work...

Enjoy,

Mark

 

[rygD]

Your mouse is on the wrong side.

Let us know how it works out as a Linux box. I know it isn't polished yet, but I am curious what works smooth and what has problems.

 

[PowerGod]

Seems like the rounded corners of the display are covering some pixels

 

[ArchiMark]

Your mouse is on the wrong side.

I was just testing you guys to see if you're watching......you passed!

Actually, I'm left-handed....

Let us know how it works out as a Linux box. I know it isn't polished yet, but I am curious what works smooth and what has problems.

Will do.....

Although if you'd like to get an idea of state of current image, check out this page:

https://github.com/gemian/gemini-keyboard-apps/wiki/DebianTP

Seems like the rounded corners of the display are covering some pixels

Suppose so....but have not noticed any issue with this so far....

 

[mrpalmtop]

Less talk, more pics.

Here's one you directly inspired. It's my Gemini plugged in next to the Samsung Gear S3 Classic I use for notifications.

 

[rygD]

Yay!

The watch actually looks nice in that pic, and I am not really into wrist devices.

 

[Grench]

For 90% of the ones I'm seeing out there with volume controls, the volume control only works on iPhones. For the 'Android compatible' ones, they often require the user to download or even sideload an app - which shouldn't be necessary. Google's Nougat specs documentation includes up to 4 button headphone controls - not that there are any 'in the wild'.

Three button iphone remotes turn into one button Android remotes (volume controls don't work).

I found these as a 'cheap try'. They should be here Saturday.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B077BG89WM

I bookmarked these too, but that is a lot to spend on a set of earbuds imho. No idea if they're 'worth it'.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01M8OFIX3

But, so far those are the only ones I'm finding with an Android specific version that -should- work with volume controls.

Why so specific about needing a 3 button (or more) remote? Gemini has no outside volume control buttons and the one exposed button that could work for answering a call is on the opposing side to the headphone jack.
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It's a device without a camera and you want pictures? Oh, wait - ...

Seriously, what would you like a picture of that doesn't already exist somewhere? OESF has pictures of a 50% teardown. The unit looks like the one on the Gemini site. There are reviews showing the keys and Gemini specific application software. What is left that hasn't been covered?

So I now have the cheap earbuds above. The volume control, pause/play, next track and previous track functions all work on the Gemini - as long as the lid is open, Close the lid and playback continues, but the wired headphone remote stops working until the lid is reopened and unlocked. Maybe there is a setting somewhere that I need to figure out.

 

[rygD]

Monitor battery usage when/if you find that setting to see if the screen light is staying on.

 

[mrpalmtop]

Monitor battery usage when/if you find that setting to see if the screen light is staying on.

The screen shuts off right before the Gemini is closed. I just checked it visually.

 

[comradekingu]

Your right-handedness is on the wrong side.

 

[Grench]

I'm pleasantly surprised by this, but it looks like Planet Computers is moving forward with Android 8.1 on the Gemini!

I had rather figured that all of their efforts on the OS front were going to be focused on the Cosmo, so this level of ongoing support for their existing device is a very good sign.

 

[PowerGod]

How does work in this device the management of SMS/phone calls registers and everything phone related when you boot another OS ?

Does every OS shares the same areas/format for this kind of information ? Or if you receive an SMS while on Android it is saved in a way, and while in Debian in another, making every OS show only the ones received by itself ?
(same question for phone numbers management and all)

 

[levi]

I don't know enough about the Gemini, but traditionally phone chips have a little ram they can use to buffer messages before the OS can download them. I don't know how big this space is, but I assume you could at least store 1 SMS message, and if you don't download them while running debian, it'll still be there when you when you boot android.

Edit: Or the other way round, kind of, if Android receives and stores a message, you won't be able to access it in debian unless debian has a way to interrogate an android's storage.

Edit: And regarding phone numbers, technically you can store them on the SIM, but I don't use them these days. You're limited to one phone number per name, and the name is in all caps, and non of those fancy pants things like being able to store birthdays and addresses. I don't know off hand if Android even lets you write numbers like that to the SIM.

 

[Grench]

How does work in this device the management of SMS/phone calls registers and everything phone related when you boot another OS ?

Does every OS shares the same areas/format for this kind of information ? Or if you receive an SMS while on Android it is saved in a way, and while in Debian in another, making every OS show only the ones received by itself ?
(same question for phone numbers management and all)

How does it work? It doesn't. Debian on the Gemini is no more or less advanced than Debian on any other ARM phone platform. There is not much for an integrated dial or address book, etc. The Gemini boots Debian - great. Android is currently far more functional and livable on it.

If you were wanting to integrate contacts and what not between Android and Debian on the Gemini (or an Android phone and a Pyra for that matter), you would first need to find something to be the middle step. Google contacts, or a flat file dump/import. I.e. some form to extract the data from one platform then import it into the other. A phone database ETL? I am not aware of anything like that currently in existence.

So, at this point, I'm just going to keep Android as the primary OS on my Gemini. I'm glad to see they are issuing an update to 8.1. It adds some pretty good features.

 

[PowerGod]

Well, then phone functionality are not useful at all to me on this device...

I wonder if at least could be possible to consider "standard" the Android way, and then make all the other OS to write/read in the same areas and in the same way as Android does.

As similar example, I could use Thunderbird: I had a dual boot PC Windows/Debian, and I was using mainly Thunderbird on Windows... one day I started to use Debian a lot and I just had to tell IceDove (that's just Thunderbird with another name) to point to the Thunderbird profile in my Windows partition... and that's it... then I was able to reboot in every one of the OS having all my mails in the same spot and without the need to synchronize things...

