Copyright Status Of Mame And Drmd?

[skaboy]

Dear all,

I have MAME and DrMD on my GP2X.

Although I can't claim to have owned any arcade machines, MAME seems pretty freely distributed and I was wondering about the legality of this. To be completely conformist, should I really remove MAME from my GP?

I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them.

Thanks as always in advance.

 

[fragglerok]

Dear all,

I have MAME and DrMD on my GP2X.

Although I can't claim to have owned any arcade machines, MAME seems pretty freely distributed and I was wondering about the legality of this. To be completely conformist, should I really remove MAME from my GP?

I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them.

Thanks as always in advance.

​

Both programs a free to distribute, what you cant do is distribute them with any rom files

 

[pantera6]

To be honesst i don't think it matters. nothing is going to happen to you if you do whatever you want to do.
Just depends if you feel guilty playing games you havnt paid for or not. As for your friend, give him a list of what to download.

 

[Mudi]

The emulators are legal to distribute to anyone. What might not be legal to distribute is the BIOS file from a PlayStation emulator, or ROMs (for obvious reasons).

 

[critical]

I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them.

​

I noticed that someone was trying to sell a "start up" SD on ebay recently, containing just the emulators and no ROMs. That might be fine for the GPL'ed emulators, for which you can charge whatever you can get away with, but I'm not convinced that Reesy would be ecstatic to learn that someone's profiteering from his hard work.

Here's an example ebay listing:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GP2X-setup-files-emu...1QQcmdZViewItem

I'd be interested to hear Reesy's thoughts on the legality of this, as it's not clear to me either.

 

[WrongEyedJesus]

I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them.

​

I noticed that someone was trying to sell a "start up" SD on ebay recently, containing just the emulators and no ROMs. That might be fine for the GPL'ed emulators, for which you can charge whatever you can get away with, but I'm not convinced that Reesy would be ecstatic to learn that someone's profiteering from his hard work.

Here's an example ebay listing:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GP2X-setup-files-emu...1QQcmdZViewItem

I'd be interested to hear Reesy's thoughts on the legality of this, as it's not clear to me either.

​

Ooh thats a bit naughty.

He does say you can donate to the writers of the emulators but still, it's making money out of someone elses efforts.

It is a bit slack.....

 

[Iorgy77]

He also includes the amiga and ST system roms... someone should report this auction.

 

[critical]

He also includes the amiga and ST system roms... someone should report this auction.

​

I reported it when I saw it yesterday. It appears to have been pulled now, either by the seller (who may have read this) or ebay, who may have responded to my report. I personally think the seller pulled it, but I could be wrong.

 

[FluffyPanda]

Well, the zip of DrMDx on the archive doesn't have a copyright notice at all.

*fires up DrMDx*

and nor does the emulator itself.

That's kind of surprising, actually. Since Reesey hasn't made any effort to claim copyright over his own work I think the law would say that you can distribute it as you please... possibly even claim it as your own (though the made by Reesey text would make that kind of hard).

skaboy: Fill an SD with stuff for your mate, you won't be breaking any laws or doing anything amoral. Just don't give him any roms that he hasn't already purchased the carts for.

critical: I think that the ebay auction, as it was written was pretty acceptable actually. He was at least clear about what he was doing (selling an easy way to get going) and mentioned that the software deserved donations. The only really dodgy thing was sending the system roms.

Of course, he may well have been infringing on certain copyrights by not obtaining permission to distribute work, but I'm not sure that anything he was shipping (roms excluded) actually required him to obtain permission. It may of, but it may not.

The same kind of auction could be done for an "ebay ebook" that tells you exactly what to put where and where to download it from. That would be 100% legal without any gray areas.

 

[skaboy]

Well, the zip of DrMDx on the archive doesn't have a copyright notice at all.

*fires up DrMDx*

and nor does the emulator itself.

That's kind of surprising, actually. Since Reesey hasn't made any effort to claim copyright over his own work I think the law would say that you can distribute it as you please... possibly even claim it as your own (though the made by Reesey text would make that kind of hard).

skaboy: Fill an SD with stuff for your mate, you won't be breaking any laws or doing anything amoral. Just don't give him any roms that he hasn't already purchased the carts for.

critical: I think that the ebay auction, as it was written was pretty acceptable actually. He was at least clear about what he was doing (selling an easy way to get going) and mentioned that the software deserved donations. The only really dodgy thing was sending the system roms.

Of course, he may well have been infringing on certain copyrights by not obtaining permission to distribute work, but I'm not sure that anything he was shipping (roms excluded) actually required him to obtain permission. It may of, but it may not.

The same kind of auction could be done for an "ebay ebook" that tells you exactly what to put where and where to download it from. That would be 100% legal without any gray areas.