This should be the way for phone things to be managed in an usable way for a device like this...

 

[Grench]

Well, then phone functionality are not useful at all to me on this device...

How so? It works fine as a phone under Android (with already noted peculiarities). I haven't found any device that fits in the pocket that makes a decent phone under Linux.

I wonder if at least could be possible to consider "standard" the Android way, and then make all the other OS to write/read in the same areas and in the same way as Android does.

Dear God no. When I run two OSs, it is largely because I WANT those OSs to be isolated from each other. I don't want any potential for one to read or write to/from the other unless I set up a bridging network on the device, have both running simultaneously and can restrict access rights accordingly.

As similar example, I could use Thunderbird: I had a dual boot PC Windows/Debian, and I was using mainly Thunderbird on Windows... one day I started to use Debian a lot and I just had to tell IceDove (that's just Thunderbird with another name) to point to the Thunderbird profile in my Windows partition... and that's it... then I was able to reboot in every one of the OS having all my mails in the same spot and without the need to synchronize things...

I never 'dual boot'. Too much potential for one OS to muck with the other. I DO use virtual machines extensively and can have several OSs running simultaneously on or server based VMs remote connected to via VPN from the machine I happen to be typing on.

This should be the way for phone things to be managed in an usable way for a device like this...

Well, you could store all of your contact information and most valuable digital assets in the cloud and connect to it from all of your devices. If you're even considering that, though, learn how to use local on-device encryption first.

Alternatively you could store your contacts in a portable format that both systems can read and save that on a microSD data card that both OSs can see - then Export/Import whenever you make changes.

None of the above makes up for the fact that actual phone functionality and contacts management is pretty much missing from Debian at this point in time. Sailfish OS adds a lot of those features, but cannot be sold in the US. I expect to be able to set up a Pyra data connection - but the hypothetical phone call to/from a Pyra? Yeah - I don't foresee that happening beyond a, "Hold my beer and check out what I can do with AT commands!" standpoint for several months or even a year after release. Someone prove me wrong - please?

This is not a Planet Computers Gemini problem to fix beyond supplying drivers to allow the OS access to the hardware. This is a Debian problem to fix - where the solution can live upstream and be accessible to any computing device.

When Planet Computers bragged that the Gemini would be able to use Debian, a lot of people thought this meant 'full functionality Linux phone with SMS and geolocation and contact management and etc.' Keep in mind that the Gemini was also sold as a WiFi only device - without any phone capabilities. The Gemini can boot Debian. Debian has not expanded out to properly support this kind of device & features - yet. The 'Linux Phone' has perplexed many companies with much much larger budgets and staff. See Ubuntu Touch / Ubuntu Phone.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_Touch
People expecting a tiny English company creating a niche handheld to solve the entire 'Phone on Linux' thing was a bit silly.

The Gemini is a pretty good Android device. If you try out Linux on one - just keep in mind that those capabilities are a side show.

 

[PowerGod]

How so? It works fine as a phone under Android (with already noted peculiarities). I haven't found any device that fits in the pocket that makes a decent phone under Linux.

This is the first issue for me. I was seeing this as a one shot replacement for a phone and a handheld at the same time, but if booting in another OS I lose the phone, then I'll need another device that stays a phone while I'm using this as a computer... so in the end this could be used ONLY as a computer in my view, and with this in mind there are far better handhelds without phoning capabilities.

Dear God no. When I run two OSs, it is largely because I WANT those OSs to be isolated from each other. I don't want any potential for one to read or write to/from the other unless I set up a bridging network on the device, have both running simultaneously and can restrict access rights accordingly.

I was speaking about just phone data (calls registry, messages, etc...) not OS things... I don't know how Android manages these things anyway, I never had a smartphone. And anyway, on my PC I actually want to access everything from both OS, with both OS... I'd hate the other way around (that mostly is when Windows can't see EXT partitions by itself...).

I never 'dual boot'. Too much potential for one OS to muck with the other. I DO use virtual machines extensively and can have several OSs running simultaneously on or server based VMs remote connected to via VPN from the machine I happen to be typing on.

My view is almost the opposite of yours... I hate VMs, you can optimize them as you want but them will never run good as the main OS, especially if you use them remotely. (Also I don't have a server farm as you, but just one PC, even old.)

Well, you could store all of your contact information and most valuable digital assets in the cloud and connect to it from all of your devices. If you're even considering that, though, learn how to use local on-device encryption first.

The only "Cloud" I ever used is the email provider... everything else is unacceptable for me. (Except maybe if the server is in my home.)
Also the exporting/importing things is unacceptable too... all OS should read the same data (still calls/SMS things, not OS related), because we are speaking of the same physical device, that already is containing that data !!

You seems to really like Android, maybe you have a use case very different than mine with that OS, my point of view with that device was to use Android just for calls because is faster to use, but no Apps or things with that, just Debian for everything else.
But if with Debian you have no phone or at least no data saved from Android, then I should have always to use Android... then thanks, it's clearly not the device I want.

The Pyra is a different thing, and while phone capabilities could be cool and all, I will never see it as a phone replacement, also I'll be happy if some day it will run Android, but I like that it's not the main OS.

 

[Grench]

So - I was doing a few tasks with my Gemini last night and I recalled seeing a few months ago that there was a Neverwinter Nights Android beta - so I downloaded the current version of that onto my Gemini.

So, last night I was logged into a Neverwinter Nights persistent world (Arelith) from a pocketable device with a physical keyboard - meaning that I could effectively interact with the game and other players in it. IMHO this just became the Gemini's, "killer application". A MORPG with effectively infinite content and variety without the monthly gaming fees (Neverwinter Nights) using a physical keyboard on a pocketable device.