​

Ta all,

I could've just copied a load of stuff without asking here but I wanted to remain above board and not upset any coders, nor deny them any dues.

 

[Gruntfuggly]

Well, the zip of DrMDx on the archive doesn't have a copyright notice at all.

*fires up DrMDx*

and nor does the emulator itself.

That's kind of surprising, actually.  Since Reesey hasn't made any effort to claim copyright over his own work I think the law would say that you can distribute it as you please... possibly even claim it as your own (though the made by Reesey text would make that kind of hard).

You don't actually need to claim copyright to have it - it's implicit. You might find it difficult to prove (that you have the copyright), but that is a different matter - and in this case I'm pretty sure Reesy could prove it beyond any doubt.

 

[Reesy]

If people want to pay for someone that they can download for free then who am I to stop them. I'm all for making money out of stupid people

I really doesn't bother me if people are selling DrMD. Anyone with a internet connection can download it. If people want to use their internet connection to log on to Ebay and BUY DrMD from there, then thats up to them. I can't imagine anyone ever being that stupid but as they say "theres a sucker born every minute"

 

[whiskthecat]

If people want to pay for someone that they can download for free then who am I to stop them. I'm all for making money out of stupid people

I really doesn't bother me if people are selling DrMD. Anyone with a internet connection can download it. If people want to use their internet connection to log on to Ebay and BUY DrMD from there, then thats up to them. I can't imagine anyone ever being that stupid but as they say "theres a sucker born every minute"

​

My thoughts exactly. I remember in Kindergarten I would trade nickels for dimes. :lol:

 

[skeezix]

Dear all,

I have MAME and DrMD on my GP2X.

Although I can't claim to have owned any arcade machines, MAME seems pretty freely distributed and I was wondering about the legality of this. To be completely conformist, should I really remove MAME from my GP?

I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them.

Thanks as always in advance.

​

Its actually very easy; I really don't know why virtually everyone on the net gets it all muckered up

Emulators themselves are generalyl fully legal; I'd say 100% legal except that it can vary by jurisdiction and relative insanities. ie: Emualtion as a technology is 100% legal -- always has, always will be -- and is a standard tool in computer science. (Ever wonder how Java works? Its an emulator. Wonder how applications are developed for mobiles, cars, and other things? yep -- emulators.)

The onyl question, with regards to emulator software is if they're including IP from someone else --- ie: Some emulators might include a BIOS or PROM dump for 'convenience', but this is clearly copying someone elses materials around so is not legit; hence, any halfway respectible emulator does not include such materials -- you need to find a BIOS (by dumping it yourself, or however you like).

To answer your question - MAME is 100% original software by its many authors (including a number of us from this very board ; it (and other emulators) are written by looking at schematics, the actual PCBoards making up the device and lookign up part numbers and deducing things from connections, and working out through the code used in the devices, and many other tricks. Not rocket science, just tedious and tricky. So its 100% legit, just like opening up your car and figuring out how it works is.

The only questionable thing is distribution of some other entities property -- BIOS roms, game roms, game disks, etc etc. This is obviously usually illegal -- being copyright infringement. (Its not 'theft', since nothing is removed from the party; it is infringement becasue you're illegally duplicating something you do not have license to.)

However, this is complex -- many companies provide permission to dupe their old games, while other games have lost their licenses entirely (company gone under, not bought, etc), while others are merely lost.. certainly most (99%?) of games are owned by _someone_, though only some are relevent (ie: SNES, NES, GB, Genesis, etc are very actiuvely used, and thus very clearly licensed. Amiga and Atari ST on the other hand... very much abandonware most of the time. Vectrex -- the company opened them up to use as you see fit, though they retain license etc.)

Again, it also varies by jurisdiction, however. The US has gone bizarre for instance, so even decrypting some encrypted games can be illegal; however, the DMCA allows for circumvention of sed encryption if the company nolonger supports it and you wish to transfer it to a new medium to make use of something you have purchased. Laws like that make you crazy.

I'm not in the US, so if you are.. you'll have to sort it out for yourself However, my guidelines above and in the past should clarify enormously.

jeff

 

[TelcoLou]

skeezix Post Today, 10:07 AM

Its actually very easy;

... followed by several million words :lol:

Here's an analogy for ya;

Sylvia Brown responded to a question regarding the afterlife by saying (major paraphrasing here);

"If you're worried about going to heaven, don't. Your concern is enough to get you in..."

This has something to do with you worrying about ROMS, but I can't quite explain myself with much clarity. Sorry

 

[Alpha2]

Sorta like: "If you're worried about being crazy, then chances are you're not"

Not sure it fully applies but yeah I agree, Distribute the programs all you want as long as you dont give people the stuff that makes it fun to have... or do just dont make a specical of yourself doing it as you're bound to run into someone who'd have an issues (valid or not) with what you're doing. It's only a problem if you get caught by someone in a position to do something about it. There are plenty of people selling other emulators for other platforms secretly if you go looking for them. At the same time I think any of the people buying these are doing it more for the simplicity of the act in comparison to tracking down this stuff on their own. (...in other words they're lazy)

The same way there are tons of bootleg movies on sale on ebay or being sold by litle old chinese ladies walking from subway car to subway car selling Basic Instinct 2 DVDs for 10 bucks right now, even though these same movies can be downloaded for free online if you have a fast connection and know where to look.

 

[WrongEyedJesus]

skeezix Post Today at 10:07 AM

Its actually very easy;

... followed by several million words :lol:

​

As Churchill once said (again paraphrasing):

"I'm writing you a long letter because I don't have time to write you a short one"

 

[skaboy]

skeezix Post Today at 10:07 AM

Its actually very easy;

... followed by several million words :lol:

​

As Churchill once said (again paraphrasing):

"I'm writing you a long letter because I don't have time to write you a short one"

​

Ah, Churchill; the most quotable of British Prime Ministers:

Bessie Braddock: “Sir, you are drunk.”
Churchill: “Madam, you are ugly. In the morning, I shall be sober.”

Nancy Astor: “Sir, if you were my husband, I would give you poison.”
Churchill: “If I were your husband I would take it.”

 

[critical]

skaboy: is it you or an associate that's selling the 'setup files' on ebay, then?

I wondered, because your first post here said:
"I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them."

Then after some discussion you posted:
"I could've just copied a load of stuff without asking here but I wanted to remain above board and not upset any coders, nor deny them any dues."

So presumably you're not just giving this "start up" SD to a mate or something, otherwise the second post wouldn't make much sense.

I notice that there's a new ebay listing now:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GP2X-setup-files-emu...1QQcmdZViewItem

from the same seller as before, but with a modified listing text that includes:
"I have researched the legality of this CD among the GP2X community and can state that this sale is 100% legal. Any "flame" questions or comments will be reported to ebay."

So is it you, then? I notice that the kickstart and TOS roms aren't listed as included any more, which is progress.

I still don't think the listing is compliant however, as the Quake shareware licence has this section (my emphasis):

2. Commercial Use is Prohibited. Under no circumstances shall
you, the end-user, be permitted, allowed or authorized to
commercially exploit the Software, or any portion thereof, such
as a screen display or a screenshot. Neither you nor anyone at your
direction shall do any of the following acts:

a. Rent the Software;

b. Sell the Software;

c. Lease or lend the Software;

d. Offer the Software on a pay-per-play basis;

e. Distribute the Software for money or any other
consideration; or

f. In any other manner and through any medium
whatsoever commercially exploit the Software or use
the Software for any commercial purpose.

 

[skaboy]

skaboy: is it you or an associate that's selling the 'setup files' on ebay, then?

I wondered, because your first post here said:
"I own a Megadrive so I gather I'm allowed to use DrMD and do intend to donate to Reesy as the author. If someone I know also has a Megadrive, can I legally give them a copy of DrMD? I know they could download it themselves but someone has asked me to do a "start up" SD for them."

Then after some discussion you posted:
"I could've just copied a load of stuff without asking here but I wanted to remain above board and not upset any coders, nor deny them any dues."

So presumably you're not just giving this "start up" SD to a mate or something, otherwise the second post wouldn't make much sense.

I notice that there's a new ebay listing now:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GP2X-setup-files-emu...1QQcmdZViewItem

from the same seller as before, but with a modified listing text that includes:
"I have researched the legality of this CD among the GP2X community and can state that this sale is 100% legal. Any "flame" questions or comments will be reported to ebay."

So is it you, then? I notice that the kickstart and TOS roms aren't listed as included any more, which is progress.

I still don't think the listing is compliant however, as the Quake shareware licence has this section (my emphasis):

        2.      Commercial Use is Prohibited.  Under no circumstances shall
        you, the end-user, be permitted, allowed or authorized to
        commercially exploit the Software, or any portion thereof, such
as a screen display or a screenshot.  Neither you nor anyone at your
        direction shall do any of the following acts:

        a.      Rent the Software;

        b.      Sell the Software;

        c.      Lease or lend the Software;

        d.      Offer the Software on a pay-per-play basis;

      e.      Distribute the Software for money or any other
                consideration; or

        f.      In any other manner and through any medium
                whatsoever commercially exploit the Software or use
                the Software for any commercial purpose.

​

Not me.

I've now made an SD for my mate and only put what I / he is allowed on it.

My second post was because the thread had taken a different tack from my original point and I was thinking that if someone was being enterprising on ebay, I could've taken that route and made some money: kind of "I wish I'd never asked".

I can see where you're coming from and there's a coinceidence verging on spooky but I promise you, not me on ebay.